Alignment?

53flattie

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Location
Easley, SC
I have a 2015 Tundra, getting ready to get new tires. The tire shop suggested an alignment at the same time the tires are installed, which got me to thinking...

If my truck has never been in a wreck, never been wheeled, never smashed into a curb or anything like that - why would the alignment be any different than when the truck left the factory 50K miles ago? I don’t think there’s anything that can “wear” to cause a vehicle to be out of alignment - right?

Am I missing something? I hate to pay $100 (or whatever it is) only to have them put it on an alignment machine and determine that it doesn’t need any adjustment (and I’m certain I’d still be paying).


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I have ran 3 sets of tires on my Camry since owning it, I have never had it aligned. My last set of tires got 60k and still could have went further.
Unless there is damage up front, or I replace something steering related I don’t mess with it.
 
Pot holes, curbs, bad roads, any thing like that, can knock the alignment out. But a bigger question is, How did the old set of tires wear? Does the steering wheel pull left or right? Did the tires wear even, or crooked? There's the Answer!
 
Some places won't honor mileage claims if you didn't get an alignment.
 
I don't understand how hitting a pot hole would "knock" an alignment out.. I mean the tre's are threaded in and then locked down, how would that shift position? I could see if it bent something, but really bumping into stuff, I don't see it changing the alignment.. lifetime alignment ftw if it's still offered places though.. it's not much over $160 unless they came up in price.. Firestone used to be the goto back a decade or two or so ago..
 
if your old tires are worn even the don't worry about it. if they are choppy, cupped, worn to the inside or the outside then have an alignment.
 
At our shop we offer a free alignment check with purchase of a set of tires. The factory setting is normally close but can be adjusted to get better wear. We try to get the camber closer to 0* and toe closer to the spec. My 03 4runner gets around 90k out of a set of tires. 289k on the clock and only on third set!
 
a_kelley said:
I don't understand how hitting a pot hole would "knock" an alignment out.. I mean the tre's are threaded in and then locked down, how would that shift position?
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This was my thought as well.

My current tires have worn very well (50K miles on BFG AT's), no pulling side-to-side. I'm going to pass on the alignment. Thanks guys!



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a_kelley said:
I don't understand how hitting a pot hole would "knock" an alignment out.. I mean the tre's are threaded in and then locked down, how would that shift position? I could see if it bent something, but really bumping into stuff, I don't see it changing the alignment.. lifetime alignment ftw if it's still offered places though.. it's not much over $160 unless they came up in price.. Firestone used to be the goto back a decade or two or so ago..
Click to expand...
Tie rods not so much, but I have seen eccentric adjusters move with hard enough hits. On older fords like 60s and 70s mustangs cougars and fairlanes youre supposed to replace the eccentrics with lock out plates or tack weld them if you autocross because hard cornering is enough to cause the eccentric adjusters to move.

If its not wearing old tires I wouldn't worry too much about it, but another thing to consider is how close was it from the factory. I dont know how much of this is true, because I've never been in an assembly plant but the Hunter rep who installed our alignment machine at work said gm used to pull one out of every few thousand trucks off the line to check alignment and the rest got set to that spec. Gm trucks have a plastic plug that locks out the caster/camber adjustment. You have to pop it out to adjust them. The plug sets the stock setting on the adjuster so that could be how its done.

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specifically because its 15 Tundra...if its 4wd it needs to be aligned.
Period.

Toyota redid my 15 tundra CM 3 times during the first 60k and I had an independent shop redo it when I changed the front struts and went to larger tires.
Its a coil sprung front independent front. As the spring fatigues and settles the angle shifts and has to be compensated for.

You are correct that toe doesnt move much, spring settle will change things
 
Ron said:
specifically because its 15 Tundra...if its 4wd it needs to be aligned.
Period.

Toyota redid my 15 tundra CM 3 times during the first 60k and I had an independent shop redo it when I changed the front struts and went to larger tires.
Its a coil sprung front independent front. As the spring fatigues and settles the angle shifts and has to be compensated for.

You are correct that toe doesnt move much, spring settle will change things
Click to expand...

Interesting. That’s the first reasonable explanation of the need to align that I’ve heard. And it makes sense.

Mine is a 4x4 CM also.

I just wish I could trust the dealership to tell me if they put it on the machine and it doesn’t need adjustment (and not charge me). Unfortunately, I don’t think that would ever happen...


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Yep, there are two sources that out-of-alignment come from. Hard wear and tear - potholes, knocking curbs etc - and suspension settling. Any IFS/IRS can be susceptible to the latter. Now, if you've been 50k and its wearing really even, that argues it hasn't been a problem... yet...
And sometimes the OE specs for camber/caster are not the most friendly for tire wear. Mazda for instance tends to set their care w/ steep camber in the rear b/c it gives great handling when you take corners like Mario Andretti. and guess what, the tires wear like shit. But if you get it aligned and specifically tell them, no, get it close to 0, please, you can save your tires. Unfortunately it cost me a lot of money in badly worn tires to learn this.

There are lots of opiniosn on this as a thing to do or not and good arguments on both sides. IMO, if you're really going to keep the vehicle a long time, then its worth it, and even worth considering the "lifetime" deal from Firestone. The cost is ~20% of the cost of a set of tires. So, if it gets you 20% more lifetime it was a win.
But if you're gonna dump the truck in 2 years then why bother.
 
53flattie said:
Interesting. That’s the first reasonable explanation of the need to align that I’ve heard. And it makes sense.

Mine is a 4x4 CM also.

I just wish I could trust the dealership to tell me if they put it on the machine and it doesn’t need adjustment (and not charge me). Unfortunately, I don’t think that would ever happen...


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Click to expand...

There are 4 eccentric cam adjusters on the front of your truck. All can easily be reached by laying on the ground without s jack. Take a piece of chalk and make a line from the adjustment Mark to the rail. If they tell you they sdjusted anything crawl under and verify.
 
I have seen plenty of new vehicles come straight from factory/dealer with shit alignment. Also consider all your suspension components (including steering rack) are mounted with rubber bushings. The bushing may still be tight with no play, but they can sag or compress from being loaded over time/mileage putting the component in a different location than 3 years ago.
 
53flattie said:
If my truck has never been in a wreck, never been wheeled, never smashed into a curb or anything like that - why would the alignment be any different than when the truck left the factory 50K miles ago? I don’t think there’s anything that can “wear” to cause a vehicle to be out of alignment - right?
Click to expand...
Every single bump, vibration, turning, braking, or acceleration input puts a load on your steering components. The lock nuts generally hold things in place, but due to a few large hits, or millions of small impulses, things change over time. Its kinda like a really weak impact hitting a nut or bolt the entire time you are driving. The nut will only move if the force exceeds the friction between the threads and locknut and steering components, and generally these forces are quick impulses, not sustained, so nothing moves. For a 3/4"-16 thread like on an old school tie-rod, the angle on the thread works out to a force ratio of about 37:1. In other words, a 37 pound force axially down the shaft translates to about 1 pound of force trying to rotate the nut on the thread (it's actually a much higher ratio due to friction). Not a huge deal, but with enough of those little impulses and a few big hits, thing can change. The IFS adjustments are more prone to moving, since they rely primarily on friction to lock things in place.

With that said, I don't get an alignment unless there is a compelling reason to. Tires have a good way of telling the story, and mine are usually complaining about hard cornering or acceleration. While @cbjeeper
cbjeeper said:
gets around 90k out of a set of tires
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I'm lucky to get 30k out of a set. :burnout:
 
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