what is going on with my welder, help

[marty79]

hey guys so my welder all of a sudden started just spewing wire at full speed then made weird sounds (like when you accidently touch the lead to your piece and shorts it out) then it threw the breaker.
It will turn on but wire is stuck wide open.
I disconnected wire circuit and that stops but will only run for maybe 20sec cause you can start hearing the "transformer maybe??" making noise like it's bogging down than throws the breaker..so this sucks major butt cause I'm at a standstill now
Any help ideas anyone, thank you
It's a Century 2225 Solar Welder, 208/230 volts (wired for 230 currently)
The nose it makes sounds to be from rear of machine...

I realized apparently when I was using my plasma cutter on the rear axle and maybe the welder was still on(don't remember) with ground clamp hooked up...would that have done something?

 

[marty79]

Here's the inside of the machine

 

[Scooter402]

So when you switch on the power to the machine, the wire starts automatically feeding? Or it's running full speed when you pull the trigger?

I'd start with some simple diagnosis...get your multimeter out, set it for dc resistance. Check both the wire feed and heat range knobs through their ranges and make sure that they are actually functioning correctly. Once that checks out, go from there to checking other things.

 

[marty79]

So when you switch on the power to the machine, the wire starts automatically feeding? Or it's running full speed when you pull the trigger?

I'd start with some simple diagnosis...get your multimeter out, set it for dc resistance. Check both the wire feed and heat range knobs through their ranges and make sure that they are actually functioning correctly. Once that checks out, go from there to checking other things.

No as soon as you turn the power on The Wire just fees by itself full force and then it makes it sound as if it's arching out and then it throws the breaker.
Google comes up with this being a issue???
216-062-666 Triac Relay 75 amp

 

[marty79]

Well crap, found it. This sucks monkey nuts. Now gotta find an ancient board lol

 

[marty79]

 

[skyhighZJ]

There are all different ones on fleabay. Guess maybe you need the number off the control board to make it a match as I just googled “Century 2225 Solar Welder control board” some look like the picture you posted but I’m not sure on the particulars. Prices were Fromm $165-$215

 

[marty79]

There are all different ones on fleabay. Guess maybe you need the number off the control board to make it a match as I just googled “Century 2225 Solar Welder control board” some look like the picture you posted but I’m not sure on the particulars. Prices were Fromm $165-$215

yeah I saw/found that too. I'm gonna try and get Radio Shack/electrical repair place to try and fix the couple burnt diodes/capacitors first since I'm not sure what fried them. I don't mind buying a new board but can't take the chance of new one getting fried if there is another problem.

So what are the chances that the welder was on, ground clamp hooked up to axle and while using the 220 plasma cutter the voltage passed through the welder since it was running and it overcircuited it?? this all happened right at the same time of using the plasma cutter so it would seem that's what caused it...I wanna believe that's what caused the short in the board (stupid me stupid me) but if I knew this was def the problem, I would invest in the board.
For now my landlord will let me borrow his 220 till I get mine fixed..yeii

 

[skyhighZJ]

Not sure about the crossing currents from plasma to welder. You may have to seek guidance from others who are more familiar with the currents involved however I don’t see it being far fetched if the current entered the welder through the ground lead looking for a path of travel and wound up frying the board when it had nowhere else to go being as how it couldn’t complete it’s circuit. But I’m by no means any sort of educated on something like this. May be better to ask @Mac5005 @WARRIORWELDING or others

 

[Croatan_Kid]

I'm gonna try and get Radio Shack/electrical repair place to try and fix the couple burnt diodes/capacitors first since I'm not sure what fried them.

After that you should swing by Blockbuster and Circuit City on your way home


You can touch the metal while you're cutting it with a plasma and not get zapped so I wouldn't think that the electricity back fed through the ground wire and shorted the board.

 

[marty79]

After that you should swing by Blockbuster and Circuit City on your way home


You can touch the metal while you're cutting it with a plasma and not get zapped so I wouldn't think that the electricity back fed through the ground wire and shorted the board.

