Small dozer questions

hunterdan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2009
Location
Morganton,NC
I'm looking into buying a small dozer.
I've had Cat 420, NH 555E backhoe' & a mini x. They were great at the time for heavier chores. Now I need something that can multitask.
So far I like the small dozers made by Nortrac. There about 30HP diesel with 6 way blade. Also have 3 point with down pressure +PT0 for bush hog, auger... I would also have a backhoe attachment for it.
I know a case 350/450 would be a stronger machine but most are rough and need $ put in them. Plus no 3 point.
Will just be using for light stuffšŸ˜
Thoughts and suggestions appreciated.Cat pic is a joke...or is it?

Video link of it or 1 similar.
2:25 of vid shows impressive speed and maneuverability.

 

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I, too, really like the concept, size, and price of that Nortrac. Too bad they are chicom junk...read up on the reviews of them. Kubota would probably sell a million of them if they came up with something similar.

Tracked skidsteer with a 6 way blade would work for me.
 
sounds like a tracked skid steer is going to be a better option for what your wanting, it will be faster and smoother operating and easier to fix than those nortrac. Sounds like you want something tracked to do tractor work with light grading from time to time.

skid steer would be more expensive most likely, but there are a million attachments for them. and if its something you might not use that often you can rent the attachments easily.
we have a D3 and a SLV-75 at work, hands down id rather have the SLV than a dozer with a 3 point for 99% of stuff id want to do with a small dozer
 
I, too, really like the concept, size, and price of that Nortrac. Too bad they are chicom junk...read up on the reviews of them. Kubota would probably sell a million of them if they came up with something similar.

Tracked skidsteer with a 6 way blade would work for me.
Yeah Chinese stuff is usually crap.
I found a dedicated forum on these along with these under different badges...east wind/yunchai? There are bad reviews for sure but also really positive reviews. There are some things that have to be checked when getting one. Change all fluids, make sure all adjustments are made on clutches and such. Many people buy one from northern tool and just start working them hard. This is why many have trouble in first 50hours.
 
I will get back on my soap box and say avoid chinesium! The model change over (to address issues, make parts cheaper, CREATE issues) means that getting the parts you need for something major that failed can be impossible.

What's worse, without a dealer network, you get to order the part, have it delivered, then have no support to send it back/get a refund.

Let's say they have discovered a pump failure at the mounting flange....they change the flange AND the mating part. They then discontinue the old flange design and you have to fabri-coble the junk together. In the event the mating piece is something big, like the transmission housing....you are pooched.

Don't bank on maintenance getting you around poor design, heat treatment, casting issues, etc.
 
I started looking at case 350/450. Found out that with missing hrs gauge, bad steering clutches and 40 percent undercarriage is 8-10k and no 3 point.
These little jima dozers can be found for 5-8k and low hrs. Also, parts can be found all along the highways according to some.
 
As long as 5-8k is throwaway money, ok. When an unrepairable event happens...just get another one for 5-8k. (And then have a parts machine on hand...then another, then another.)

If I saw one for 5k running, I might be interested....that get's into the realm of buying the tool is the same or cheaper than paying labor to have something done.
 
As mentioned, I can find a low hr (300hrs or less) one for 5-7k They are 22k new.
My Deere/cats would cost that for final drives and sprokets
Also,Called about a radiator for a case dozer..they said you'll need to make one.
The small and used to be
affordable Case, Deere ... Dozers and skid steers aren't the best deal anymore. It may have a rebuilt motoršŸ˜and need everything else.šŸ˜•

I've also had trouble getting older stuff worked on and finding parts. Seems like those experienced in them are retired/dead or busy.
 
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So how slow would a bush hog be behind one of these? I can't imagine it's efficient at all.
 
Sounds to me like you need a 35 hp 2wd tractor or 30 4wd tractor. with a front loader, or a freakin tracked skid steer. Just because you're comfortable with a dozer doesn't mean its what you need. Front blade operaters never understand rear blade operaters, and vice versa, it's black and white. I have a 1978 Ford 340 industrial tractor which is 53 hp. Frame built integrel front loader and 3 point hitch from Hell and I know how to make it rock. With this tractor and a 72" box blade I can do anything needed that a light dozer can do, and with flair! lol
 
I have so much to say, but no patience to type it.

