Alignment help/Death Wobble

skyhighZJ

skyhighZJ

Gov retirement < needs to live
Joined
May 31, 2012
Location
Aberdeen, NC.
Got the Jeep.
It had DW.
Rebuilt the front end to include all new TRE, new Track Bar bushings top and bottom, added weld washers on all TB bolt holes, upper and lower ball joints on both sides, and hub bearing assembly’s on both sides.
Gave it the redneck tape measure alignment and seemed okay but I k ew it wasn’t “right”. Took it in this morning for an alignment and driving it home it’s back to trying to DW when I hit a manhole in the road with the drivers side. Note: it has always seemed that the drivers front corner has been what will cause an issue if it hit a bump on that side compared to if I hit a bump with the passenger side. Can someone look at the printout they gave me and maybe clue me in?? I’m beyond frustrated as this is my DD and want it right and I’m tired of dumping money into it.
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Seems like you covered all bases with your rebuild/new parts.

Only thing I see is the camber on the driver side being off. Possible your axle is bent ? Or your upper left control arm is shot?
 
I guess I should mention this does have a RC 3” lift. The front lowers are fixed RC arms and the uppers are factory. The rear uses all the factory arms with a spacer for the upper link where the Ball Joint mounts to the top of the diff housing.
 
This is a ZJ? What sort of tires/wheels you got? Wheels super offset?

That doesn’t seem like a lot of toe. Maybe bring it in a tad bit more? Half a turn to a full turn on the tie rod? I thought people go up to .25 inch on toe for jeeps. Right now .13 degrees on each side is almost dead ahead.
 
NickMaul said:
This is a ZJ? What sort of tires/wheels you got? Wheels super offset?

That doesn’t seem like a lot of toe. Maybe bring it in a tad bit more? Half a turn to a full turn on the tie rod? I thought people go up to .25 inch on toe for jeeps. Right now .13 degrees on each side is almost dead ahead.
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‘01 (WJ) it has 265’s on it with hardly any offset.
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skyhighZJ said:
I guess I should mention this does have a RC 3” lift. The front lowers are fixed RC arms and the uppers are factory. The rear uses all the factory arms with a spacer for the upper link where the Ball Joint mounts to the top of the diff housing.
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I put the exact same lift kit on my wife's wj years ago and had the same problem. Fought it and fought it for 2 years. All the while it was the wifes daily. I NEVER heard the end of it.

What fixed it for my wifes was long arms. Turns out, Rough Country updated the lift kit with drop control arm brackets. I cant tell you what it is for sure, but it has something to do with lower control arm angles. Rough Country no longer sells a short arm lift larger that a budget boost without drop control arm brackets...
 
NCJeeplover said:
I put the exact same lift kit on my wife's wj years ago and had the same problem. Fought it and fought it for 2 years. All the while it was the wifes daily. I NEVER heard the end of it.

What fixed it for my wifes was long arms. Turns out, Rough Country updated the lift kit with drop control arm brackets. I cant tell you what it is for sure, but it has something to do with lower control arm angles. Rough Country no longer sells a short arm lift larger that a budget boost without drop control arm brackets...
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Well fawk. I’m not paying for long arms! I’ll buy stock suspensions and lower it before I put that kind of money into this thing. It’s just a DD not a wheeler.
 
skyhighZJ said:
Well fawk. I’m not paying for long arms! I’ll buy stock suspensions and lower it before I put that kind of money into this thing. It’s just a DD not a wheeler.
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I would call Rough Country and see if you could get the lower control arm drop brackets. If you tell them you have an older lift and your having these problems they may sent them to you for free. They are familiar with this problem.
 
FWIW... when I bought my Ram I got DW on the way home from picking it up. Over the first year of ownership I did ball joints, TREs, shocks, steering damper, all the normal suspects. It was rare, but never really improved. Bought the truck with stock size BFG ATs on stock wheels.

Fast forward into year 3: my boss at the time bought a brand new 2014 Ram and was taking it in to get lift/wheels/tires so we swapped the take-offs over to mine beforehand. He got the wobble, on a brand new truck mind you, on the way to the upfitter. I've never experienced the wobble again in that truck.
 
Falko said:
FWIW... when I bought my Ram I got DW on the way home from picking it up. Over the first year of ownership I did ball joints, TREs, shocks, steering damper, all the normal suspects. It was rare, but never really improved. Bought the truck with stock size BFG ATs on stock wheels.

