New Titling laws?

Chuckman

Chuckman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2005
Location
Huntersville
So we called and the homeowners wont insure our new Willys at the farm as an " implement " like they said they would. Now I am stuck with the idea of not insuring it or going through DMV hell to get it titled. Our plans are to maybe cross the road but thats it- it will live its life dragging deer out of the woods- and I have to register it??!!!. They claim that since it did at one time have a VIN number and that we need to register it as a road vehicle. And the PO was in NY as best as I can tell, so I cant get a bonded title. There are lots of old VINS floating around, but none were linked to a known previous registered driver to get it signed over. Are there any tricks to this. I bow to the supremacy of the Board- I need help. :cool:
 
Why not get a bonded title?
Is it street legal? If so, it's not that hard.
If not, you can't drive it on the road anyway so you don't need a title.
I've done the bonded title process on a few old Jeeps. If you need some help, feel free to call me.
 
Im just worried about some asshat stealing it. Theyve broken into the house and barns too many times to count. Apparantly down East, its still profitable to steal a CRT tv with rabbit ears- and no remote, so I can only imagine the Willys will be gone one day. The tractors are simply too heavy to haul away (easily) and too slow to drive off. So we insure everything for replacement value and go on about life. The house sits empty for months at a time so there is no tracking any leads after stuff is gone. Just glad they havent trashed the place yet. I have run off a poacher at gunpoint that turned out to be a city cop in the area, so go figure. Just want to get it insured somehow against theft. We cant even find a way to put it on some sort of addendum or rider on our policy and since it was once a titled vehicle, it must remain that way. If it was an ATV, it would be no big deal.
 
I believe you can do a title search. Then when no one responds, they will issue you a "replacement title" in your name (not sure if thats the correct name for it, but I know it is done)

Or insure it as a homebuilt utility trailer...or lawn mower! LOL!
 
No VIN tags on it, so no records at all.
 
Just another suggestion on the "keeping it from getting stolen" side. Since the tractors are not getting moved, park the willys against a tree where it cannot move in that direction (or better yet where it cannot move back or to side)

Then park a tractor in front/side of it...

I might would check into "Farm insurance" on your equipment and see if it would cover stolen items. If so, put the Willys down that way instead of as a motor vehicle? Same way you are insuring the tractors for now...you certainly don't need a tag so...

Sam
 
Chuckman said:
No VIN tags on it, so no records at all.
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Your Engine block # and body #s might can still be found. There should be a tag around the drivers side frame / near the front bumper.

The engine block number and body # WERE the "VIN" number for the old Willys... as stated if you can find a beater titled rig that is the easiest way to go about this...

But the folks that mentioned the bonded version above, basically you will just need to use your engine # as your vin. We are restoring a 46 Willys ourselves!!

HillBilly (forget the rest) on here might be able to help you out, look him up in the members list and give him a shout. He has a TON of parts and might give you a heads up on what it takes to get a new title for your willys here in NC.
 
Chuckman said:
We cant even find a way to put it on some sort of addendum or rider on our policy and since it was once a titled vehicle, it must remain that way.
Click to expand...

Says who?

The way I see it, DOT should have to prove it was titled... not just assume "must have been... somewhere... sometime". I know of a couple vehicles that have NEVER been titled (they didn't have "titles" back in the '30s-'40s)
 
I'm with Dave here.
If this thing is a Frankentein's Monster of a machine, cobbled together from peices of several vehicles, then it is perfeclty logical and legally true that it does not have a title.
A title does not follow an engine. A title does not (necessarily) follow a body (you can buy full replacements aftermarket, those don't have titles), a transmission, or any other part. Only thing in Q might be the frame... and if the frame were (according to what you tell the DMV) home-made or peiced from multiple other leftover vehicles/parts, it would not have one either.

I would call them up, and say simply, "I have built a vehicle. I need to get a bonded title on it, since it has never had one." Once you have the title, you can insure it.
 
Caver Dave said:
Says who?
The way I see it, DOT should have to prove it was titled... not just assume "must have been... somewhere... sometime". I know of a couple vehicles that have NEVER been titled (they didn't have "titles" back in the '30s-'40s)
Click to expand...

