**updated**-Dave Ramsey anyone?

Been talking to the wife about getting a credit card with rewards. I currently have a credit card through a credit union that I got back in high school with a $500 limit on it (So I didn't get myself in trouble) and have never raised it. I like the idea of the Amazon credit card, since we do purchase a good amount on there. Is Nerdwallet.com a good place to compare and contrast current credit cards?
 
I thought you were staring the Dave Ramsey plan?
If you are you ill be cutting up and cancelling all your credit cards...
 
Been talking to the wife about getting a credit card with rewards. I currently have a credit card through a credit union that I got back in high school with a $500 limit on it (So I didn't get myself in trouble) and have never raised it. I like the idea of the Amazon credit card, since we do purchase a good amount on there. Is Nerdwallet.com a good place to compare and contrast current credit cards?
As it relates specifically to that credit card you got in HS...do NOT cancel it. Keep it open as that helps establish credit history (I've got something very similar and the CC is active but it just sits in a drawer). Even if you're not using it...keep it open because it shows a longer track record of your credit worthiness.
 
As it relates specifically to that credit card you got in HS...do NOT cancel it. Keep it open as that helps establish credit history (I've got something very similar and the CC is active but it just sits in a drawer). Even if you're not using it...keep it open because it shows a longer track record of your credit worthiness.

I’ve got a cc that was cut up 2-3 years ago but still active for what you said


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Even if you're not using it...keep it open because it shows a longer track record of your credit worthiness.

Generally, if a card doesn't get used for a year or so, they'll cancel it. You can put a recurring charge (phone bill, cable bill, etc) on the card to prevent that from happening.
 
As it relates specifically to that credit card you got in HS...do NOT cancel it. Keep it open as that helps establish credit history (I've got something very similar and the CC is active but it just sits in a drawer). Even if you're not using it...keep it open because it shows a longer track record of your credit worthiness.
Oh yeah, haven't used it in a while. just sits at home. Was always told not to cancel any existing CC's.
 
I thought you were staring the Dave Ramsey plan?
If you are you ill be cutting up and cancelling all your credit cards...
^^^^^^^previous posts above for not canceling old CC.
Obviously not 100% Dave Ramsey.
About maintaining credit. I'm on the fence about this too. I am all for getting out of debt. But if you do get to the point where you have 3-6 months saved up you should never need a credit card. Seems very foreign to me and many others I'm sure.

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But if you do get to the point where you have 3-6 months saved up you should never need a credit card. Seems very foreign to me and many others I'm sure.

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For me it's not about 'needing' a credit card, it's about the rewards. Spend money on stuff I'd be buying anyway, get an extra $500-1000 in cash back.
 
About maintaining credit. I'm on the fence about this too. I am all for getting out of debt. But if you do get to the point where you have 3-6 months saved up you should never need a credit card. Seems very foreign to me and many others I'm sure.

I think we have different definitions of usage cases for "need". I use one of my cards all the time for online shopping and at restaurants, because I "need" it for fraud security and because it's sandboxed from my bank account. I don't "need" to use it to buy a bunch of stuff I can't afford.

Are you just talking about using a credit card as a safety net?
 
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No I'm sure you can have a debit card that would do the same thing, for security, other than the points.
Dont get me wrong I dont subscribe to the DR 100% either but that is what he is about, no credit card period. No need for a credit history, everything is paid for by cash. Except maybe a house which there are lenders out there that will mortgage a home without credit.

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No I'm sure you can have a debit card that would do the same thing, for security, other than the points.

I'd much rather use the credit card, because that doesn't disrupt/lockdown/etc. my bank account at all during a fraud event, even on a weekend or after banking hours. I don't care about points, I have a low interest rate instead (cards these days are ridiculously high). And a low limit on the card, for an absolute liability cap. And if I'm travelling and my card is compromised, I have a backup card or can use my debit card to get cash. You can't do that if your debit card just got frozen by a fraud detection algorithm.


