Wood stoves

jeepinmatt

jeepinmatt

#1 WEBWHEELER
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Stanley, NC
Scenario 1, thinking about putting a wood stove in my garage. The garage is 24x24 (576 sqft), and the living space is above the garage 24x38, so 24x24 is over the garage and 14x24 is over the deck (~850sqft living space). HVAC system and ducting is in the attic, so likely won't tie in to it. Garage is insulated. Is it even worth the trouble? Currently the power bill in my house is about $70-80/month spring and fall, $120-130 summer, and $170-200 winter.

Scenario 2, parents house has a Fisher woodstove that was installed when the house was built in the late 70's/early 80's. It heats the house well, but uses a lot of wood. I'm able to keep up with the wood supply for my shop, their house, and my neighbor, but if I add in my house too, I might want them to get a more efficient stove. Their house is about 3600sqft total (1800sqft living upstairs and 1800sqft basement/garage).

So I'm not familiar with wood stove technology these days. I see terms like EPA certified and catalytic, but its hard to find useful information. #1 concern is the wife doesn't want the house to smell like smoke. #2 concern is that I don't want to lose a lot of space in the garage. I figure if I can save $40-50/month, a sub-$1000 stove would pay for itself in just a few winters.
 
jeepinmatt said:
I figure if I can save $40-50/month, a sub-$1000 stove would pay for itself in just a few winters.
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Without anything else useful to add, I'm struggling to see how this is woirth it from a time/effort standpoint on a $1000 stove.
Winter months are only what, 3-4? lets say you save $50 every one of those 4 months. Which is a real stretch IMO. That still 5 years to pay off $1000. And thats assuming that (1) your wood is free and (2) your time to get and deal with the wood is free.

Don't get me wrong, wood stoves are awesome and very useful in many applications, but in this case I don't see it as much of a money saver. If we were talking 6 months at $100 savings each, then yeah it's totally worth it.
I'd be pretty damn happy if my winter bills were only $50 more.
 
What about an external wood stove system that can heat your house garage and water heater all at one time.


The new ones are more efficient but also require hard seasoned wood or they will clog up.
My parents use less wood then I do with my older stove but I use mine for primary heat while they use it as a supplement when it's cold out
 
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I'd start with an inexpensive stove and get to burning wood. Keep an eye out and you should be able to snag a more efficient stove down the road for about 500 and swap it in. Unless you are buying a $3000 stove most of the expense is in properly installing the pipe and blocking heat against a combustible wall.

I was given a Vermont Casting non cat stove years ago for a wedding present. I still had $800 in stove pipe and I even got a deal on it.
 
RatLabGuy said:
Without anything else useful to add, I'm struggling to see how this is woirth it from a time/effort standpoint on a $1000 stove.
Winter months are only what, 3-4? lets say you save $50 every one of those 4 months. Which is a real stretch IMO. That still 5 years to pay off $1000. And thats assuming that (1) your wood is free and (2) your time to get and deal with the wood is free.

Don't get me wrong, wood stoves are awesome and very useful in many applications, but in this case I don't see it as much of a money saver. If we were talking 6 months at $100 savings each, then yeah it's totally worth it.
I'd be pretty damn happy if my winter bills were only $50 more.
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I have an abundant wood supply, and I enjoy cutting and splitting wood, so to me the time/labor is not a factor. It just seems completely retarded to me that my power bill is $200/month for an 800sqft house with 2 people living in it. So I guess part of it is principle. Also, its over $100 difference from off season to winter, and thats with the thermostat set to 67 and the house feeling pretty cold all the time. The wife's parents stay in the garage when they visit, so it would add some ambiance too.

Loganwayne said:
What about an external wood stove system that can heat your house garage and water heater all at one time.


The new ones are more efficient but also require hard seasoned wood or they will clog up.
My parents use less wood then I do with my older stove but I use mine for primary heat while they use it as a supplement when it's cold out
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With 18 acres of woods, there's never a shortage of dead oaks, and I'm far enough ahead that I can let it season for about a year before burning it. The external heater is a thought, but I don't really want to mess with all the plumbing.

frankenyoter said:
Keep an eye out and you should be able to snag a more efficient stove down the road for about 500 and swap it in. Unless you are buying a $3000 stove most of the expense is in properly installing the pipe and blocking heat against a combustible wall.