There's an older ASV (2810 maybe?) that is a tracked skidsteer with a 3pt hitch configuration and a flippable seat so you can run skidsteer attachments and go forward, or run 3pt equipment and pull it behind you.
 
I vote for the baby CAT in the middle pic just because it's so cute.
I could probably talk my wife into buying one of those!
 
As long as 5-8k is throwaway money, ok. When an unrepairable event happens...just get another one for 5-8k. (And then have a parts machine on hand...then another, then another.)

If I saw one for 5k running, I might be interested....that get's into the realm of buying the tool is the same or cheaper than paying labor to have something done.
Yep, I see them for 5-7 pretty often.
So how slow would a bush hog be behind one of these? I can't imagine it's efficient at all.
Probably not efficient but I only have two cleared areas about 1.5 acres
Sounds to me like you need a 35 hp 2wd tractor or 30 4wd tractor. with a front loader, or a freakin tracked skid steer. Just because you're comfortable with a dozer doesn't mean its what you need. Front blade operaters never understand rear blade operaters, and vice versa, it's black and white. I have a 1978 Ford 340 industrial tractor which is 53 hp. Frame built integrel front loader and 3 point hitch from Hell and I know how to make it rock. With this tractor and a 72" box blade I can do anything needed that a light dozer can do, and with flair! lol
Cool. How do you angle and tilt your loader?
I have so much to say, but no patience to type it.

There's an older ASV (2810 maybe?) that is a tracked skidsteer with a 3pt hitch configuration and a flippable seat so you can run skidsteer attachments and go forward, or run 3pt equipment and pull it behind you.
Sounds perfect. What would one of those cost with a 6 way blade and not wore out?

I need something that can do minor grading and finish work with 6 way blade, backhoe attachment, pull a bush hog, auger for post holes. About the only thing I couldn't do with the nortrac is load.
Chinese equipment does scare me. A low quality component can kill you.
My son's taotao atv almost did him in A cheap cotter pin broke at front wheel and immediately flipped the atv. It was hard to believe such an important part could be so cheap.
I'll most likely end up with a tractor
 
Anyone want to haul a tractor from grassy Creek,NC to Morganton...today?
About 1:45 minutes north of Morganton
$500
 