Fast forward into year 3: my boss at the time bought a brand new 2014 Ram and was taking it in to get lift/wheels/tires so we swapped the take-offs over to mine beforehand. He got the wobble, on a brand new truck mind you, on the way to the upfitter. I've never experienced the wobble again in that truck.
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Well shit
 
Called rough country. They don’t offer drop brackets for up to a 4” kit. Replaced the upper control arms and the bushings on the axle side today as well. LCA are tight and no bushing play. Test drive: DW.
I turned the toe in a 1/2 turn and made it worse. So it was at least predictable prior to the alignment which was towed out a hair so I did that and took another test drive. It’s better but not “fixed” trying to decipher what it means if it likes being towed out
 
Seems like you're getting near the end of the options list. DW is a function of low lateral stifness. Assuming you did everything you listed off correctly with good parts the only other causes could be:

- a wonky tire
- a mega clapped steering box
- loose steering box bolts
- loose trackbar bracket bolts
- unibody crack
 
Falko said:
- a wonky tire
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I could be the 1:1000000 outlier, but actually got DW in my Commando a couple times! Long story of idiocy short... improper/no BALANCE caused it.
While not as violent as say... a longarm TJ/XJ on tons with 40's, it skared the crap outta me in heavy in-town traffic!
 
I’m thinking it actually may be a tire issue as it seems speed related but it is still weird that it favors being towed out on the alignment. Everything else in the front end has been replaced with moog TRE and the bearings were timken, new bushings/sleeves in the Trackbar from JKS. I have had the wife work the wheel back and forth running not running on the ground off the ground. I can see no movement anywhere and I have gone back over every damn nut and bolt and verified torque.
 
skyhighZJ said:
I’m thinking it actually may be a tire issue as it seems speed related but it is still weird that it favors being towed out on the alignment. Everything else in the front end has been replaced with moog TRE and the bearings were timken, new bushings/sleeves in the Trackbar from JKS. I have had the wife work the wheel back and forth running not running on the ground off the ground. I can see no movement anywhere and I have gone back over every damn nut and bolt and verified torque.
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I literally just got back from Discount Tire getting new tires on my DD WJ.
The tires I replaced had like 500 miles on them. Had a vibration that started around 30 and all the way up to 65. It was certainly not DW, but definitely more than what would be acceptable. If you hit a pot hole or uneven spot it would get a bit squirrely.
Nothing loose in the front end. TB tight, TRE, etc all good. Had the tires balanced locally. No change. Tires smooth and no obvious signs of damage or anything. The WJ sat for a while and I suspect either a nasty flatspot was present somehere or a broken cord.
Replaced tires- she smooth as the top of your foot now.
 
Jody Treadway said:
I literally just got back from Discount Tire getting new tires on my DD WJ.
The tires I replaced had like 500 miles on them. Had a vibration that started around 30 and all the way up to 65. It was certainly not DW, but definitely more than what would be acceptable. If you hit a pot hole or uneven spot it would get a bit squirrely.
Nothing loose in the front end. TB tight, TRE, etc all good. Had the tires balanced locally. No change. Tires smooth and no obvious signs of damage or anything. The WJ sat for a while and I suspect either a nasty flatspot was present somehere or a broken cord.
Replaced tires- she smooth as the top of your foot now.
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Well I guess I need to get onto finding tires for this thing. I’m just sick of spending money on it...
 
Jody Treadway said:
See if anyone local has a set of JK/JL/JT OEM takeoffs. Same BP and would be 31". Would be a cheap way to verify
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Stopped by the old off road shop I used to haunt back when I was stationed here before. I’ve kept in touch but haven’t been back to the actual shop since I moved back. Mr. Brown scored me some take off rims and good year wranglers for free.99 and tossed a new bilstein stabilizer in my hands too. Took off the RC dual stabilizer that was on it put the bilstein in the stock location. Mounted the tires, gave the tie rod a 3/4 twist to bring the toe back in (I had towed it out cause it seemed the only way it would prevent full potato mode). Took it for a test drive preparing for the worst and to my surprise it was the smoothest this thing has ever driven. Fingers crossed it’s cured.
He said I should maybe look into adjustable lowers to correct the caster on the drivers side but I’m gonna run it and see how it does. Tomorrow’s trip to work will be the test. That road sucks. Fingers crossed.
 
Drive to work this morning was uneventful took the “range road” to work like always and was able to go faster than 50mph. It was nice and I’m sure the other travelers appreciated me not being a road plug. Seems to be good but now that I’m not solely focusing on what the front is doing I can tell the rear needs bushing too. Got some small clunks and squeaks. Lol. At least my hands aren’t sore from death gripping the wheel in anticipation of a DW.
J ust
E mpty
E very
P ocket
:lol:
 
skyhighZJ said:
Drive to work this morning was uneventful took the “range road” to work like always and was able to go faster than 50mph. It was nice and I’m sure the other travelers appreciated me not being a road plug. Seems to be good but now that I’m not solely focusing on what the front is doing I can tell the rear needs bushing too. Got some small clunks and squeaks. Lol. At least my hands aren’t sore from death gripping the wheel in anticipation of a DW.
J ust
E mpty
E very
P ocket
:lol:
Click to expand...

I’m about to do the rear A arm ball joint on mine today. That thing has been clunking for a long time now SMH.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
grapehead said:
Just for fun (and proper diagnosis for posterity) maybe swap the steering stabilizer back and see if DW returns.
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I would but I got pissed trying to get the bracket and absorbers off the axle cause the nuts were obviously tightened by He-Man using an adjustable wrench and I used the cutoff wheel for expedited removal.
 
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