I was given a Vermont Casting non cat stove years ago for a wedding present. I still had $800 in stove pipe and I even got a deal on it.
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I'm not in a hurry, so I can wait for a decent deal, I'm just not sure what to buy. I was hoping this thread would clear up what some of the options and technologies were so I can know what to look for.
 
tknopp said:
Make a barrel stove for next to nothing.
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I have the resources for it, but I'd like something that's clean burning and efficient, and I'm not really sure how to do that. I've got too many other projects forecasted, so I don't want this to become a major project.
 
My Vermont Casting is the Aspen I believe. It's an older model and costs about 1500 new. It will burn all day choked down with three sticks of locust. It would heat 800 sq ft easy.

Too big of a stove and you will need to leave the windows open.
 
tknopp said:
Make a barrel stove for next to nothing.
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I would do a double barrel for a house to get started... or pick up a used cheap stove off craigslist/iwanna. You can find some cheaper ones in the mountains.

IIRC your garage is insulated from your living space, correct? If so, that will make heating it more difficult without some ducting/plumbing.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
IIRC your garage is insulated from your living space, correct? If so, that will make heating it more difficult without some ducting/plumbing.
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Oooh this is a really important point. IIRc you're pretty picky about building, and did it yourself, so I'd bet you have a pretty good separation there. If so you'll definitely need to consider some ducting.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
IIRC your garage is insulated from your living space, correct? If so, that will make heating it more difficult without some ducting/plumbing.
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RatLabGuy said:
Oooh this is a really important point. IIRc you're pretty picky about building, and did it yourself, so I'd bet you have a pretty good separation there. If so you'll definitely need to consider some ducting.
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Correct on both points. Theres about 12" of insulation between the garage and the upstairs floor. However, insulation isn't magic, and heat will come through, just at a SIGNIFICANTLY lower rate. My plan would be to try it and see how it works without ducting. The ceiling of the garage is sheetrock, so thats a big part of the reason I don't want to mess with ducting. Though I could probably just run it flush with the ceiling and punch through the floor in the locations where I wanted it. But that is turning into a big project...
 
Going back and looking at the build thread of the house(which is amazing btw) I don't know how much a wood stove in the shop is going to help. With those high ceilings it is going to take a lot to heat that place. Even at less that 1000sqft.
 
Might be better to put a couple smaller stoves on each level. I pot belly in the living room and another or small gas unit in the garage for company.

This would make the smoke/mess in the "house" more though. You could "duct" a fluid through heat exchangers vs air. Might be lower profile, but slightly more work unless you engineered a good thermosiphon system
 
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^ only down side is you'll also get any smells from your garage and any sounds. I haven't looked at your house build on here but if you use your garage like a normal one then I wouldn't go that route
 
I have a Vermont Casting Defiant that I would let go pretty cheap, however it is a cat model and needs a little work. If your interested let me know.
 
Loganwayne said:
^ only down side is you'll also get any smells from your garage and any sounds. I haven't looked at your house build on here but if you use your garage like a normal one then I wouldn't go that route
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Yeah. Was focused on heating two floors and not so much about welding fumes.
 
Garage is totally separate from the shop. Garage stays pretty clean and scentless. Shop is another story, haha.
 
You can't duct between a garage space and a living space. Should be min. 1hr fire barrier.
 
shawn said:
You can't duct between a garage space and a living space. Should be min. 1hr fire barrier.
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Not sure why it wouldn't be possible using the same materials as the existing ceiling (sheetrock). If pink painted plywood was good enough the first time around...
 
Matt, the key to efficiency is retaining heat and as small of a fire box that will heat the space.
Other important factors are correctly sized outlet/pipe and an ability to adjust a damper.

Secondary air is a consideration and gets more heat per pound of fuel, it works but to use it correctly requires good timing and use of wood.
The stove must be loaded, gotten to temp and adjusted ... then left alone.
This requires someone to be there when it needs loading again, topping it off arbitrarily messes up the way it works.

In a shop, I know several folks with barrel stoves who have made efforts at making them better. Baffles and fire brick/refractory cement go a long way.
Secondary air is as easy as drilling some holes in a burner.

EPA stoves are GREAT if you can adhere to how they work and keep a schedule. If not, they are a waste of money.

When we move I plan to buy a Lopi for the home we build.

I use an insert now and so did my dad when I was growing up.
 
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