Email is down at work, so here goes :D
I've had Cat 420, NH 555E backhoe' & a mini x. They were great at the time for heavier chores. Now I need something that can multitask.
Backhoe's used to be the ultimate "multitasking" machine. Only problem was they couldn't run attachments, were large and heavy, difficult to manuever, and not very good at cutting dirt. They could do all dirt related tasks inefficiently. Pros have migrated towards skidsteers and mini-ex's, and homeowners have migrated towards 4x4 compact tractors with FEL and BH. There's good reason for both, and again, all are a compromise.
So far I like the small dozers made by Nortrac. There about 30HP diesel with 6 way blade. Also have 3 point with down pressure +PT0 for bush hog, auger... I would also have a backhoe attachment for it.
In concept they are very neat and seem to check a lot of boxes. In execution, it will probably be able to most everything, and not really be good at anything.
I, too, really like the concept, size, and price of that Nortrac. Too bad they are chicom junk...read up on the reviews of them. Kubota would probably sell a million of them if they came up with something similar.
You are absolutely correct about making a killing if one of the "big names" came out with something like this. And actually Case kinda has (DL550B, except its not really available, it's been a SEMA queen for several years), but it going to be in that $100k price range, so not at a mass market price point. And it weighs 18k pounds, so not small enough for the average homeowner or landscaping crew. The dozer blade and C-frame alone weigh 2300lbs.
Tracked skidsteer with a 6 way blade would work for me.
sounds like a tracked skid steer is going to be a better option for what your wanting, it will be faster and smoother operating and easier to fix than those nortrac. we have a D3 and a SLV-75 at work, hands down id rather have the SLV than a dozer with a 3 point for 99% of stuff id want to do with a small dozer
I had a Komatsu D21 9k pound dozer for about 10 years, bought a tracked skid steer, then bought a 6 way dozer blade for the skidsteer, then sold the small dozer. The skidsteer with a dozer blade is nowhere near as good for cutting dirt, pushing trees, and other "real" dozer tasks, but it makes up for it in speed, manueverability, ease of use, and the ability to swap attachments that work well. I can pull one machine to a job site and mow down brush for a trail, take 1 minute to slap the dozer blade on and knock out the stumps and level the ground and shape the crown and ditches to make that trail into a roadbed, then 2 minutes later I'm switched over and running a bucket and scooping and spreading gravel for a driveway, then stick a harley rake on there and go down the sides to prep for grass. A forestry mulcher would be better for reducing material mass, a dozer would be better for grading the roadbed, a dumptruck would be better for spreading gravel, and a tractor might be better for smoothing gravel. But I can have a pile of gravel pre delivered and then do all of this with one machine and not have to make several trips or try to time anything with weather or other people. It's a little different for a home use machine because transport isn't involved, but it all comes down to maximum flexibility.
As mentioned, I can find a low hr (300hrs or less) one for 5-7k They are 22k new.
There's a reason the depreciation is so much. Go find a low hour name brand machine of any type, and let me know what the depreciation is. Even high hour stuff is 50% of new price. That's not to say deals can't be found, but there's a reason the market allows the prices to be so high. They are made for day in, day out durability. That doesn't mean things never break, but it does mean that you can get parts and get back to work, and that stupid stuff doesn't break all the time because of poor design.
I've also had trouble getting older stuff worked on and finding parts. Seems like those experienced in them are retired/dead or busy.
This is very true, and if you're not willing or able to work on things yourself, you need to buy new stuff with a warranty, and if you can't transport it, you better get it from a company that has a service fleet that will come to you.
So how slow would a bush hog be behind one of these? I can't imagine it's efficient at all.
I imagine it could be plenty fast if you could handle the rough ride. The shorter the length of track on ground, the more of a bucking ride you will get, and these little dozers have a very short track length. Looks to be around 4-5 feet. Also, if its an area that you care at all what it looks like, the tracks are going to destroy the turf. Even rubber tracked machines are hard on grass and field, and a steel tracked machine is going to be even worse.
Sounds to me like you need a 35 hp 2wd tractor or 30 4wd tractor. with a front loader, or a freakin tracked skid steer. Just because you're comfortable with a dozer doesn't mean its what you need. Front blade operaters never understand rear blade operaters, and vice versa, it's black and white. I have a 1978 Ford 340 industrial tractor which is 53 hp. Frame built integrel front loader and 3 point hitch from Hell and I know how to make it rock. With this tractor and a 72" box blade I can do anything needed that a light dozer can do, and with flair! lol
I'd say more like 40+hp industrial grade machine, but yes, a "big" 4x4 tractor with 3pt is a hell of a handy machine.
With this tractor and a 72" box blade I can do anything needed that a light dozer can do, and with flair! lol
Now you're getting a little carried away ;)
Sounds perfect. What would one of those cost with a 6 way blade and not wore out?
They are all 20+ years old, so good luck finding one that is not worn out. Even if you could find one, they are probably $10-15k for worn out junk, or $20k for a decent one with the way prices are these days.
I need something that can do minor grading and finish work with 6 way blade, backhoe attachment, pull a bush hog, auger for post holes.
For grading/finish/backhoe/auger, a skidsteer or mini-x is your best bet, depending on if you need more wide grading or trench digging. I've done a ton of wide finish work with the fixed blade on the front of my mini-x. Its not as good as the skidsteer, and not as fast, but because the blade is low and inline with the tracks, it pushes like a champ and can leave a really nice finish too. I think you are asking too much to get a machine that can do all those things and ALSO bushhog. You'd be miles ahead in my opinion to have a cheap old 2wd 30-35hp tractor to bushhog, and a dirtwork machine for everything else. If you only want 1 machine and it has to bushhog, a tractor is your only sensible option if you ask me.
About the only thing I couldn't do with the nortrac is load.
I get it. You want one. But there's a lot you couldn't do with a Nortrac. Like drive down the road and help your neighbor, or turn without tearing up grass, or pickup anything with forks. Everything is a compromise for any of these machines, so its important to quantify what is highest on your priority list.
I'll most likely end up with a tractor
If I were in your shoes I'd try to find a 40-50hp industrial grade 4x4 tractor with FEL. They cost about the same as a homeowner grade compact tractor if you don't care what color it is. Rent a mini-x or call @braxton357 when you need to do backhoe work.

