mig welding galvanized stuff, advise?tips?

marty79

marty79

the LS Swap Guy
Joined
Nov 24, 2013
Location
Conover, NC
hey anyone experienced with welding this stuff. I don't mean just the fencing stuff that is pretty thin but the stuff that carports are made from. That's all I'm welding now and can't get a good bead for crap. He has a Miller 210 with .35 wire, regular 75argon tank and it just spatters like crazy and no matter what comes out bulky welds. We are welding them flat on the table jig but he's ok with the bulky welds and stuff but I can't stand it and here at home with flux wire, i can lay down a nice flat bead that looks great just like any other weld I do.
I just bothers the crap out of me to have bulky looking welds and I'm used to really nice pretty beads.
Turn the heat up higher and wire speed too?
He's been doing it 30some years so convincing him to change to flux core probably ain't gonna happen lol but just looking for tips to help me get to a point that I like em better and I know for a fact he would be impressed with flatter good looking beads. Maybe I'm just being too picky (which I am, I take pride in my welds looking good at a job). thanks for any input
 
Grind the galvanized coating off. And don't breathe.

EDIT:

Seriously, though...welding galvanized anything is a BAD idea. It lets off toxic fumes, even more toxic than the regular weld fumes. It can caused galvanize poisoning....yes - that's a thing. I'd use a respirator if you have one, and get ALL The galvanized coating off the weld area, and around the heat affected zone.

EDIT, part deux:

Side Effects of Welding Galvanized Steel - Weld My World

Another tip - enjoy a tall glass of milk while you're welding.
 
Scooter402 said:
Grind the galvanized coating off. And don't breathe.

EDIT:

Seriously, though...welding galvanized anything is a BAD idea. It lets off toxic fumes, even more toxic than the regular weld fumes. It can caused galvanize poisoning....yes - that's a thing. I'd use a respirator if you have one, and get ALL The galvanized coating off the weld area, and around the heat affected zone.

EDIT, part deux:

Side Effects of Welding Galvanized Steel - Weld My World
Click to expand...
ok so how do I tell this to a guy whose been doing this for 30some years without sounding/acting like a "I know better" I just don't want to come off offensive. My main reason is he hired me at great starting pay, less than half the distance from previous job, told him I can mig weld really good and he was impressed with my mig welds on steel but when I started on the galvanized stuff which is all we do lol, I'm like WTH....this looks like dog turd lol and I can't stand ugly welds
 
the only half way descent weld I was making today were kinda big and he likes the pieces to have small thin beads even if they're small thick beads but to me small thick bead is just well, doesn't seem proper at all cause it's so fast I don't see how there's any penetration. I'm tempted to bring in my 110 flux machine i'm borrowing and show him how awesome and flat beads I can do with that and kinda maybe help prove a mig weld on this stuff will never look like the flux ....or is this bad idea lol
 
Just do it....I've got no problems offending people. :D

Or, you could go about it the nice way...if you're welding side by side with him, grind and prep yours, lay down a nice, pretty bead, then compare with his....perhaps he'll catch on. Or, just tell him that the galvanized coating is preventing the weld penetration (which it is), and is letting off zinc oxide (which it does) and it's incredibly harmful to breathe. He may be a great welder that's never messed with galvanized coatings...it could happen.
 
marty79 said:
the only half way descent weld I was making today were kinda big and he likes the pieces to have small thin beads even if they're small thick beads but to me small thick bead is just well, doesn't seem proper at all cause it's so fast I don't see how there's any penetration. I'm tempted to bring in my 110 flux machine i'm borrowing and show him how awesome and flat beads I can do with that and kinda maybe help prove a mig weld on this stuff will never look like the flux ....or is this bad idea lol
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Never could hurt. Especially if you're welding outside. A decent breeze and shielding gas don't mix...well, they do, but that's the problem. :lol: That's where innershield wire shines.
 
1stgenxxx said:
Dammit marty.....leave the Flux core capacitor dialed to 88mph and let it eat.
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Either that, or you'll need 1.21 Gigawatts of power...sorry, I had to do it. :lol:
 
Scooter402 said:
He may be a great welder that's never messed with galvanized coatings...it could happen.
Click to expand...
well that's just it though, his welds (to me and probably to most) look the same as mine just smaller. They're thick and small but protrude far out from the piece...if you get my drift so I and most would agree that they're not the proper looking beads at all. I guess they work being only 12g metal so suppose doesn't take much heat to get em to bond but just looks like ass.

