metal anyone???

Status
Not open for further replies.

jeepeater2003

Member
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Location
raleigh
hey all

looking to find some metal locally. raleigh

anyone know the number for dillons?

also does anyone have some 2x4" rectangular metal, about 5 feet that they want to get rid of so i don't have to buy 20 ft?

also what size tubing would i need for a track bar and about how much.

thanks
tyler
 
try a scrap metal yard, salvage yard etc. DH griffith is a big name, as well as Atlantic Scrap.

For a track bar, (not traction bar, though it would work for one too) I would use 1", .156 wall DOM tube (any race shop would have it). That would give you enough material to tap it out to a 3/4" thread, and you could use 3/4" heim joints. If you use bushings then you might need bigger. But I wouldn't go smaller than 1" .156 wall.
 
opps sorry, i meant traction bar. i am so used to saying trac bar.

tyler
 
IMO, 1" OD tubing is going to be FAR too weak to use in a traction/anti-wrap bar... Especially with the setup you have.

Assuming a ~35" length, 1" .156 would bend with only 400 lbs of weight it - don't touch a rock with it! 1.5" .250 would take 1,400 lbs to bend.

1" would also buckle and totally fail with ~7500 lbs. of force applied to it. Not impossible by any means if you're getting on it and bounce a little.. I'm not awake enough to calculate the force you'd possibly apply with your setup, gearing, torque, etc... Let's just say that it would take 40,000 lbs to buckle the same length of 1.5 .250" ..

heck, even readily available 1.5" .120 takes 875lbs to bend, and ~25,000 lbs to buckle.

The amount of material required depends on how long you want your wrap bar to be... take the length, times 2, add a foot for fudge, and you outta be good ;) Don't forget to add some in for a brace between the 2!
 
Tacoma747 said:
try a scrap metal yard, salvage yard etc. DH griffith is a big name, as well as Atlantic Scrap.

For a track bar, (not traction bar, though it would work for one too) I would use 1", .156 wall DOM tube (any race shop would have it). That would give you enough material to tap it out to a 3/4" thread, and you could use 3/4" heim joints. If you use bushings then you might need bigger. But I wouldn't go smaller than 1" .156 wall.
Click to expand...

1" x.156 tube is not enough to handle the forces involved with a traction bar or a trackbar that is gonna see even moderate offroad use. Sorry Taco, I have kept my mouth shut on most of your stuff and your "professional" fab services offered on your website but this is just dumb. Maybe you outta finish out school and get some real experience before you start giving advise to those even less informed than you.....(And if you want to discuss strengths of tubing and designs please do, I will be happy to break out my old Mech Engineering stuff anytime.....)

Use some 1.5" or !.75" DOM tube, preferably .250 wall on some parts, but .120 wall with a couple of properly placed cross tubes works just fine.

Andy
 
aimg.photobucket.com_albums_v214_nhodierne_dayum.jpg
 
Sorry, let all his other stuff on the last site ride......it needed to be said.
 
i prefer sch. 40..... pvc.
 
i can tell you do alot of fab work, huh rufus.

hey what happend to you building that rear bumber for me???

tyler
 
i made a roll cage out of it. it was nice and worked well
tyler
 
I might have to disagree on the traction bar. My friend and I both built traction bars out of pipe. The wall thickness was about 0.120 if I remember correctly. We both ran them for about a year or more with no problems. I think he might have ran his close to two years. Of course they had support bars in between the two main bars. Now a trac bar is a different story. I am building the one for my current truck out of 1.5" 0.219" wall DOM. Don't want to take a chance on that. It is too important.

Oh yeah, I bought everything to build my trac bar from Trevor at WFO Concepts. Nice guy. He hooked me up with everything I needed and shipped it out right away.
 
You gotta make trac bars beefy. That is why they come from the factory solid.
 
drop me a pm... best way to guarantee a response from me. i've been getting your im's, but you're either signed off by the time i get them or i'm busy as hell at work and can't respond.
 
