Adding shoulder belts

fordwheelinman

fordwheelinman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2009
Location
Randolph County
As the bronco nears completion, my mind is turning towards adding some a little bit of safety to the rear seat. Now 25 years ago when I was a rollie pollie hoping around the inside of one of these things, I had no fear of seat belts or crashes or any of that. Now that I'm a father, and responsible for 2 human lives, it's found a place in my mind.

The question is what is the "best" way to add shoulder belts to the back seat? There is a 1st Gen explorer around that I could nab the belts out of, but with a giant back window, there isn't a good place to mount them. My first thought is finding some buckets from the junk yard with belts made into them, and then make a bracket to mount them to the floor, but I'm not sure if I have enough room side to side. My second thought is some 4 point harnesses and some sort of frame work to mount the shoulder belts to, but that seems a little expensive, and I'm not sure if I can have just a low "cage" in the cargo area. There are 4 body bolts that I could remove, weld the cage to plates, and then bolt the plates down, but again, not sure if this is an approved way to do it. I don't plan on wheeling it much if any, at least not for the foreseeable future, so a full cage is a bit much for a street driven daily, I'm just looking to secure my boys a little better than the old lap belts. Anyone have any ideas?
 
I've done some looking, and I've come to find that mid 2000's f150 trucks, and some mid 2000's extended cad super duty trucks have integrated seat belts in the front bucket/split bench seats. Anyone have one of those trucks that can get some measurements for me?
 
FYI….lost a friend several years ago in a first gen K5 who had done the late model gun seat with integrated belt conversion.

Very very important to make sure the floor bracing is up to snuff. In the first gen Ks it will rip out and then you are restrained in a flying death trap - or worse yet killed by your safety belt.
 
CarolinaHD said:
3rd row seat from a tahoe/ suburban with integrated belts would work great
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This or maybe envoy/trailblazer 3rd row seats would be a little narrower.

You might just have to go to the junk yard with a tape measure. If there’s no factory upper mounts there’s not enough structure to mount them too and be safe IMO.
 
CarolinaHD said:
3rd row seat from a tahoe/ suburban with integrated belts would work great
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Did not know about those. Never been further back than the front seat of one of those. Except for the one time I rode in the cargo are of one without the third row.
91samurai said:
This or maybe envoy/trailblazer 3rd row seats would be a little narrower.

You might just have to go to the junk yard with a tape measure. If there’s no factory upper mounts there’s not enough structure to mount them too and be safe IMO.
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There isn't any structure, it's window. Unless I do something crazy and go all the way back to the C pillar, which would probably require custom length belts.
 
Ron said:
FYI….lost a friend several years ago in a first gen K5 who had done the late model gun seat with integrated belt conversion.

Very very important to make sure the floor bracing is up to snuff. In the first gen Ks it will rip out and then you are restrained in a flying death trap - or worse yet killed by your safety belt.
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My whole plan from the start has been to remove the factory slider, build my own frame, mount that frame to the seat belt and seat mounting bolts, and then bolt the seat to my frame. I might do some "Roadkill" shiz to a trail rig or beater that only I'll be in, but I'm not taking chances with the family.
 
I had an idea earlier today. But first:
I measured the seat in my BIL's 07 f150. The width I can make work, the height would be close, especially with making a frame, and a way to bolt them down. I need to re-measure the 150 seat a little more closely. I might be able to cut the top down and make it work, then modify the cover/cushion.

Now my idea, is there any reason to not just build my own seat frame and bolt some new retractors and buckles to the seat frame, then just have it upholstered?
 
I measured the seats in my brother's super duty. I think I may go check out a junk yard and grab one to actually set in the thing and see. Still thinking about just designing my own frame and incorporating some brand new retractors and buckles in. Need to price the metal and weigh my options.
 
Still working on this, but I some more information than before. The suburban seat is too wide, by about 3.5"-4".
received_3290086424597305.jpeg

Could I strip it to the frame, chop out 4 inches of the frame in the middle, then put it back together sleeving/reinforcing the seams, and then have the covers narrowed as well. Then build a frame to bolt to this seat, then the factor seat/seat belt mounting holes?

I have also found seat belts made to be used in older cars to convert to shoulder belts, that are designed to be mounted to the floor.
20230129_222808.jpg


Could I buy those, use sandwich plates, or a long plate run across behind the seats, and mounted with body mount bolts, mount the retractors to that plate, then add some frame to my existing seats for the upper guide (essentially creating the tumor looking.growth on that suburban seat) and then pad it and wrap it?