I'm just not enough of a binary thinker to be convinced that credit cards are inherently bad just because they're credit cards.
 
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Oh yeah, haven't used it in a while. just sits at home. Was always told not to cancel any existing CC's.

I personally feel you shouldn’t bother with any credit card until you are debt free (minus the house) and have 3 months saved, and most importantly that you and the wife are on the same page financially.

I have a card with rewards, but that’s because I get $500/month at my job to entertain customers. I turn in receipts and they reimburse me. So at the end of the year I get free money.

Being you’re still trying to get out of the hole and get started, don’t bother getting another card right now as there’s no benefit. While you’re doing the snowball you shouldn’t be putting anything on it so no rewards. Once you get out and saved up, then consider practicing smart credit card use, and start with the one you already have. Maybe just gas for the month.

I still need to reply to your PM. My bad.
 
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I personally feel you shouldn’t bother with any credit card until you are debt free (minus the house) and have 3 months saved, and most importantly that you and the wife are on the same page financially.

I have a card with rewards, but that’s because I get $500/month at my job to entertain customers. I turn in receipts and they reimburse me. So at the end of the year I get free money.

Being you’re still trying to get out of the hole and get started, don’t bother getting another card right now as there’s no benefit. While you’re doing the snowball you shouldn’t be putting anything on it so no rewards. Once you get out and saved up, then consider practicing smart credit card use, and start with the one you already have. Maybe just gas for the month.

I still need to reply to your PM. My bad.
Nah you're good. I appreciate the info. Was just curious on the CC with cash back. Haven't gotten into the "snowball" yet, so I am still learning the lingo and effects.
 
Nah you're good. I appreciate the info. Was just curious on the CC with cash back. Haven't gotten into the "snowball" yet, so I am still learning the lingo and effects.

As someone in probably a similar spot I would not recommend using a CC, cash back just isn't worth it. @77GreenMachine has been a positive enough influence on me to actually start making steps toward being debt free. Just I'm not putting forth complete effort as I still like to wheel, just not adding to the debt as I had in the past.
 
I'd much rather use the credit card, because that doesn't disrupt/lockdown/etc. my bank account at all during a fraud event, even on a weekend or after banking hours. I don't care about points, I have a low interest rate instead (cards these days are ridiculously high). And a low limit on the card, for an absolute liability cap. And if I'm travelling and my card is compromised, I have a backup card or can use my debit card to get cash. You can't do that if your debit card just got frozen by a fraud detection algorithm.


I'm just not enough of a binary thinker to be convinced that credit cards are inherently bad just because they're credit cards.
This.

Ive mentioned before that I live Dave's way but not his plan. Credit cards are one of two area I diverge greatly.

I had a debit card get compromised by some dude in Wilmington. They wiped the account out. Eventually I got my money back but with debit cards they have 90 days to complete their investigations. This was long enough ago that we mailed house payments and such and they crossed in the mail and the mortgage check bounced. So then we had NSF fees and we got hit with a bad check fee by wells fargo...and then I had the issue that my savings had rollover protection on my checking...it was a rough stretch of time. Eventually our money was returned, but not the fees and it triggerred a clause in our mortgage that we lost our .5% excellent customer rate...I argued and got that reinstated..

But I will NEVER use a debit card again. It is the worst of both worlds. I use a credit card but rarely if ever carry a balance over month to month. (Just checked - Ive paid $7.38 in interest this year)

But for people who are just learning financial discipline who already are in debt...live without them. Its like teaching a kid with wobbly legs still trying to figure out alking and you put him right on a sport bike before he learns a bicycle...
 
^^^ With @Ron on this 100%.