The off brand mini dozer is too much of a compromise, but if you're set on getting a dozer, at least get a Mitsubishi BD2 or Komatsu D20 or D21. My Komatsu D21 was from the 70s, about 4 generations old, and I had no issue getting parts from the Komatsu dealer. I also almost never had to get any. In 10+ years of ownership, I replaced the usual filters, the batteries, a couple hydraulic hoses, 1 track tensioner seal, and 1 starter. Everything just worked and kept on working, even at 4k hours as a Japanese grey market dozer that was probably repainted and got a new hour meter when imported.
 
Email is down at work, so here goes :D

Backhoe's used to be the ultimate "multitasking" machine. Only problem was they couldn't run attachments, were large and heavy, difficult to manuever, and not very good at cutting dirt. They could do all dirt related tasks inefficiently. Pros have migrated towards skidsteers and mini-ex's, and homeowners have migrated towards 4x4 compact tractors with FEL and BH. There's good reason for both, and again, all are a compromise.

In concept they are very neat and seem to check a lot of boxes. In execution, it will probably be able to most everything, and not really be good at anything.

You are absolutely correct about making a killing if one of the "big names" came out with something like this. And actually Case kinda has (DL550B, except its not really available, it's been a SEMA queen for several years), but it going to be in that $100k price range, so not at a mass market price point. And it weighs 18k pounds, so not small enough for the average homeowner or landscaping crew. The dozer blade and C-frame alone weigh 2300lbs.


I had a Komatsu D21 9k pound dozer for about 10 years, bought a tracked skid steer, then bought a 6 way dozer blade for the skidsteer, then sold the small dozer. The skidsteer with a dozer blade is nowhere near as good for cutting dirt, pushing trees, and other "real" dozer tasks, but it makes up for it in speed, manueverability, ease of use, and the ability to swap attachments that work well. I can pull one machine to a job site and mow down brush for a trail, take 1 minute to slap the dozer blade on and knock out the stumps and level the ground and shape the crown and ditches to make that trail into a roadbed, then 2 minutes later I'm switched over and running a bucket and scooping and spreading gravel for a driveway, then stick a harley rake on there and go down the sides to prep for grass. A forestry mulcher would be better for reducing material mass, a dozer would be better for grading the roadbed, a dumptruck would be better for spreading gravel, and a tractor might be better for smoothing gravel. But I can have a pile of gravel pre delivered and then do all of this with one machine and not have to make several trips or try to time anything with weather or other people. It's a little different for a home use machine because transport isn't involved, but it all comes down to maximum flexibility.

There's a reason the depreciation is so much. Go find a low hour name brand machine of any type, and let me know what the depreciation is. Even high hour stuff is 50% of new price. That's not to say deals can't be found, but there's a reason the market allows the prices to be so high. They are made for day in, day out durability. That doesn't mean things never break, but it does mean that you can get parts and get back to work, and that stupid stuff doesn't break all the time because of poor design.

This is very true, and if you're not willing or able to work on things yourself, you need to buy new stuff with a warranty, and if you can't transport it, you better get it from a company that has a service fleet that will come to you.

I imagine it could be plenty fast if you could handle the rough ride. The shorter the length of track on ground, the more of a bucking ride you will get, and these little dozers have a very short track length. Looks to be around 4-5 feet. Also, if its an area that you care at all what it looks like, the tracks are going to destroy the turf. Even rubber tracked machines are hard on grass and field, and a steel tracked machine is going to be even worse.

I'd say more like 40+hp industrial grade machine, but yes, a "big" 4x4 tractor with 3pt is a hell of a handy machine.

