NC4x4 Braintrust - What's this called?

13bullets

13bullets

Chris
Joined
Dec 14, 2008
Location
Lincolnton
I'm looking for something I can screw to my building supports (4' on center) to hold up drywall or plywood to the walls and ceiling. What I'm thinking of is like Hat Channel but has smooth bends and is only about 3/8" tall. I can't find any hat channel or furring strips shorter than 7/8", nor do I think they would be enough material to hold a screw and support the weight of the boards on the ceiling.
 
I'd go for furring strips or even 2x. 4ft is a long way to span with something that only has a 3/8" section depth.

The shortest furring strips I know of are 7/8" high. 1x wood would be 3/4", but that's about the skinniest I'd be willing to go.

No help, I know....
 
Are we talking about inside finishing for a pole barn?
I'm with Shawn, just use firring strips. But pretty much anything short of thick steel (not just hat channel) is going to flex like hell over that kind of distance.
 
RatLabGuy said:
Are we talking about inside finishing for a pole barn?
I'm with Shawn, just use firring strips. But pretty much anything short of thick steel (not just hat channel) is going to flex like hell over that kind of distance.
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It's just a metal building. I figured I'd screw into the main supports every 4 ft., but would also need some support in the middle.

20180802_204555.jpg
 
im assuming you mean your structure is 4' on center and want to use strips to get to a 16" layout or at least 2'. even then (2") better go with sag resistant sheetrock if thats your material choice. 7/8 hat is plenty strong to hold if using a proper layout. They do make a r.c channel thats about 1/2" but im not aware of it being used on a ceiling only walls.
 
you got a pic up faster than i type. if you finish that with sheetrock i can basically guarentee it will crack


outa curiousity why dont you want the 7/8 hat?
 
I was thinking like the hat channel looking stuff that is on the top side of the supports holging the metal roof up. It looks like hat channel but not as deep. I just don't want to have to pay $22/sheet for 3/4" plywood, but I will if I have to.
 
Nevermind, I'd leave that alone. If you put up gyp board or plywood, you're going to have condensation and mold problems. You need plastic-wrapped insulation or closed-cell polyurethane to keep the vapor to a minimum.
 
I was planning to insulate with this:
insulation.jpg


It's got the foil backing on one side and white styrofoam on the other. No?
 
Yeah, that might work. How thick is it? Can you get about an R-10?
 
If you're going through all this, I'd also consider you options for insulation at the same time.

EDIT - beats me to it.
How thick are the posts?
The typical XPS pink or blue stuff is R5 per inch. It's about he best R/inch you'll get. But it ain't cheap.
Metal building right? Does foil on outside matter in that case?
 
RatLabGuy said:
If you're going through all this, I'd also consider you options for insulation at the same time.

EDIT - beats me to it.
How thick are the posts?
The typical XPS pink or blue stuff is R5 per inch. It's about he best R/inch you'll get. But it ain't cheap.
Metal building right? Does foil on outside matter in that case?
Click to expand...
2" posts, so the 2" boards would be flush then covered with osb or plywood. Do you mean foil on both sides of the styrofoam or just turn it to the outside instead of the inside? I don't know the answer either way.
 
My neighbor has pretty much the exact type of garage as that, insulated with (I think) the same type of insulation as the picture above, installed in a similar fashion. In the winter, with a heater going, it's got condensation everywhere, including frost on those exposed metal struts that are between the insulation panels (which make really great thermal bridges).

The foil facing the metal building skin isn't doing anything. Foil touching metal just negates the reason for having foil, as does the foil touching anything. The foil doesn't work without an airgap, because the foil is a type of radiant barrier, and a radiant barrier can't work if it's getting shorted out by conduction from touching something.
 
Yep, the metal beams connected to the outer metal ate a real problem for the conduction of cold. Lets say you filled the 4' gaps with 2" XPS, that will work well to pretty much retard any vapor and also prevent condensation on the inside. The beauty of the thick XPS is that it creates a sort of transition zone where one side is warm, the other is cold, and its thick enough that the material is assort of gradual gradient so that no one point will tend to be a condensing area. That's the theory, anyway. But then with the metal posts, you'll still have strips that are cold right up to the inner face.
About the only way to prevent that effect is to put another layer of foam in front of the metal posts.
On that note, that's another reason why metal hat strips are not ideal, at least unless they are thermally isolated from the posts. The cold from the post will translate right through the hat channel and in front of your insulation.
 
For metal building applications you need vinyl backed insulation. Steel building industry standard. ( I spent many years building steel buildings from many different manufacturers .... they ALL used it.) The best thing is to bite the bullet and have it done initially so that it's between the frame and the outside skin. It comes in rolls so its a continuous run from top to bottom, with edge tabs stapled to provide a seal.
As for interior finishing, Either finish with metal panels ( whatever you can find) otherwise the best thing is to frame with wood or metal studwork before doing drywall.

Of course, with enough ingenuity and sweat, anything can be made to work.


Matt
 
Lizooki said:
For metal building applications you need vinyl backed insulation. Steel building industry standard. ( I spent many years building steel buildings from many different manufacturers .... they ALL used it.) The best thing is to bite the bullet and have it done initially so that it's between the frame and the outside skin. It comes in rolls so its a continuous run from top to bottom, with edge tabs stapled to provide a seal.
Click to expand...
The issue around here, at least with most of the "carport style" (2"x2" on 24" centers) constructed buildings... most will only do about 1"-1.5" of that vinyl faced insulation because the skins are "thinner" and will oilcan

shawn said:
Yeah, that might work. How thick is it? Can you get about an R-10?
Click to expand...

13bullets said:
2", right around R7.7
Click to expand...

What about a 2" layer (cut to fit) in the voids and another 2" over it all... and shoot drywall/covering thru it to the 2"x2"'s
 
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