My solution: A. Bring in some scrap steel plates to show him my mig welds again!
B. Bring in the 110 flux welder and weld regular steel first to show how good and flat those welds are too!
C. then I'll Mig weld the galvanized the best I can
D. then I'll flux the galvanized and he will see that C will look like straight butt and A,B,D look great like they should.
I just figured get this all out of the way now rather than weeks or months down the road. But I also realize that if he's happy with how the Mig process looks on the galvanized than I won't argue and do it and let it be...
 
this is pretty much what his look like and mine are about the same but bigger with the stacking dimes look though. I'm just not used to this kind of bead

mig-braze.jpg


this is what I'm used to doing flat weld like weather mig or flux so I suppose this will never happen on galvanized with mig
44962842-cord%C3%B3n-de-soldadura-en-soldadura-de-chapa-de-acero-de-metal-de-acero-industrial-en-la-f%C3%A1brica.jpg
 
First, make sure the conditions are the same for both machines...both are PROPERLY PREPPED surfaces...see above with removing the galvanized coating. Otherwise, we're just whizzing in the breeze.

What also would make a difference is if that machine is set up properly (DCEP for gas-shielded solid core wire). If it's set up as DCEN and using solid core with gas shield, it will look just as you described.

Also ensure that the machine parameters are set correctly for the material...Not trying to say anyone is doing it wrong, but with the voltage too low or wire speed too high, you'll get the same thing again.

Then proceed as you outlined.
 
marty79 said:
this is pretty much what his look like and mine are about the same but bigger with the stacking dimes look though. I'm just not used to this kind of bead

mig-braze.jpg


this is what I'm used to doing flat weld like weather mig or flux so I suppose this will never happen on galvanized with mig
44962842-cord%C3%B3n-de-soldadura-en-soldadura-de-chapa-de-acero-de-metal-de-acero-industrial-en-la-f%C3%A1brica.jpg
Click to expand...
There's actually not a lot wrong with that first one other than the cold start. Looks like it doesn't have quite enough heat in it.

Welding galvanized steel is just the same as any other steel welding (nearly, unless you're getting into alloys and high carbon, but we're excluding those at the moment...), but the surface must be prepped. Make sure that coating is GONE before welding.

EDIT:....actually, are you sure that first one isn't a braze?
 
Scooter402 said:
EDIT:....actually, are you sure that first one isn't a braze?
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it's a picture I took off the internet real quick to just show what they look like but kinda not as uniform but stick up like that. that is called a braze I think and I'm not too familiar with "braze" beside i think you just kinda quickly go across the top no weaving no moons no dimes no moving except in the forward direction...could be wrong but never really done that.
Oh and he never has or does grind anything away, just hit it and go
 
pretty sure grinding is out of the question for Production purposes since there's quite a bit of welding to be done and from what I've done so far, yeah grinding would def really slow me down.
 
marty79 said:
pretty sure grinding is out of the question for Production purposes since there's quite a bit of welding to be done and from what I've done so far, yeah grinding would def really slow me down.
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You're really cutting your own production quality by taking this stance... even with non-galvanized steel. Your weld quality will be sooo much cleaner if you grind mill scale off your material first. Sounds like you don't?

I still say grind off the galvanized coating. @a_kelley is right - even a wire wheel would be quick, and your quality would be so much better. And the other guy's, for that matter.
 
if your on a production job, you better be doing it the way they tell you. Just keep your face out of the smoke and if you get a sweet taste in your mouth drink a couple glasses of milk. doesn't hurt to drink a glass before you start either.

Your supervisor will tell you if your weld is satisfactory. welding at home you have time for that dime on dime shit. production welding is different. They want a fast welder with welds that are consistent and smooth.
 
A properly fitting respirator would go a long way for your own safety. You don’t have to be an asshole when you bring it up, but at least ask him politely.

He should be providing the right safety measures for the work you are doing and he should care about implementing them. Maybe he doesn’t know and you can use this as an opportunity to educate. I mean, long term exposure can cause kidney damage and even related to parkinsen’s disease.