Now you're getting a little carried away ;)

They are all 20+ years old, so good luck finding one that is not worn out. Even if you could find one, they are probably $10-15k for worn out junk, or $20k for a decent one with the way prices are these days.

For grading/finish/backhoe/auger, a skidsteer or mini-x is your best bet, depending on if you need more wide grading or trench digging. I've done a ton of wide finish work with the fixed blade on the front of my mini-x. Its not as good as the skidsteer, and not as fast, but because the blade is low and inline with the tracks, it pushes like a champ and can leave a really nice finish too. I think you are asking too much to get a machine that can do all those things and ALSO bushhog. You'd be miles ahead in my opinion to have a cheap old 2wd 30-35hp tractor to bushhog, and a dirtwork machine for everything else. If you only want 1 machine and it has to bushhog, a tractor is your only sensible option if you ask me.

I get it. You want one. But there's a lot you couldn't do with a Nortrac. Like drive down the road and help your neighbor, or turn without tearing up grass, or pickup anything with forks. Everything is a compromise for any of these machines, so its important to quantify what is highest on your priority list.

If I were in your shoes I'd try to find a 40-50hp industrial grade 4x4 tractor with FEL. They cost about the same as a homeowner grade compact tractor if you don't care what color it is. Rent a mini-x or call @braxton357 when you need to do backhoe work.

The off brand mini dozer is too much of a compromise, but if you're set on getting a dozer, at least get a Mitsubishi BD2 or Komatsu D20 or D21. My Komatsu D21 was from the 70s, about 4 generations old, and I had no issue getting parts from the Komatsu dealer. I also almost never had to get any. In 10+ years of ownership, I replaced the usual filters, the batteries, a couple hydraulic hoses, 1 track tensioner seal, and 1 starter. Everything just worked and kept on working, even at 4k hours as a Japanese grey market dozer that was probably repainted and got a new hour meter when imported.
Wow! Thanks for taking the time. Lots of good info.. I'm gonna take a screenshot .
Found this today. Isn't what I'm looking for but will be handy. My wife won't be too scared of this one.šŸ˜†
 

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Email is down at work, so here goes :D

Backhoe's used to be the ultimate "multitasking" machine. Only problem was they couldn't run attachments, were large and heavy, difficult to manuever, and not very good at cutting dirt. They could do all dirt related tasks inefficiently. Pros have migrated towards skidsteers and mini-ex's, and homeowners have migrated towards 4x4 compact tractors with FEL and BH. There's good reason for both, and again, all are a compromise.

In concept they are very neat and seem to check a lot of boxes. In execution, it will probably be able to most everything, and not really be good at anything.

You are absolutely correct about making a killing if one of the "big names" came out with something like this. And actually Case kinda has (DL550B, except its not really available, it's been a SEMA queen for several years), but it going to be in that $100k price range, so not at a mass market price point. And it weighs 18k pounds, so not small enough for the average homeowner or landscaping crew. The dozer blade and C-frame alone weigh 2300lbs.


I had a Komatsu D21 9k pound dozer for about 10 years, bought a tracked skid steer, then bought a 6 way dozer blade for the skidsteer, then sold the small dozer. The skidsteer with a dozer blade is nowhere near as good for cutting dirt, pushing trees, and other "real" dozer tasks, but it makes up for it in speed, manueverability, ease of use, and the ability to swap attachments that work well. I can pull one machine to a job site and mow down brush for a trail, take 1 minute to slap the dozer blade on and knock out the stumps and level the ground and shape the crown and ditches to make that trail into a roadbed, then 2 minutes later I'm switched over and running a bucket and scooping and spreading gravel for a driveway, then stick a harley rake on there and go down the sides to prep for grass. A forestry mulcher would be better for reducing material mass, a dozer would be better for grading the roadbed, a dumptruck would be better for spreading gravel, and a tractor might be better for smoothing gravel. But I can have a pile of gravel pre delivered and then do all of this with one machine and not have to make several trips or try to time anything with weather or other people. It's a little different for a home use machine because transport isn't involved, but it all comes down to maximum flexibility.