I cannot remember the last time I used my debit card for anything besides getting cash from an ATM.
This is an area Ramsey and I disagree.
Credit cards are extremely useful when used responsibly. Wife and I each have a primary card we use for pretty much everything.
She uses an Amazon card, b/c yeah, we spend a lot there already and it pays back well. I have an AAdvantage card that gets decent points on air mileage. Really I got it b/c there was a great promo initially, soon I'll probbaly change over to a different oen w/ more generally usable points.
We literally put every transaction possible on credit; the only things we don't, and things we can't - mortgage, utilities, etc.
The key is, we pay off the balance 100% every month. So tehre is never nay interest paid. And we make that payment right after our monthly "allowance" payment come into our checking account.
In that respect, its really nice b/c we have lined up all of our bilsl and expenses to happen at the same general time, so that a week after the allowance sets, we're all paid up so that anything left is extra to coast forward on. No more guessing if we'll have enough to get through the month.
 
Alright so @Cherokeekid88 asked me in a PM at what point into the debt pay off plan did I start to feel things turn for the better. I figured I'd answer that here for anyone else to read as well to encourage them. It is a long, complicated answer, and results will vary based on anyone's particular debt situation, and income as well as life events.

When we started, my wife had all this stupid debt. Kohls card, Rooms to go, Lowes card, HH Greg. She had literally financed her furniture, TV, and several things she HAD to have as a single mother recently divorced. It wasn't huge balances, $1800 here, $900 there, $1200. But the payments were $25, $55, $40, and we weren't getting ahead of the interest. So we listed every debt balance from highest to smallest and threw all our extra moeny at the smallest one. It was the Kohls card I believe, only $400 balance. We paid it off in 2 months from our start and snowballed that over to the next one.
Now when we started this, we did not have much extra money at all. We very much lived paycheck to paycheck. We cut all the extra stuff out, I stopped wheeling, my wife stopped getting her hair and nails done, I stopped dipping, started packing my lunch, we stopped eating out except for once a week. That's where our extra money was going so we used that to start knocking the debt out.

So we saw some small success within 4 months with about 3 small balances paid off, then our payments to the next bill in line were getting bigger. Like $400/month going to a debt with a balance of $1200. You need those small successes like that cause they keep you motivated and on track.
So, to speed the process up I made even more sacrifices. I sold my Wrangler for $4k and we instantly paid off several things. We used almost all of our tax refund and knocked out huge chunks. I sold another car I had and put that towards debt too.

Now, I want everyone to understand something important-we still did things and had fun, we just did it with a budget. We still spent a week at the beach, other small trips, even went to Disney while in the "snowball" phase. You have to live a little while you're doing this or you will get burnt out. Just be smart about it and budget for it.

The short answer is within 4 months we had lots of extra money, but we put ALL that extra money into our snowball. Around 8 months in we really started to see a difference in our lives. We had more breathing room all those small bills were gone. We were really down to one car loan, school loans, 1 credit card. It was so much easier having just a few payments going out each month rather than 12-14 different bills due at different times. 1 year in things were very different for us.

During this phase many life events happened. I went from making $20/hr to $12/hr, then within 8 months of that change my income had surpassed my previous income. I was really only able to afford the pay cut because we had paid off some debt already. We decided to have a kid, sold a house, bought a house, bought a van, went to Disney. Son was born and required extensive surgery, then the wife needed surgery just 3 months later. My income went up again, wifes income went down as she reduced her hours to be with the kids more.

It originally should have taken us just under 2 years to pay everything off when we started, but with all of that it took just over 3 years. Things come up, life changes, and you need to live a little in between. Just adjust as needed, and stick with it. Once you start the snowball, you should see improvements within 4-6 months and huge improvements after 8 months. But again there is lots of variables for this.
 