To tell the honest truth, I was thinking jeepeater had a fairly stock rig (no I didn't look at his profile- until now), that is what I suggested the 1" .156 wall. But having 39's and whatever else he had listed, no I would not use anything smaller than 1.5", .250 wall. As for the traction bar, he should probably use something larger just because the size of the rig, but I do not see that something in the 1-1.25" OD, that was .156 (for 1"), or .120 (for the 1.25") would be too weak for a smaller rig (like mine). I and a friend used 1.25" .120 square tube, and with a brace in between the two bars, and the lower bar running as far forward as possible, IMO that is plenty strong enough, you can give me your calculations all you want, and when I break it I will tell you that you were right.

Also, being in a racing program, I am thinking about the trac bars being straight, not like what is normally on a Jeep having a couple bends in it. 1" .156 wall is PLENTY for a straight traction bar, heck you could even use aluminum. Tell me going around Daytona at 195 MPH doesn't put some load on a trac bar, somehow they get by with the aluminum ones or the steel ones (not sure what NASCAR uses) but I bet if it is steel it wouldnt be thicker than .156).

Put a bend in the bar (which would probably be a must-have), and I will agree 1" .156 wall would not hold up.
 
has anyone answered his other question on where to get the metal. i am more interested in that answer than how think the walls of a trac bar need to be.
 
as far as racign programs go i have noticed the people around here that go to nascar tech here turn out dumber then when they went in. thats general statement about the nascar school here. i think comparing a car on a flat surface is very diffrent then a jeep. nascar weighs about 2k less. and the tire size is no way compareable. bottom line i have a bent link that .250 steel. i wouldnt run less ever.
 
Tacoma747 said:
To tell the honest truth, I was thinking jeepeater had a fairly stock rig (no I didn't look at his profile- until now), that is what I suggested the 1" .156 wall. But having 39's and whatever else he had listed, no I would not use anything smaller than 1.5", .250 wall. As for the traction bar, he should probably use something larger just because the size of the rig, but I do not see that something in the 1-1.25" OD, that was .156 (for 1"), or .120 (for the 1.25") would be too weak for a smaller rig (like mine). I and a friend used 1.25" .120 square tube, and with a brace in between the two bars, and the lower bar running as far forward as possible, IMO that is plenty strong enough, you can give me your calculations all you want, and when I break it I will tell you that you were right.

Also, being in a racing program, I am thinking about the trac bars being straight, not like what is normally on a Jeep having a couple bends in it. 1" .156 wall is PLENTY for a straight traction bar, heck you could even use aluminum. Tell me going around Daytona at 195 MPH doesn't put some load on a trac bar, somehow they get by with the aluminum ones or the steel ones (not sure what NASCAR uses) but I bet if it is steel it wouldnt be thicker than .156).

Put a bend in the bar (which would probably be a must-have), and I will agree 1" .156 wall would not hold up.
Click to expand...


Keep dancing around and saying you are right and someday you just might be......

Stock or not.....Keep in mind that you are comparing apples to oranges.....this is a 4x4 site, has absolutely NOTHING to do with your racing program(except some chassis design concepts and a few other things) and the crap you just spewed. If you want to start dipping into that then lets talk about differences in material strengths.....you are spouting about the size of the tubing being fine, ignoring the fact that all the race applications I have worked with are using Chromoly (and yes, some are using 7075(I think) AL), not 1018 DOM like you recommended. Quite a big difference in materials and the stresses(and types of stresses) that they can handle. But that also depends on the length and setup you are building.

Comparing a NASCAR style race care to a 4x4 is like comparing a ranger to a F450 Powerstroke.....just based on weight, etc.....I don't disgree that 1"x.156 wall DOM would be great for building stuff for a go-kart anyday.......