I didn't think either but too coincidence for it to happen at exact same time

 

[Scooter402]

Well, damn...I was hoping that it would have been something simple and easy, and not a fried board.

@Croatan_Kid beat me to it! Radio Shack hasn't been around for a while (which sucks, because I certainly could use some small electronic components right about now...).

Nah, I don't think it would have happened while plasma cutting either.

 

[Fabrik8]

Looks like you fried that BJT, and who knows what else.

I can tell you 3 things about it:

1. It's a Samsung Semiconductor part, it's old because it's got the old logo on it and Samsung doesn't make that stuff anymore (replacements will be ON Semi or Fairchild probably).
2. It's a BJT, probably the complementary junction (NPN) to that ST Microelectronics BJT to the left of it (which I know is a PNP junction because I looked it up). Complementary PNP-NPN pairs are very common in power electronics.
3. Because it's complementary, it's something else in the TIP-prefix family, and I can see a "2" on the end of the part number but that doesn't narrow it down much because there's lots of parts that end in -2 that are TIPxx2 or TIPx2. It could be any one of about 10 or 20 parts without knowing the rest of the numbers.

Any idea what the rest of the numbers are in the burned area?
I just started poking around, and a lot of stuff in that family is obsolete, but many aren't yet... It will be about a $2-5 part if that's the only thing wrong with it.

My past life as an electronics technician comes back to haunt me....

 

[marty79]

Any idea what the rest of the numbers are in the burned area?
I just started poking around, and a lot of stuff in that family is obsolete, but many aren't yet... It will be about a $2-5 part if that's the only thing wrong with it.

My neighbor looked at it and it's just that and small common diode on the board. He knows is stuff pretty well.
Hope I can find local place..welding supply place? Take it to them?

 

[marty79]

I do know of a guy who does computer board repair would he be able to fix it

 

[Jeff B]

Look on the web for the downloadable parts manual in PDF form.

The call the manufacture and ask for the service dept.

Talk to a service tech if they have one or a sales rep can direct you to a repair center.

Tell them the issue and let them direct you to which contact has failed. order and replace with new.

 

[marty79]

Look on the web for the downloadable parts manual in PDF form.

The call the manufacture and ask for the service dept.

Talk to a service tech if they have one or a sales rep can direct you to a repair center.

Tell them the issue and let them direct you to which contact has failed. order and replace with new.

Well they got bought out by Lincoln back in 03 so do I call Lincoln?

 

[Jeff B]

Well they got bought out by Lincoln back in 03 so do I call Lincoln?

I would try them, may not be serviceable not since more then ten years old. However you may get lucky. I would also call James 02 in Hickory. They service welders, may be able to help you. Even though not a miller, worth a shot..

 

[Mac5005]

Doubtful it has anything to do with the plasma being hooked to it.

Even when cutting there wouldn’t be much current going back thru the welder ground.

Most of the current would be consumed by the cutting operation.

Far easier path for the circuit to be made to the plasma ground, than to ground through the welder, and back to the panel, then back to the plasma.

A big maybe if the plasma weren’t grounded to piece being cut, both machines on, and the welder still was grounded to the work piece, and both machines plugged in and running.

Plasma does use HV and HF arc for establishing the arc and cutting which can play hell on other electronic but usually there are isolated enough not to be affected.

I’ve cut and welded on a steel table with both grounds attached and never an issue.

It’s possible but I highly doubt it.

If anything it was just coincidence that’s WHEN it failed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[WARRIORWELDING]

Looks like you fried that BJT, and who knows what else.

