%^%%ing Bearings. Does heating them work.

atblis

New Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2006
Location
SW VA
Well, I got the bearings off of the carrier and pinion for the D44 and the D30.

A few things I've discovered.
  • I figured the bearing separator tool would be the magic trick, but it proved almost worthless on the carrier.
  • Two jaw puller works with a little modification. Using a big C clamp to keep it from slipping out works wonder.
  • It is impossible to remove the bearings without destroying them.
  • A 6" seperator would be better than the 4.5". Had to use this on the pinion.
  • Impact guns are your friend.
A few Questions.
  • Are pinion locating shims and preload shims the same size? I ask because I think a few things got shuffled in the first disassembly. The pinion is marked +0 so...and I didn't find any shims I think.
  • How do you get the inner race out without destroying the oil baffle?
  • Does heating bearings for install work (basically do I really need to use a hydraulic press)?
  • Anybody used the Alloy USA install kits? Do they come with races for the bearings and inner seals?
 
You probably do need a press, or you can use a hammer and pipe to 'pound' them on.

This is why shops charge what they do to do the job :)
 
Heating the bearings in an oven works. Low Heat - 200 degrees.

WD-40 - A flat block of aluminum - DBH - Can get you by without a shop press. Just make sure you hit the bearing dead on. On the pinion...... If you have a large vise + clamshell or a piece of pipe the right diameter you can hang the pinion gear side up in the air/spline side down (in the vise). Put the pipe or clamshell on bearing (the solid inner part - not the cage) and tap it down with a DBH (the pipe or clamshell will be against the vise). Use WD40 on Pinion shaft and inside bearing.

Not 100% sure on the inner race/ baffle you're talking about but on my 98 TJ I used a brass drift to knock out all pinion bearing races. I uses the old bearing race + aluminum block to seat the new one.
 
Shops

Yeah, for what a shop wants I can actually go out and buy a halfway decent shop press. The tool investment actually hasn't been that bad so far.

I have the book from Randy's Ring and Pinion, it says the heating method works well. I was just wondering how well.

Also,

The old pinion gear is marked +0 (in the housing I am using)
The new pinion gear is marked +4 (from the housing the gears came in)

I didn't find any shims behind the old pinion race, but I think I might have screwed up.

If I am reading this correctly, I need to add .004" worth of shims behind the new inner race. Is this correct.
 
Don't be soo literal on what the book says as far as pinion markings, just get some shims in there, check the backlash and the paint pattern

You can do all the calculations you want but the truth is in the pattern. I would highly recommend setup bearings because you prolly won't get it right the first time

Also as far as getting the old bearings off, its really hard not to ruin them, usually i just cut off the cage and air hammer the inner part off the carrier

The bearing splitter works good if its a quality one and you use it in a press or with a bar puller, but still its almost impossible to not ruin the bearings getting them off, that why you need the setup bearings

On the Dana 44 all you need is the carrier set up bearings because you don't have to shim under the pinion bearing. On the Dana 30 the shims are under the races on the carrier(i think) put the pinion is shimmed under the inner bearing

I have setup bearings for just about every rear end, i always use timken bearings so i have timken bearings for setup use. Just buy some extra bearings and dremel out the inside until they slide right on( i takes awhile)

Also get a few pinion nuts and grind off the top of them where they are crimped, it will let you run the nut down way easier and faster for setup purposes and not damage the threads on the pinion(as me how i know!)

Brendan Burke
Performance Innovation
910-515-4762
 
Dana 44

No shims under the inner race on the D44? I just knocked it out tonight, and it had shims under it? No baffle though.

I might not be remembering correctly, but I thought the Dana 30 also had shims under the inner race.

So is this correct?

Dana 30 pinion depth is set by shims between the pinion gear and the inner pinion bearing.

Dana 44 pinion depth is set by shims under the inner pinion bearing race.
 
FYI...with the right tools you can easly pull the bearings off the carrier in less than a minute....

Since you cant seem to get the bearing off without distroying them...i hope you are luckly... Gears dont often set up perfect on the first try

Goodluck
Seth
 
Yeah

Since I got the two jaw puller modded, have been using the large C clamp, and my impact gun, the bearings actually come of pretty quick now.
The problem I am having with destroying the bearings, is that for me to get my two jaw puller on the inner race, I must remove the cage and rollers. I could see where if I had the correct puller it could be removed without damaging it.
I'll be making setup bearings!
Is this correct?
I'll need two setup carrier bearings for the 44, but not for the inner pinion bearing because it doesn't use shims under it.
I'll need two setup carrier bearings and a setup inner pinion
bearing for the Dana 30 as the pinion depth is set by shims between the inner bearing and the pinion gear.
 
isn;t the dana 30 carrier shims under the races so you don't have to pull the bearings off to adjust the backlash?

If so then you don't need carrier setup bearings

Brendan
 
Nope

The carrier shims are between the bearing and the carrier in either case (44 or 30).

The pinion depth shims are what I am wondering about. The D44 definitely had shims underneath the inner race.
 
