Axle Wrap is destroying my jeep one part at a time! HELP!

Erik

Erik

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2005
Location
Wilmington, NC
my front is axle wrapping HORRIBLY with the XJ springs....

swapping to different springs isn't an option at this time... the XJ's ride on the street great and they flex great....

kodak beat my butt, both times i tried it.... and if it wasn't for axle wrap, i think i would have been fine..... (made it once, but i'm guessing the shackles were inverted when i did it and the driveshaft just had not fallen out yet)

so... what can i do to fix this? i've never seen an anti-wrap bar up front..... does anyone do this or is their a better way? i didn't have any spring clamps on the leafs and i know that was ONE of the reasons the axle was wrapping so bad but i know that spring clamps alone will not solve my problem.


shackles inverted....

ai47.photobucket.com_albums_f175_efrancin_ChadsOffRoad136.jpg


aaaand after pulling apart, the driveshaft hanging out like a limp.... ummm... driveshaft.....

ai47.photobucket.com_albums_f175_efrancin_ChadsOffRoad147.jpg



-Erik <--- wants to resolve this AND redo my track bar bracketry before next weekend and drive to UF again!
 
BTW, from that first pic, you need a clamp or another full length leaf or you're going to bend/break that main. I've done 4 or 5 myself :(
 
you can do what was done above, or you can still run a trackbar just like you would in the rear... theres just more things to get in the way there, so location is a lil more of an issue
 
Take a look at a 79ish toyota. There is a bar running from the axle to the crossmember. Same principal but you will need heims and a shakle so you can flex out completly. You will need a cross member which you can skid the oil pan and transmission with ++++ The limiting strap is something I never thought of....Cool if it works. Does that limit axle drop?
 
you can always put a stop behind the shackle to keep it from inverting. I plan on doing that on the rear of mine. The last time I was a tellico, I bent a rear spring trying to back off the can opener at helicopter pad because my tire was wedged. It won't help your wrap problem though.
 
Rubicoon said:
Take a look at a 79ish toyota. There is a bar running from the axle to the crossmember. Same principal but you will need heims and a shakle so you can flex out completly. You will need a cross member which you can skid the oil pan and transmission with ++++ The limiting strap is something I never thought of....Cool if it works. Does that limit axle drop?
Click to expand...
Actually any stock solid axle yota. The yota one limits front articulation a bit, and when the bushings wear out it makes painc braking even more panicky when the truck starts to head for the ditch! (Which is the reason it's there). It'd be a great idea if you could get it to not limit your articulation.
 
ok guys thanks a lot for all the suggestions!

looks like what i'm going to TRY is to simply get a bunch of spring clamps (where can i buy them?) and weld on some sort of shackle stop. hopefully the spring clamps will make the front end flex less which will work the rear more (rear needs more movement imo) and will help add some strength to that weak main xj leaf so the axle wrap can't take over.... and if it does, although i may still drop a shaft, i wouldn't invert a shackle thanks to the stops.....

anyone running any sort of anti-wrap perch up front? not sure what to do about the cast but it would be pretty simple to put a perch on the passenger side... 1 would be be better than none, right? or not so much......

-Erik <--- trying to go back this weekend
 
just put some coilovers on it! thatll fix everything! and then drink one of these:beer:
 
Erik said:
looks like what i'm going to TRY is to simply get a bunch of spring clamps (where can i buy them?)
Click to expand...

Easiest way is to go to Lowe's or HD and get a length of 1" flat stock. Tack one end to the spring, wrap around spring, cut flat stock and weld to itself. IMO you still need full length main helpers. Cut the eyes off of XJ mains or S10 mains. The second leaf on the stock XJs just dosen't come far enough toward the small eye end and WILL present problems at some point the way you like to flex it :driver:
 
Longer shackles would cure the inversion of the shackles. My brain is too friend to think about the axle wrap.
 
Shackle reversal may solve your problem. Your Front shackle set-up is, is letting the spring be pulled backwards but the hard mounted Spring hanger on the rear isn't giving and thus bending your springs.

With the Spring mount up front, your spring pack won't be able to swing backwards.

Now, I AM NOT SAYING that Shackle reversal stops Spring Wrap. Just saying that might help your issue that I see happening in the photo.
 
IMHO, it's NOT "wrap" that fried your springs... but "bumping" a little too hard into something taller than your tires can roll over...

BTDT :shaking:

You can also run the winch cable down to diff (cover?) and limit the front from unloading while climbing...
 
Or you could simply weld a piece of metal behind your shackle and never have to worry about them inverting again.
 
As stated in the BamBar article, the longer the truss the better it will work. You will need some serious room like Brent said, and for the front application that this thread is supposed to address, there ain't much room up there. FWIW, my fix works, is CHEAP and easy to install, meets all my engineering requirements :)
 
"Longer shackles would cure the inversion of the shackles."

no, this would only make the problem worse, as your shackle would have more leverage on the spring. not only that but the shackle will hang down further, thus hitting on more obstacles. (ask me how i know this) shackle reversal will cure this, but you will have drive shaft issues. (again, ask me how i know) currently im still working on a driveshaft issue, probably gonna do ag. PTO shaft. btw, this is jason, i met you (erik) on the side of kodak, probably right after your u-joint cap loss.

anyway, good luck and keep us posted

jason
 
It's really just geometry. Longer shackles would fix it. Has to do with arc lengths and radii. The clearance issue is a good point, but the upper mount could be higher in the framerail if one so desired. Would probably help with frontend float a little too.
I don't understand how the shackle would have more leverage on the spring.

Regardless, just weld a chunk behind each shackle, and make a cool traction bar.
 
guffey24 said:
I have looked at this and, instead of running a trac bar
I am gonna build one of these
any pros and cons to this idea
http://www.jeepaholics.com/tech/bambar/
Click to expand...
I don't see much of a difference in this set up vs. a traditional antiwrap bar. If you build the antiwrap with a shackle on frame end with a flex joint at the frame mount, you have no binding. My 2c
 
Cable

I saw one setup on the net where the person used steel cable. IIRC it was setup right over top of the spring on both sides. I doubt it works as well as other setups, but looked interesting.
 
Here's an approach to an anti-wrap bar up front. Granted, this is on a 3-link, but I think the idea converts somewhat:
ai212.photobucket.com_albums_cc116_336wheeler_unknown_3.jpg


My apologies for the severe crapiness of the picture; I took it with my cell phone out of a JP magazine. Anyways, he has the top ends about where your shackle hangers would be, and a heim on the axle end. You'd have to fab up some kind of crossmember in-between your shackle hangers... and heims on all 3 points would probably be more affective with a leaf set-up. The notion of what it would do when the shackles compressing as far as limiting travel baffle me for what it would do, since it was set up for a 3 link that only sees side-to-side articulation instead of some front-to-back also. I'm not too sure what I'd do in your situation, but I thought I would pass the idea long. It's one of the WMS creations...
 
Shackle reversal with proper length/angled shackles will cure the inverting shackle problem and add another leaf to the top of the spring pack with clamps to help with wrap.

Also, a long travel front driveshaft out of square tubing or pto shaft to eliminate the driveshaft pulling apart.

I would run a regular triangulated traction bar with shackle before I would run a bam-bar. I can't imagine there being enough over diff clearance in the front...
 
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