^^^On that note...I still have my first 'snowball plan' from about 8 years ago (wow that's tough to read as a pasted excel file)...it's ugly. But we were a couple years out of school, didn't understand how the world worked and thought $50k between the two of us was a metric ass ton of money. We had About $100k worth of debt and $2600/month in standard bills. but we managed to get it paid off in about 3-4 years, then decided to ball out again, racked up some credit card debt and car payments and started over. Today, I just have my mortgage and took on a new car note for the wife and I'll be doing it again for me, but we're in a much better financial place than we were 8 years ago too. We cut that 'lunches/dinner' and 'other' category down to almost zero. I got rid of a storage building I was renting and just parked my junk outside. Reduced tv/internet/phone to the bare minimum. Verizon bill was reduced to a 12gb plan (which we still have today). Groceries, we got real comfortable with a college food budget again (think ramen/spaghettios or whatever else you can do for .99). We also lived in some sketch ass places too for $400/month a couple times early on to save even more money. And all that allowed us to start tackling debt.


Student Loans
Provider Balance Interest Rate Rate Type Monthly Payment Minimum
First Mark $ 36,916.55 6.49 Fixed $ 339.06
AES $ 7,403.89 5.00 Var $ 50.00
FedLoan $ 17,044.26 6.25 Fixed $ 137.44
FedLoan $ 27,247.55 6.25 Fixed $ 219.73
FedLoan $ 819.22 6.80 Fixed $ 44.60
FedLoan $ 527.11 5.60 Fixed $ 31.28
Total $ 822.11
Other Debt
Belk-Credit Card $ 1,981.44 24.49 Variable $ 58.00
BoA Credit Card $ 10,784.37 13.74 Variable $ 281.00
Total $ 339.00
Monthly Bills
Drop Box $ 9.99
Car Insurance $ 148.20
TV/Internet/Phone $ 250.00
Verizon $ 180.00
Electricity $ 180.00
Rent $ 800.00
Natural Gas $ 25.00
Groceries $ 750.00
Gas $ 300.00
Total $ 2,643.19
Grand Total $ 3,804.30
Storage Rent $ 250.00
Lunches/Dinners $ 500.00
Car Payment $ 480.00
Other $ 500.00
Total $ 1,730.00
 
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We started our snowballing journey back in 2011 as well. I like to pull out the old spreadsheets occasionally just as a reminder about how far we’ve come. I will never forget the turning point: our power and water both got shut off within a few days of each other.

Today we are debt-free minus mortgage and a car payment from needing a new car after my wife’s accident this year. Could have paid cash for a new car, but that wouldn’t be the best move mathematically with the current interest rates. We still get curve balls and spending discipline is a constant struggle.

Reward CCs are fantastic, but wait until you get your consumer debt paid off and a disciplined system in place to control your spending before opening up a new account.

It takes a lot of hard work and delayed-gratification, but the freedom makes it totally worth it! I would also be glad to recommend books, reference materials, or advice on any particular aspect of the journey if anyone wants.
 
Only vaguely familiar with Dave Ramsey's general process bc of this thread and I've rarely listened to his radio show. I will say, based on answers I've heard him give, he'd tell you to sell your almost-paid-off car and buy the cheapest POS you can find that serves the purpose. I get that you might use the net cash to pay down debt but I still disagree with it if the car you have is more reliable.

Lay it all out in a spreadsheet so you both can see it. What comes in, what goes back out, with the balance at the end of the month. Go back through your accounts over the last 6 months and lay it all out in Excel or Google docs or whatever. If it's a negative balance, seeing it in red can really bring it home to both of you. ADD UP THOSE MONTHLY TOTALS. How much did you overspend over the course of the past six months? If you've saved, you have something to work with to put toward your debt, but if you're in debt you probably aren't saving anything and you need to put on your big boy and girl pants and get to work.

Now come to terms with the fact that your debt is an emergency.

Your. debt. is. an. emergency.

The "debt snowball" is triage. However you look at it, figure out what's critical and what isn't. Where can you cut back or what can you give up? Look at where you're just plain overspending. No more going to the mall or Target to kill time. Learn to fix broken things, learn to build things, learn to grow things yourself. Suck it up, buttercup, because your bad habits and debt are eating away at your peace of mind, using up valuable time you could be spending thinking about or doing something you want to do. The stuff you're buying to fill your time is weighing you down.