I can tell you 3 things about it:

1. It's a Samsung Semiconductor part, it's old because it's got the old logo on it and Samsung doesn't make that stuff anymore (replacements will be ON Semi or Fairchild probably).
2. It's a BJT, probably the complementary junction (NPN) to that ST Microelectronics BJT to the left of it (which I know is a PNP junction because I looked it up). Complementary PNP-NPN pairs are very common in power electronics.
3. Because it's complementary, it's something else in the TIP-prefix family, and I can see a "2" on the end of the part number but that doesn't narrow it down much because there's lots of parts that end in -2 that are TIPxx2 or TIPx2. It could be any one of about 10 or 20 parts without knowing the rest of the numbers.

Any idea what the rest of the numbers are in the burned area?
I just started poking around, and a lot of stuff in that family is obsolete, but many aren't yet... It will be about a $2-5 part if that's the only thing wrong with it.

My past life as an electronics technician comes back to haunt me....

This fella knows exponentially more than most repair guys at Welding Supply Houses. Having said that its age is going to make those places have a hard time. I personally prefer Praxair....
I agree with Mac5005. I have run the same many times and all sorts of ground hooked up, left off whoops events and anything else you can think up. We did have a floating ground issue on the supply side of a shear and plasma that would knock the absolute crap out of a unsuspecting operator. Was a really harsh hazing some folks got at a less then reputable place I worked.

As for me the best thing I do with current is melt things together. If it gets into control groups and worse circuit boards I get lost real quick. Burnt spots and magic smoke is where my diagnosis stops.

 

[palmetto zuk]

After that you should swing by Blockbuster and Circuit City on your way home

 

[catfishblues]

Looks like you fried that BJT, and who knows what else.

I can tell you 3 things about it:

1. It's a Samsung Semiconductor part, it's old because it's got the old logo on it and Samsung doesn't make that stuff anymore (replacements will be ON Semi or Fairchild probably).
2. It's a BJT, probably the complementary junction (NPN) to that ST Microelectronics BJT to the left of it (which I know is a PNP junction because I looked it up). Complementary PNP-NPN pairs are very common in power electronics.
3. Because it's complementary, it's something else in the TIP-prefix family, and I can see a "2" on the end of the part number but that doesn't narrow it down much because there's lots of parts that end in -2 that are TIPxx2 or TIPx2. It could be any one of about 10 or 20 parts without knowing the rest of the numbers.

Any idea what the rest of the numbers are in the burned area?
I just started poking around, and a lot of stuff in that family is obsolete, but many aren't yet... It will be about a $2-5 part if that's the only thing wrong with it.

My past life as an electronics technician comes back to haunt me....

My neighbor looked at it and it's just that and small common diode on the board. He knows is stuff pretty well.
Hope I can find local place..welding supply place? Take it to them?

Yeah, JF. Listen to your neighbor. He's obviously got this shit on lock. Ignore what @Fabrik8 said.

Diode:


Transistor:


Nah, I'm sure you're neighbor is right.

 

[braxton357]

The snap on manual for their 220 version of this welder doesn't show any pictures but does give directions on checking the two silicon diodes and states that if one were short circuited would cause machine to trip breaker.
I don't know why he wouldn't have posted a picture of the rest of the board yet...

 

[Fabrik8]

If you can find the part number from that BJT, I can probably find some for you. Many of that TIP family is obsolete or going obsolete, but much should still be available from the normal online electronics places. There's no chance you're going to find that at a local place, and you don't know what the part number is. It's unfortunate that some of the part number has been damaged, so unless you can find a picture of another board with that part, or a schematic, you're probably out of luck.
The "434" is not a part number, it's a lot code or semiconductor manufacturing line or date code or something like that.

 

[braxton357]

If you can find the part number from that BJT, I can probably find some for you. Many of that TIP family is obsolete or going obsolete, but much should still be available from the normal online electronics places. There's no chance you're going to find that at a local place, and you don't know what the part number is. It's unfortunate that some of the part number has been damaged, so unless you can find a picture of another board with that part, or a schematic, you're probably out of luck.
The "434" is not a part number, it's a lot code or semiconductor manufacturing line or date code or something like that.

It's a TIP 142. (npn)