There's a reason the depreciation is so much. Go find a low hour name brand machine of any type, and let me know what the depreciation is. Even high hour stuff is 50% of new price. That's not to say deals can't be found, but there's a reason the market allows the prices to be so high. They are made for day in, day out durability. That doesn't mean things never break, but it does mean that you can get parts and get back to work, and that stupid stuff doesn't break all the time because of poor design.

This is very true, and if you're not willing or able to work on things yourself, you need to buy new stuff with a warranty, and if you can't transport it, you better get it from a company that has a service fleet that will come to you.

I imagine it could be plenty fast if you could handle the rough ride. The shorter the length of track on ground, the more of a bucking ride you will get, and these little dozers have a very short track length. Looks to be around 4-5 feet. Also, if its an area that you care at all what it looks like, the tracks are going to destroy the turf. Even rubber tracked machines are hard on grass and field, and a steel tracked machine is going to be even worse.

I'd say more like 40+hp industrial grade machine, but yes, a "big" 4x4 tractor with 3pt is a hell of a handy machine.

Now you're getting a little carried away ;)

They are all 20+ years old, so good luck finding one that is not worn out. Even if you could find one, they are probably $10-15k for worn out junk, or $20k for a decent one with the way prices are these days.

For grading/finish/backhoe/auger, a skidsteer or mini-x is your best bet, depending on if you need more wide grading or trench digging. I've done a ton of wide finish work with the fixed blade on the front of my mini-x. Its not as good as the skidsteer, and not as fast, but because the blade is low and inline with the tracks, it pushes like a champ and can leave a really nice finish too. I think you are asking too much to get a machine that can do all those things and ALSO bushhog. You'd be miles ahead in my opinion to have a cheap old 2wd 30-35hp tractor to bushhog, and a dirtwork machine for everything else. If you only want 1 machine and it has to bushhog, a tractor is your only sensible option if you ask me.

I get it. You want one. But there's a lot you couldn't do with a Nortrac. Like drive down the road and help your neighbor, or turn without tearing up grass, or pickup anything with forks. Everything is a compromise for any of these machines, so its important to quantify what is highest on your priority list.

If I were in your shoes I'd try to find a 40-50hp industrial grade 4x4 tractor with FEL. They cost about the same as a homeowner grade compact tractor if you don't care what color it is. Rent a mini-x or call @braxton357 when you need to do backhoe work.

The off brand mini dozer is too much of a compromise, but if you're set on getting a dozer, at least get a Mitsubishi BD2 or Komatsu D20 or D21. My Komatsu D21 was from the 70s, about 4 generations old, and I had no issue getting parts from the Komatsu dealer. I also almost never had to get any. In 10+ years of ownership, I replaced the usual filters, the batteries, a couple hydraulic hoses, 1 track tensioner seal, and 1 starter. Everything just worked and kept on working, even at 4k hours as a Japanese grey market dozer that was probably repainted and got a new hour meter when imported.

You type all that on your drive home from work today?
 
I'm not going to quote or reply per already answered replies. Yes a tractor boxblade can angle as needed be it a manual crank or hydraulic. IF you have dozer experience and IF you have a dozer then do your thing. I'm saying you can have a more all around machine with a heavy duty wheel tractor with correct implements and a competent operator.
 
Backhoe's used to be the ultimate "multitasking" machine.
I've always said that a backhoe is the spork of equipment. Better that nothing but it leaves you wanting anything else.

You'd be miles ahead in my opinion to have a cheap old 2wd 30-35hp tractor to bushhog, and a dirtwork machine for everything else.
I did a bunch of side work for a local farmer that told me if the pto isn't spinning he has no need for a tractor. He used a skid steer for most everything. Even loaded and unloaded hay with it.
 
I did a bunch of side work for a local farmer that told me if the pto isn't spinning he has no need for a tractor. He used a skid steer for most everything. Even loaded and unloaded hay with it.

theymake things alot easier. most are 1/2 the length of a tractor and you can do a 360 on itself. and they have just about any attachment you can think of for a skidsteer now. and the new JCB extendable boom ones are freaking sweet, im pushing for those at our work now.
 
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