Set a grocery budget. A real one, where you look at where your money has to go and figure up what's leftover to spend on food. Then make a list of the food you need to last you the week and find the cheapest by unit price. Figure up your total as you go through the store and make decisions based on what you actually need to buy vs. what you want to buy. You aren't shopping for fun. Learn to cook better food at home and take lunches. Just do it.

If you can set a budget and stick to it, I see no problem in using a rewards cc. Use the cash back as built-in savings for Christmas, for example. But you have to stick to your budget and only use the cc for those things and always pay it off. You might need to wait before you implement the cash back card, depending on whatever bad habits got you into debt in the first place.

Speaking of savings, you SHOULD include savings in your monthly outlay. Even a $25/mo transfer from checking to savings can eliminate service fees and start you on the path to building an emergency savings for any of the things other folks have said derailed their efforts to get out from under a mountain of debt. Then look into high-interest savings accounts for emergency savings or for future fun. There are several you can open with low minimum balances, a reasonable monthly transfer amount, and minimal requirements for tied accounts. I have one through Discover that's better than any rate my bank offered and, then, they only offered it on a new account with a huge balance minimum. Here's one from Citi that I just found.
 

It was most definitely stupid...we’d buy a weeks worth of groceries for 3 meals/day, then go out to lunch during the week and dinner Friday/Saturday/Sunday...then two weeks later throw away half of the groceries we bought. Rinse, wash, repeat. One of those things that snowballs to create debt...no harm in a $7 combo for lunch...but then she did it too, plus $25-30 date nights on the weekend...before you know it, you’ve spent $500, and start putting it on a credit card and get out of control.
 
As far as books go, Your Money or Your Life is a classic. I also really enjoyed The Richest Man in Babylon. Believe it or not, Personal Finance For Dummies is good too. I never read any of Dave Ramsey’s stuff. Just picked up on the snowball method from other books or blogs.

On food, my 2019 numbers for family of 4 (kids 9 & 5): avg $787 per month on groceries and $218 per month on restaurants. Not spectacular numbers by any means, but we did eat good this year :)
 
On food, my 2019 numbers for family of 4 (kids 9 & 5): avg $787 per month on groceries and $218 per month on restaurants. Not spectacular numbers by any means, but we did eat good this year :)
That dosn't seem too bad to me, if "restaurants" includes all family meals not coked at home (take out etc).

We set a goal of ~$40-50 per weekend on prepared food. We rarely eat at a sit-down restaurant, mostly b/c we just don't get much out of it. The norm is, wife likes to take off from cooking meals on the weekend. We get take out on Fridays. Normally thats in the $20-25 ballpark. Sometimes we spend it all on a nicer meal like poki bowls or the "good" chinese place. Depending on what it is, leftovers are lunch Sat or sunday, and leftover spending $$ is used for Sat night. Sun night is back to a cooked meal.
One thing is foe sure, as kids get older and eat full size meals, prepared food gets really expensive. Especially if you want to satisfy a teenage boy. Sometimes my wallet kind of misses that little kid with an eating disorder who would eat hardly anything. Now he eats 40% of the total for the family.
 
Met up with @rcalexander105 last night to grab his copy of The Total Money Makeover. Brought it home and wife immediately started reading it, which really impressed me. Currently my wife and I are doing the envelope system. Each time one of us gets paid, I withdraw a portion of the mortgage, pay all the bills that are due and then withdraw money for groceries/entertainment/spending money for that week. We have set a grocery budget and if we go over, it comes out of our spending money. We have been doing this for about 4-5 months and have really seen a huge decrease in how and what we spend our money on. We would go and spend $400-500 a month at the grocery store and then another $400-500 on going out to eat. I live close enough to work, that I can go home and eat there which is a blessing and same for the wife. The only thing we haven't been doing is trying to pay down our debt quicker, which is our next step. I am really excited to get a plan together and execute it. I know this will take some time and discipline, but I am just ready to take control of our finances before it gets really out of hand.
 
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