Either way, no amount of $ is worth breathing in galvanized fumes on a daily basis and an employer should be giving you the tools to do your job safely. I’ve had metal fume fever from welding galvanized metal and it sucks.
 
Well noted guys thanks
 
I wont add any welding techniques, as these guys could weld circles around me. Just remember your working with thing gauge stuff, not 1/4" plates.

As for the galv, drink some milk before and after each shift, wear a mask, keep the smoke away as best you can. Its not instantly gonna hurt you, but it can build up if youre not careful. I was welding stairs together that were galv and our 4 man crew went through a couple gallons of milk per day. Just dont drink it while youre hot, that sucks.
 
First thing, keep your head out of the fine plume and use cross draft ventilation. Use a fan to suck the fume plume away and to the side.

Second and most important, go buy yourself a respirator. Your employer is required to furnish all required PPE for you, but you can’t choose what he is going to provide.

Go buy this. Your local welding supply shop should have these in stock.

40de624af660196b24d0ed2714d1554c.jpg


These are hepa rated and will stop the particulates and oxides from welding/grinding on galvanized and any hexavalent chromium from stainless. It’s good practice to wear this at all times for welding/grinding operations, especially with flux/metal core wire.

Other units will clog fast with debris and restrict air flow.

It’s $25 and the best bang for the buck on the market currently. Next step up is a fresh air supplied welding hood with filter.

Do not trust a simple dust mask or just milk for protection. It may help, but prevent the issue at the source.

Third.

Get that machine above 26 volts, and anywhere between 250-400 in the wire depending on wall thickness of what’s being welded. This will reduce weld time, produce a smooth weld with a smaller heat affected zone due to reduced total weld time. Just move steady across the weld, weave is only necessary for a wide fillet. Most joints can be welded without a weave if wall thickness is 5/16 and less.

To make a wide, shallow bead push the wire. If you need deeper penetration with a narrower bead drag the wire.

Over 26 volts will get you into spray transfer mode that will produce less spatter and a smoother more uniform weld bead.

Metal core wire can reduce overall cost by reducing weld time and increasing productivity. It’s more expensive than solid wire but typically result in employer cost saving due to high productivity.

There are several solid/flux/metal core wire options and gases specifically for galvanized. Contact you district AWS representative for more specific info for your exact application.

Here is a decent generic article on the topic.

Welding Galvanized Steel Safely | Allied Tube & Conduit | Mechanical Tube Division

A stack of dimes in production welding is a waste of time and results in higher cost due to longer weld time per joint.

Only avoid spray transfer if needing to weld the joint out of position. For everything flat on the table, spray will beat short circuit( under 24-26 volts) every time.
 
Mac gave you the best technical answer. The coating is reactive and out gasses. Without running it fairly hot you do not burn it off so to speak. Well when you burn it off it becomes fume. Fume becomes poison. Poison becomes sick and you find a new job. You'd honestly be better off with a thin metal stick electrode and a damn fan over just trying to kill it with plain hard wire. Mostly likely not going to fly either. If your employer hasn't supplied a mask or required you to have one it should be a sign. Second if he hasn't modernized his electrode choice it shows he doesn't truly care for improvement. Sign number two.

Face it your shorter drive and slightly bigger carrot probably equals a production based tier you got talked into. High part count head down squirt gun. Crappy conditions and long term health risk. If its gauge anything its thin. You'll be bored or something in a week.

Edit: So I'm pessimistic about your "new" gig. It might suit you. Good luck. Just wear some PPE. If you enjoy production; bang out the parts, count your money and go home.
 
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WARRIORWELDING said:
You'd honestly be better off with a thin metal stick electrode and a damn fan over just trying to kill it with plain hard wire. Mostly likely not going to fly either. If your employer hasn't supplied a mask or required you to have one it should be a sign. Second if he hasn't modernized his electrode choice it shows he doesn't truly care for improvement. Sign number two.
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Exactly my thoughts. If the boss hasn't cared before, he's not gonna start now. Learn it and burn it. This applies to both welding and employment.
 
I've read it all thanks guys.
jeepinmatt said:
Exactly my thoughts. If the boss hasn't cared before, he's not gonna start now. Learn it and burn it. This applies to both welding and employment.
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This is my attitude now. I'm pushing it today rather than pulling and it's much better..he's plenty happy so I guess I'll settle for what it is as far as welds go.
 
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