I'm thinking the second option is quicker and cheaper, as the seat will probably run me $250-$350, then paying someone to narrow the cover. I've got some steel plate that I could make mounting plates out of, and some square tube for the tumor mounts, so the second is definitely budget friendly, but the first seems like a cleaner overall look. Now I'm a 100% function over form kind of guy, but I don't want it to look "hacked" together either.

All opinions or other options are welcome.
 
That 2nd belt is basically the same thing that comes in factory vehicles, minus the lap belt part. I would goto the yard and rob a factory belt setup from a car/suv. Just make sure the locking mechanism still works first.

If you are building a frame for the seat to bolt to, what about just getting some 4point harnesses and adding a shoulder harness bar to the frame?

Might also be easier to use 2 buckets. I have seen benches with integrated belts in the Ford Transit, Sprinters
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
That 2nd belt is basically the same thing that comes in factory vehicles, minus the lap belt part. I would goto the yard and rob a factory belt setup from a car/suv. Just make sure the locking mechanism still works first.

If you are building a frame for the seat to bolt to, what about just getting some 4point harnesses and adding a shoulder harness bar to the frame?

Might also be easier to use 2 buckets. I have seen benches with integrated belts in the Ford Transit, Sprinters
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I'd have to find a retractor bolted to the floor from the factory to have them same usable length. I'm sure they make them, but I'm not sure in what, and they may end up being the same money as those new ones, I'll have to do some looking.

If my kids were old/big enough to not need booster seats, I'd be doing a short cage with head rests, and using 4 point harnesses with the seats I have. The harnesses won't work well with booster seats.

The problem with buckets is the same problem with the suburban seat, width, and to some extent height. I've only got between 42"-44" of space between the wheel wells in the back, height I can't remember off the top of my head but I'm one full weekend and a trip to the tag office away from driving it, so I need to figure this out soon.
 
Booster seats are only needed because of the height of a standard shoulder belt. I would argue that a 4pt harness or shoulder belt designed to fit the kid, would eliminate the need for a booster, or atleast a high back.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
Booster seats are only needed because of the height of a standard shoulder belt. I would argue that a 4pt harness or shoulder belt designed to fit the kid, would eliminate the need for a booster, or atleast a high back.
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While I definitely understand your point, I don't have the funds available to pay a lawyer to argue that in court. The youngest is still under the state minimum age of 8 yrs old. The oldest I could get away with.
 
uglyjeepoffroad said:
What he said ^^^^^.
The boosters are for belt positioning.
If I remember correctly later model Broncos had shoulder belts in the rear.
https://www.fullsizebronco.com/cdn-...lsizebronco.com/attachments/image-jpg.167877/
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That is probably in the 94-96 broncos that they made the roofs in a manner that made them not easily removable, if at all, and have adequate structure to hold that mounting point, where my Bronco II wasn't made past the 1990 model year, so finding something factory to meld in, is out.

I suppose if I stripped the headliner out, I could stich in a piece of plate that would support such a thing, but then again I'm not sure if the roof structure that is there would support that either.
 
Ok, didn't realize you were talking about a bronco II. I would do a harness bar and harnesses for smaller kids. Or possibly a 4 pt rollback with belts attached.
 
Is your primary concern avoiding a ticket or true safety?

To be frank, I worry about most of the ideas you've suggested for the latter. I think the amount of engineering that goes into belt anchoring and locating is being heavily under appreciated in this thread.

I just dont want to read a follow up thread in a year or two after an accident where the seat belt deisng contributed to tragedy
 
I was thinking something like this with the shoulder belts attached to the rear down bars. I know this is a full size, this is just for an idea.
9296rollbar.jpg
 
uglyjeepoffroad said:
I was thinking something like this with the shoulder belts attached to the rear down bars. I know this is a full size, this is just for an idea.
9296rollbar.jpg
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That's what I meant by CJ style. Was trying to make sure I understood what you meant by 4 point bar. I thought about doing a short version of that, with the top bar just about level with the top of the seats, and using it to mount the "pivot" part, or even the retractor to, but I don't have a bender, a tig welder, or a desire to cut holes in the floor to weld the bars to the frame since some think that sandwich plating the floor pan, or bolting plates using body mount locations isn't safe enough.
 
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