Also, a Willys could be a MB, M38, M38a, or M38a1 and may not have had a title as a military vehicle. But, the DOT isn't known for bowing to the pressure of not being right.

So, call the DOT, ask what the current rules are. I did it 12 years ago, and have simply forgotten since then. They will try to get you to re-title it, there are numbers on the frame above the rear axle on the top of the frame (good luck getting at it). I believe they were stamped somewhere else too. My brother's restoration did not have those numbers visible due to rust.

J
 
in NY they never used titles up until mid 80s.. Prior to that your small registration card WAS the title. Sign the back and hand it over. When I retitled my old 46 down here thats all i had was an old registration signed by the owner. Was fun watching them put the 5 digit vin# into their system :)
 
Heres the latest. You are all kind to submit replys, but here is what Farm Bureaus underwriter and the DMV site here in CLT and Raleigh are telling me with my circumstances. Remember that this rig does not have any numbers ANYWHERE and the motor is now a V8. Also dont have any idea who the last PO who it was registered to was. Pretty much what they say is that in NC, without a VIN I must do the following. 1. Make it street legal. 2. Take it to the DMV like I handbuilt it. 3. Then take it to 2 dealerships to have it appraised. 4. Insure it and keep it tagged, which would mean yearly inspections. Farm Bureau is not being an azz, they read me the rules. 'motor vehicles are exempt from home owners policies' and this is considered a vehicle- as it was classified as a road worthy vehicle in their records. A tractor is not a vehicle. So we are going to risk it since the DMV in general sucks. Pops' half of this bargain was that if I could get one that he would keep it up and insure it - as its for the family. So today he said that the system could go and 'blow a goat'- that he would 'insure it'.
 
You ever thought about putting together a relatively cheap digital video recorder and a few infrared cameras? It might keep things from getting stolen. They aren't that hard or expensive to put together.
 
We have game cameras setup at the house and barns, but it does not deter, nor help in investigations. The issue is that apparantly new as of this year, it must be inspected and registered. Too much BS to deal with for the overall value of the rig. I just must have been naive to think that I could have just called our insurance agent and say that I got a X and want to insure it for value Y. Guess it doesnt work that way with vehicles, but it does with all of my other riders on my HO policy (jewelry, barns, guns, tractor etc). The system is fighting me big time. I dont want to go to the pokey *they call it that for a reason you know* over some shady dealings with vague titles. So for now, Ill have another beer and call it covered.
 
Go to the dmv and see about an indemnity bond and tell them you cannot find the vin number on the vehicle because it's so old and see what kind of pains they put you through.
 
ol'Jeeps said:
Buy a title and vin tag! LOL!
Click to expand...
:shaking:
wow I cannot believe nobody has said anything about that! that is much more illegal than people wheeling on sewer or powerline easements and yet i see them getting flamed....where's the flaming on this? it's illegal too.....why do you all look the other way on this? illegal is still illegal.:confused:
 
dirtySouth said:
:shaking:
wow I cannot believe nobody has said anything about that! that is much more illegal than people wheeling on sewer or powerline easements and yet i see them getting flamed....where's the flaming on this? it's illegal too.....why do you all look the other way on this? illegal is still illegal.:confused:
Click to expand...
Is it illegal? Yes. Does it fall under the same scrutiny as tresspassing and give our sport a bad name? No.

I've known people that have done it. Say you pretty much build a jeep from the ground up using parts from everything under the sun, yet there's no VIN. Ok, so now you buy a "parts jeep" that has a title but is nowhere near roadworthy and never will be....... Is there a victim in this case?
 
dirtySouth said:
:shaking:
wow I cannot believe nobody has said anything about that! that is much more illegal than people wheeling on sewer or powerline easements and yet i see them getting flamed....where's the flaming on this? it's illegal too.....why do you all look the other way on this? illegal is still illegal.:confused:
Click to expand...

In the Vin ta case, if he screws up, he gets screwed and may lose his vehicle and at worst serve a lil time for grand theft (thats a stretch but WORSE case)

Trespassing on my land just because there is a power line or sewer line, causes our entire sport to have a black eye and leads to the losss of legitimate legal wheeling spots. See the difference?

Its kinda like this, I dont care how much crack you smoke, you are only killing yourself, but if you drink and drive I have a real problem with it.
 
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