Not to mention that you just stated a HUGE difference in your response.....
"I and a friend used 1.25" .120 square tube..." - Now you are REALLY going apples to oranges when you start changing shapes.....round and square tube have VERY different properties and you completely glossed over that with your " my size is similar" argument......

Someday you are gonna build something straight off some ideas you get in class(without understanding the context) and it is gonna hurt someone. Hope you get some real business liability insurance so that your folks don't lose their house for anything you "think" will be okay. God knows that if you really screw up you have opened a door for a lawyer to walk right in and take everything your folks have.

(I will add this disclaimer that I will absolutely never tell you that I am perfect in anyway, I just am tired of some people tempting fate by giving bad advice(and putting up an "I am a professional" show with statements like you see on his website) when they don't have a clue what they are talking about........but they keep doing it time and time again.)

Jeepeater, I will be happy to help you out however with advice (or just listen to the other bright/more experienced/common sense minds on this board) or otherwise. I have the material you need in stock along with laser cut brackets to put on the axle housing if you need them. Just let me know, since you sent the note about the draglink anyway and you are gonna be down here, I can have whatever material you need ready to go if you want it.

Andy
 
I agree with Andy, Apples and Oranges! The issue of impact has to be forseen. Hop that small stuff in the air and land on a rock, it's history! Not to mention, when the torque of Low range is applied with sizable tires. There's no success, like excess! In this case .250 isn't excessive at all.

kinda reminds me of folks who continue to build roll cages and bars from exhaust pipe.
 
Keep dancing around and saying you are right and someday you just might be......
Click to expand...
seriously... this is typical of ALL your statements on such subjects. you state something completely wrong and off the wall, get called out on it, then attempt to back pedal by changing your answer due to some exscuse like you didn't read his signature. then you try to save a little face by defending part of your original statement, but you're still spewing crap. just quit arguing... admit your were wrong, and learn from it.

i think you do a good job on alot of stuff you build in form and function. some of it looks good, but is flawed in design. some of it is crap period. it's things like this that set you apart from being a true professional vs. a weekend warrior. things in this thread are very basic concepts. strengths of materials and where/when to use them is the first thing any fabricator should learn. i know in the metals program i went through in school we spent 2-3 weeks of bookwork on just that subject before we were even allowed to touch a tool.

basically, my whole reoccuring issue with your posts is that you advertise a business. people who don't know any better look to you as a professional, just because you have a name and website. that should hold you to a higher standard on a personal level and on your work. i could absolutely care less if you were just a guy doing a little sidework from time to time. i do the same thing... i rent shop space, and like to do things to help cover the rent. i advertise myself as a professional for mechanic work, because i consider my skills to be such and i have worked in the industry as one in years past. for any fabrication work, i keep my mouth shut. i make sure to tell them while i'll do my best and it should turn out as a good product, but there's a chance it won't be at a professional level. especially for things i've never built before.
 
RufusTheRam said:
i could absolutely care less if you were just a guy doing a little sidework from time to time. i do the same thing... i rent shop space, and like to do things to help cover the rent. i advertise myself as a professional for mechanic work, because i consider my skills to be such and i have worked in the industry as one in years past. for any fabrication work, i keep my mouth shut. i make sure to tell them while i'll do my best and it should turn out as a good product, but there's a chance it won't be at a professional level. especially for things i've never built before.
Click to expand...

That is exactly how I am, I in no way claim to be a professional (yes I know the website says something about 'professional', the guy that made the website did it on his own, I just gave him a little info and pictures). I have told many people that whatever I do may not look like a full blow, jig made bumper or such, because most things I make for people are something I have never made before, such as the sliders I have done for Tacoma's, the first set I made were much different in design, weld quality, and looks than the last set I made, (and the first set are what is on my truck).

I have not taken and metal classes other than one MIG class, and a cutting processes class, both were taught by the same teacher, and we never did much bookwork, I have a basic idea on the qualities of metal, but nothing too in depth. So Andy, thank you for your opinion and I will take it into consideration.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top