Jeep TJ frames like older Toyota Truck Frames?

SSWaters

SSWaters

Old Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Location
Kannapolis
I was wondering if ya'll have noticed this, I've repaired quite a few Toyota frames in the past (the ones that failed to make it in under the recall time limit). For the last couple of years I've done various TJ frame repairs. It's like Jeep used metal which is more subjective to intergranular corrosion and it just starts scaling off in layers, really bad in some areas, holes clear through the frame and body. My CJ is 35 years old and looks new compared to these, I haven't really noticed severe rot on YJ's either. JK's aren't old enough to make an assumption on those frames yet. They remind me of the old Scouts I've worked on - welding rust back together!
 
My Brother in law works for a jeep shop up in Massachusetts. Pretty much all he does is Frame repair on TJ's, multiple a week. Sends me pics all the time of coil buckets gone, missing frame and crossmembers, separated control arm mounts, etc. People are nuts up there spending 3+ grand at a time repairing frame rails, brackets, buckets etc. Not even modifications, or upgrades, but just rust repair on a 12+ year old 150k mile TJ...
 
IT could be Toyota and Jeep used the same supplier to built the frames? Most of the rusted frame on Toyota's were produced by Dana corp. I couldn't find who built the TJ but Hyundai Mobis built the JK.
 
I'll go crawl under an older Chevy and have a look! I guess when they go with these new "harder and stronger" metals they don't treat them correctly for corrosion. Kind'a how 4130 will flash over with rust in a day if left raw. I hope the JK's don't have the same fate....huge amount of those on the road!

Worst framed vehicles I've dealt with were those Toyota Trucks - that fall in that bad year range; TJ's - which I currently think are worse than the Toyota's; Scouts - rust, rust, rust and were terrible.

I see the new JL has a magnesium tailgate, just wait for that paint to start bubbling! It's used on the aircraft I work on and eventually corrodes and then bubbles the paint, I'm sure Fiat will not use aircraft quality magnesium. Aluminum Knuckles on a steel axle, sometimes in your quest to save weight....just stop....use that energy to have a factory V8 option with 1 ton axles, ha, ha!
 
I have seen quite a few YJ frames rotted over the years. Usually in the back where the bumper mounts.
 
Magnesium tailgates? Wouldn't that be a pretty good fire hazard? I can see some rugrat running around with a sparkler on 4th of July and suddenly torching the family's new Jeep. Oops.

The NHRA outlawed that shit for a reason, I fail to understand why manufacturers think it's a good idea.
 
Going all the way back to your orriginal comment .....granular. I think it is a more general problem. I think it will continue to get worse or at least pop up a lot. I think metalurgist have their hands full trying to get metal to be stronger lighter faster so to speak.

Biggest problem is cheap has to fit in along with extremely high amounts of recyled material. I think the makers set a price. Then manufacturers of components scramble to meet all the goal points and we get subpar longevity. I have seen plenty of old frames from different era's last with little or no undercoat....

One thing all these frames you mentioned except maybe the Scouts....haven't been under one in a long time.....is highly boxed designs coupled with a vast amount of welded sandwiched overlaping brackets and structure. Yay it's all modular.....boooooo the whole thing is full of moisture and junk traps.
 
I'd like to know the metalurgical differences.


Say like a Ford Super duty....stamped rivited or bolted. Hmmmm higher grade less welding. Welding bad for the temper and strenght.

Something else...boxed design for rigidity. Thinner lighter but boxed. Lets weld everything together. Dumb down the alloy so welding doesn't effect along the Haz quite as drastic. Remains stiff with some ductility for fighting fatigue crack......now somehow reduces itself to a botanical reef until sudden catastrophic failure.
 
This has been a big problem across the whole steel industry, somewhere around 2002 they changed the steel alloys. I have seen it in heavy equipment, an example the track rollers in bulldozers, the original roller would last over 1000 hours (2001 machine), the factory replacement (new alloy) only seeing 300 hours of service!
Welcome to the world of planned obsolescence!
 
Ive been waiting for the discussion about the application of salt or brine to our roads in the winter. This periodic spraying of the undercarriage of our vehicles has to have an impact on corrosion of metals. I think the damage to our vehicles, roads, and bridges far out weigh the benefits of not having frozen surfaces during sub freezing temperatures. This winter they treated our roads in eastern NC and it never froze but I had to drive in it to go to work. When I moved here 41 years ago I thought I was getting away from the winter salt baths.
 
This question almost needs it's own thread! The sodium bromide that they pre-treat the roads with is some nasty stuff, talked to one of the guys at the town street department, he said that if you put a 1/2" nut in it at the end of work, the next morning it would be gone. All the real nasty "salt" that our neighboring states decided was too hard on vehicles and roads (the blue stuff), NC bought all the surplus.
 
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