You can do all the calculations you want but the truth is in the pattern. I would highly recommend setup bearings because you prolly won't get it right the first time
Click to expand...
imo, taking measurements with the proper tools is a much more accurate way of doing things. with a trained eye, you can certainly set one up well going from the pattern only. it's not nearly as exact as taking the measurements though.
On the Dana 44 all you need is the carrier set up bearings because you don't have to shim under the pinion bearing.
Click to expand...
huh? so how are you setting proper pinion depth then?

in addition to heating bearings in the oven, you can also throw your pinion and carrier into the freezer for a while.
 
Yeah, the oven/freezer method works great for final assembly. Also, you can use a chisel (not just a wood chisel) to get some space between the bearing and the carrier, and then you can get the splitter under there. I have found splitters to generally only be worthwhile once the bearing is started and there is a gap.
 
Dana 44

Dana44
I am under the impression that the pinion depth on the D44 is set by the location of the inner pinion race. I've already knocked out that inner race, and there were a few shims underneath it. The inner pinion bearing did not have any shims underneath it.

Dana 30
I don't remember any shims under the Dana 30 inner race, but that's the very first axle I've ever disassembled so... I'll pull apart the other D30 tonight and see what's in there.

I found the race punches. They vary widely in price.
50 bucks was the best I found. So far I've been able to use the two jaw puller and cold chisel. Haven't gouged anything yet AFAICT.
http://www.amazon.com/Mayhew-4-pc-Bearing-Race-Punch/dp/B000E91J16/ref=sr_1_3/103-1099438-8834257?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1177332438&sr=8-3
 
We always use a press and never have any trouble getting the bearings off without damage. We use setup bearings for the setup process because as already stated gears rarely ever set up right on the first try. If you do not destroy the carrier bearings or the outer pinion bearing it would be a good idea to make some setup bearings first. Simply grind out the inside Diameter with a die grinder until they slip on and off without to much trouble.

Pinion depth is set by the shims under inner pinion race in the housing on a dana 44.

Pinion depth on a Dana 30 if I remember correctly is set by shiming under the inner bearing on the pinion itself.

I just bought a set of brass punches to use on my races. They were less then 20 dollars. I have no clue where I got them it was a few years ago.
 
sha_ba_do_bang said:
On the Dana 44 all you need is the carrier set up bearings because you don't have to shim under the pinion bearing.
Click to expand...

This is not entirely accurate.

You do need a set up race for the dana 44 because the pinion depth is determined by shims under the inner race. You simply use a belt sander to sand the outside of the race until will go in and out by hand.

To get the proper preload on the poinion bearing you a;so need a setup bearing for the outer bearing. The preload is determined by the amount of shims under this bearing.

Well that is how the Dana 44 I am working on right now works anyway.
 
I am under the impression that the pinion depth on the D44 is set by the location of the inner pinion race
Click to expand...
correct. i thought you were saying there was no need for shims at all for the pinion.

carry on...:lol:
 
getting the race out isn't nearly as tough as getting the bearings off, i wouldn't really worry about the setup race

also the outer pinion bearing taps right off the pinion bearing with a deadblow hammer

I use the least amount of setup stuff thats posssible, think about having everything lose in there when your setting it up, (carrier bearings, pinion race, pinon bearing) not good for repeatability when you press all the new bearings on

Brendan
 
sha_ba_do_bang said:
getting the race out isn't nearly as tough as getting the bearings off, i wouldn't really worry about the setup race
also the outer pinion bearing taps right off the pinion bearing with a deadblow hammer
I use the least amount of setup stuff thats posssible, think about having everything lose in there when your setting it up, (carrier bearings, pinion race, pinon bearing) not good for repeatability when you press all the new bearings on
Brendan
Click to expand...

Makes sense to me.

I use a setup race because I do not have a good way to pull the race out everytime other then a brass punch and a hammer. Simply reaching in and pulling it out by hand is the best way for me and my shop set up.
 
Well guys

I don't believe there's any shims between the pinion gear and the inner pinion bearing on the Dana 30. It appears that the D30 and the D44 are setup exactly the same. There's an oil slinger, but no shims. The pinion depth shims were underneath the inner pinion bearing race. No need for a inner pinion setup bearing.
 
I have clam shell pullers, But I have found knocking
the cage and bearing off, A dremel tool with cut-
off wheel is the easiest, Just grind a little grove
on the race and pop with a cheisel, slides rite off.
Works Great on axle bearings. Agree on the setup
bearings, no substitute.
 
Yep

That's a good article, thanks for the link.

I basically had to do the same thing, except instead of cutting the inner part off, I could get a modified 2 jaw puller on it (used a file to make it fit). There are two grooves in the carrier that let you get a two jaw puller under the bearing. My puller couldn't clear the cage and all, so that's why I had to cut off the outer parts of the bearing.

Actually, since I've done it a few times now, getting the bearings off isn't hard at all.

The chisel thing works great for the wheel bearings.

Problem I am having now is that I don't really want to put narrow track axles underneath my Cj5. To proceed or not? I have a Scout D44 sitting in the yard.
 
I know I am getting in on this late, but IMO there is no substitute for clamshell pullers(like the ones from Randys and others). Just make sure you put the race on the bearing and you can remove it every time without destroying it. They are pricey, but pretty much pay for themselves with one installation. I also find that with a good quality gear set, they will set up with factory shims well over 1/2 the time(for me anyway)
Michael
 
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