Bug-out Home Build and Solar power?

hunterdan

hunterdan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2009
Location
Morganton,NC
Hello again,

I really appreciate the advice on the road we hope to use as access to our future home. I have some new questions and hope to hear some more of the good advice I've found here.

OK, we were living in a doublewide that was 2000 sq. ft. with 4 br and 3 bath. We decided that it was bigger than we needed and sold the place just recently. We are currently staying at a relatives rental and are planning to build a smaller simple home in the 1500 sq. ft range. We are looking to build a 28x28 walkout basement with a 28x28 upper floor. The roof will be a shed style roof with 1 -8' and 1-14+/-' tall wall.
We figured the 1 pitch style roof would be easier to build,maintain and install solar if we decide on it.

For water were doing a well and have been looking into the on demand tankless water heater system to save power if going solar.... but for power we are undecided. My wife and I added up our average power bill of 250+ x 12 months x 10 years and found out we will be paying around 30,000 every ten years for power forever. We looked into solar a little and it looks like with a smaller home we could set up for solar with around 12-15000. It also seems like panels last longer these days like around 20-25 years before replacing.

Any info regarding solar power or managing a home build as a self-contractor would be greatly appreciated. We just don't see the point of hiring a contractor since I have some building experience and there are many subs looking for employment... I'd rather save some dough and help some fellow builders out than pay a contractor.
If your in the Morganton area and have framing skills,electrical,plumbing feel free to contact me here or
at 828-202-6744

Thanks, Dan
 
If your house doesn't have easy access to gas for the tank less water heater then I'd just get a regular one unless you plan on using gas for other appliances. I'd also look into a outdoor wood furnace. You can run them year round to keep water warm and only use a stick or two a day when it's warmer.

Also consider geothermal heating and cooling.
Most people's highest expense on electric bill is heating and cooling so if you can cut that down to nothing the bill will decrease.
Also don't compare your current power bill with what yours will be. Depending on how you build your house will have a lot to do with that.
A shed roof will have a high side and a low there will be alot of heat hell on the high side that you have to heat before the heat gets to the living area
 
hunterdan said:
average power bill of 250+ x 12 months
Click to expand...

:eek:

I don't think we have ever had a total energy expenditure that was that high.

Solar hot water, maybe? I can see that working (even just to raise the inlet temp on a small elect WH) a hell of a lot better than an electric on-demand powered by PV. There are a lot of hypotheticals figuring into that, though. Probably going to take some experimentation on your part.

There are trade-offs in your initial design concept to consider, too. Single pitch angled to the south is good for photovoltaics, but means you'll have a big north-facing wall that doesn't do much for you. A big south-facing wall with more glass and a deep overhang will catch lots of light in the winter (free heat), but little/no direct sunlight in the summer (b/c overhang and sun is 80* altitude). Pair that with a big brick floor and/or fireplace, and you get a bunch of mass to help stabilize interior temperatures year-round.

If you have some pasture/field with a south-facing exposure, you might consider putting PV panels out there instead of on the house. You could get a bigger array (or start small and upsize as you go) than if you put it on top of the house.

There are no right/wrong answers with something like this - just trade-offs between one priority and another.
 
We hired a GC to get us through rough in inspection, then subbed or did work ourselves for the rest. It kept us from having to file all the plans, pull permits, etc, and allowed someone to watch over the really important stuff. I was working full time and my fiancé/wife was in school so we couldn't be there.

No advice to give on the solar but we have a gas tank less water heater and really like it. Just get it as close to your master bath/shower as possible so you don't have to wait for hot water in the morning.
 
The road will be manageable for a propane delivery. We were thinking the tankless water heater and the stove would be gas. I read on a solar site that the highest user in a home of power is anything with an element like hot water heaters and stoves...
We are planning for an outdoor furnace but did not intend to hook it to the water supply. My father in law has one and loves it during the winter but is tired of splitting wood by spring. I figure I would rather depend on the furnace during the winter for heat as I have lots of seasoned wood and plenty trees for many winters...Lord willing.

I don't think I will use much hot water since we use paper plates and Dixie cups and rarely bathe:)
 
The build of the house will do a lot for heating/cooling. When I build, I want a walkout basement as well. I plan on having a wood burning fireplace in the living room and a woodstove in the basement. I also plan on building all my exterior walls with 2x6s to maximize insulation. I may look into the outdoor wood furnace to run hot water and also put water lines in the concrete in the basement to keep that floor warm in the winter.
 
There is a solar water heater setup. I cant comment on how it works, just had a solar guy I trust tell me about it, that is supposedly the most efficient solar product on the market. ROI <12 months if he i to be believed.

I routinely have those $250 power bills that Shawn just freaked out about, but I couldnt imagine it on he size home you are building.

Supposedly new PV cell technology is right around the corner that will cut solar's costs by a factor of 3-4. Il believe it when I see it, but again a trusted big wig in the solar industry says Ill see it before 12/31/17.
 
Lots of good info. here thanks...
Believe it or not my power bills were 3-350 summer and 4-450 in dead winter with a heat pump. I installed an insulated roof with the 2" Styrofoam sheeting under aluminum pans. Then installed all new double hung windows. That cut the power bills to 175-200 summer and 2-250 winter.
I intend on doing the roof on our future home with the same Styrofoam and aluminum system. The one pitch roof was to give a bigger feel due to small 28x28 dimensions. I also intend to do a lean to on the high wall that would cover a porch.

As far as heating we planned on a fireplace upstairs and a wood stove in the basement initially but after hearing so many good things about outdoor furnaces decided on that and a fireplace for looks and enjoyment. With the outdoor furnace wood equals free heat and nothing that can break:)
For AC we were planning on using heat pump window unit. We had one in the past when our outdoor unit went out like it always did. The one we borrowed never gave trouble and our power bills were greatly reduced compared to the outdoor unit. I know the heat pump will look a little redneck hanging out the window so maybe we will go for one of the roll to any room types.

If the open end of the basement faces the north and it is shaded by a patio would I even need to cool it?
 
Another thing to consider is what face do you plan on building. Is it on a hill, north or south faced. How open is it. What's the elevation. My parents have used their AC maybe 10 days In 16 years because of elevation and shade that is given by the near by trees. They also get a slight breeze almost every afternoon so the house will stay about 68-72 from 2pm to dark until it gets over 90 outside
 
Also I believe NC code calls for a mandatory heat source on new construction, wood heat does not qualify. You might want to look at a mini split system. Could heat and cool if needed and mounted higher on the high loft wall wouldn't be noticed. I'm also imagining this house as a very open plan with a single bedroom and bath to one side
 
I think solar is a good back up but not ideal for primary power if electric is available. By the time you start to break even from your initial investment after several years then its time to drop several thousand on replacing your battery bank. And the cycle continues every 5-7 years.
 
Yep, Kitchen in one corner open to living room and 1 Master bed and bath on the other side. Basement would be 2br's on one side for the kids and other half would be laundry,man cave/prepper stuff.

Property is low lying and just north of Morganton. There is a high ridge on one side that runs out into the bottom land. In that bottom we intend to build up on the side of that lower ridge area where there are some fingers.We will cut into the slope for the walk in basement. It is not very open land. It has lots of old growth timber. It's the kind of woods that you can walk through because it has not been cut in 70-100 yrs and lacks underbrush.I measured one tree's base at chest height and it was 10'-6" around. I hate the idea of cutting them but the house has to go somewhere and then of course I can't leave trees that big close to the home...

I did not know that I couldn't have wood heat as a primary. It's hard to believe what the gov. can demand...
 
Its for resale. Same reason they don't want you to do your own plumbing or electrical. With trees like that your solar usage is going to be limited, at best. Have you checked to see if the area you want to build will perk? How close to the closest Creek or "wet" area.

I don't mean this to come off in a bad way. You seem like you know what you want but aren't sure what all its going to take, get a GC, do some research and find a good one. It will save you time and money in the long run.

Also your road is going to be an issue. I understand you don't want to do anything to it if you don't have to. You will most likely have to. There is a difference between one passenger size vechile on it every once and a while and construction traffic. Concrete trucks weigh alot and if material is delivered they usually use bigger trucks. Later on most gas companies wont take a truck "off road" other words established gravel base roads. Had a hard time getting a truck into a house to fill the tanks the first time because the road wasn't gravelled.
 
tknopp said:
I think solar is a good back up but not ideal for primary power if electric is available. By the time you start to break even from your initial investment after several years then its time to drop several thousand on replacing your battery bank. And the cycle continues every 5-7 years.
Click to expand...
You also can't get a C.O. without a power hooked up that I know of
 
I've got a wife and two pre school aged kids. We live in a house built in 1960 that is about 1500 Sq ft. IN the peak of the summer I don't see 175 for a power bill and I keep the ac at 65 to keep me happy. I just can't see 250 in power. Now that I think about it I'm in my shop half of the weekends grinding and welding w 220 and still can't top 175.

I have an old hippy friend who plumbed his solar into the hot water heater and the electricity rarely kicks in on it. Do your research and scroll down a little on the Google search before you agree w interwebs.

IMHO a properly oriented house with a couple solar panels and a wood stove is just about all you need .
 
Thanks for the links.

I will study more on the solar option. I know I would need sunlight and removing trees for my home, building, garden...would open up some areas but not sure if it would be enough. I did not purchase property fully wooded just to cut it all down. I'm looking for privacy and even considering camo roofing:)The main reason I started looking at solar was because I don't like the idea of a power line swath cut through the property.
I'll study each item in my list of concerns Water,power,heat/AC and home construction intensely before making a decision. I'm the type that figures if someone else can do it then so can I. Or at least I can learn enough about a subject to watch you and make sure you aren't cutting corners or screwing up the project. I've learned over the years that most people just don't care about character or quality.
 
hunterdan said:
If the open end of the basement faces the north and it is shaded by a patio would I even need to cool it?
Click to expand...

My basement is 10" thick poured concrete, 10' walls, about half in the ground. It stays fairly controlled, but if it were living space it would need to be heated/cooled. The temp range is roughly 55 in really cold winter and 80 in really hot summer.
 
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