beginner welder

20+ years ago I taught my self to weld on the carnival, out of necessity. Am I an artist with the bead like mars fab? Hell no, but the us government, duke power, and several equipment manufactures around the US, 1 in china, 1 in India and a dealer ship in Russia and in Australia will tell my bubble gum sticks well..

Chip, that's why I am not a Mod anymore.:)
 
Jeff B said:
If I didn't give up my mod status a while back, I would have banned your ass for you comment to Chip. That's real pro for a mod huh?

Unnecessary asshat bullshit. This behavior is not welcome round these parts...

Fawkin newbs...
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far from a newb son
 
good point. Whats really bad is my grammar error.. your vs you're
 
Yes you can self teach welding, yes you can make decent welds, yes they can be fully functional, yes they can be visually appealing.

Yes you can benifit from formal classes, yes you can burn up more consumables costing a great deal more than the tutition, yes you can get exposure to many techniques and alot of different types of welding and machines, yes you can get your feet wet and learn crucial knowledge about the subject.

Neither gurantees you'll be good at it or like it. I've done both and no I don't flatter myself with a mind set that all my welds are perfect or assymetricly perfect in every way. But having done both and comitting to a standard of constant learning and practice; what I consider a "craft, skill, fine art, trade" and not a hobby or black magic of electritcity and metal, I call myself an Expert.....

Do both, Do it to the best of your ability and don't half ass it.
 
I was told the people on this site were cool. I wont judge by the words of a couple of assholes who attacked me for having an opinion.
 
99% of the people on this site are cool. The ones you insulted earlier are usually the first to help somebody out. You asked for an opinion. You got opinions and attacked them.

As far as welding goes, find somebody that is proficient at welding and watch them. Learn from them. Let them watch you and critique your methods. You can pick up a used welder on here for a pretty good deal. I have a Hobart 140 110v. My father in law is a professional welder. He has about 10 different welders in his shop. I learned to weld on a stick machine first. Never took any formal classes. First project was a wood splitter that was built 10+ years ago. It is still busting wood and hasnt had any welds break. I can weld most of the stuff on my rig with my little Hobart 140. I know its limitations and where my concerns are with safety. When it comes to real structural stuff, If I am somewhat concerned with the penetration the little 110v machine can do, I will tack the stuff together at home and go to my FIL's shop and either use his big machines or ask him to weld it. I know my limitations too. I dont have enough experience to build my own roll cage. That could be a life or death thing. I will get somebody else to do that for me. I have built bumpers, sliders, body modifications, SAS, spring swaps, etc. I welded a bumper onto my last rig with my little welder. Multiple passes and it was sturdy. Stalled out a Warn 9500 winch and the welds held.

Ive said it before, welding is like sex. It's not all about how it looks, it is all about penetration.
 
Obviously, JeepSide felt the same way about English classes as he does about welding classes. ;)


Like I said before, not everybody is destined to be a welder. It takes a big man to admit when he CAN'T do something. If everybody could do it, then guys like me, JeffB, Warriorwelding, Marsfab, PJ, etc. couldn't make any money at it. Take the class. The initial investment will be outweighed by the opportunity to use a REAL welder, burn up someone else's scrap, and receive tips from guys who have done this for years. Many folks maintain a relationship with their instructor and end up leaning on them in the future for advice. I know I have.
 
I guess I am the big man, you didn't include my name in that list! LMAO
I have three welders, but still, sometimes I get someone else to do a job for me.

But, I become very popular on the trail when a welder is needed! LOL
 
Little bit of bashing on here,lol. If you can afford classes I would do that,I took a few classes years ago. I really learned most from being a fender lizard at Tarheel 4x4. Steve at Tarheel is a master at welding and Fab work. Like I was told if you don't like grinding you'll learn how to weld.
 
WARRIORWELDING said:
Yes you can self teach welding, yes you can make decent welds, yes they can be fully functional, yes they can be visually appealing.

Yes you can benifit from formal classes, yes you can burn up more consumables costing a great deal more than the tutition, yes you can get exposure to many techniques and alot of different types of welding and machines, yes you can get your feet wet and learn crucial knowledge about the subject.

Neither gurantees you'll be good at it or like it. I've done both and no I don't flatter myself with a mind set that all my welds are perfect or assymetricly perfect in every way. But having done both and comitting to a standard of constant learning and practice; what I consider a "craft, skill, fine art, trade" and not a hobby or black magic of electritcity and metal, I call myself an Expert.....

Do both, Do it to the best of your ability and don't half ass it.
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Sounds good and I genuinely appreciate all of the differing opinions. Having had no exposure to welding I certainly think a class would be in order. Until then I'll keeep reading and asking questions.
When I bought my xj I had at most replaced an alternator on a vehicle before. At this point I've installed 2 axles and 2 lifts, replaced a manifold and countless other wrenching duties that have come up. Hell I wasn't even proficient with a manual either but I picked my xj with an ax-15 for that reason. It's been challenging yet gratifying breaking down barriers all along this journey. I see the next mechanical hurdle as welding. I do not intend to become an expert but I'd certainly like to try my hand at it in a safe manner.
 
Having done some reading would a 110/220 mig with gas option essentially be the best general purpose welder? I have 220 in my barn although i'd need to relocate and one thing I've seen repeatedly is buy bigger or you'll wish you did. I'm certainly not purchasing yet or anywhere close just looking at the destination i'd likely arrive.
 
AX(J)15_tudor said:
Having done some reading would a 110/220 mig with gas option essentially be the best general purpose welder? I have 220 in my barn although i'd need to relocate and one thing I've seen repeatedly is buy bigger or you'll wish you did. I'm certainly not purchasing yet or anywhere close just looking at the destination i'd likely arrive.
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Cant answer your question, but I started with a lincoln flux core welder,then I found a deal on a MIG. I like the mig alot better.
 
Thanks for all the good words guys I appreciate it!

I firmly believe in buying from one of the big welder manufactures like Miller, Loncoln, or Hobart. A good budget machine for a do-it-yourself guy like you would be a Hobart Handler 187. Its got a lot of the same features at the comparable lincoln or miller without quite as high price and for a home garage if well taken care of it'll last you a life time. Plus consumables are available at tractor supply and northern tool. Thats a good thing to have for a weekend warior considering a lot of welding supply houses aren't open on weekends.

I've been welding since I was 14. (I'm 29 now) I was in high school working for a small misc. steel shop doing handrails and what not. I learned on stick welder which I feel is the best way to learn because it teaches the true fundamentals about melting two pieces of metal together. Unfortunately I was never able to take any classes and I really regret it. There are so many little things that a class will teach you about making a sound weld that you'll never really learn without years of experience. About 5 years ago I was young and though I new pretty much everything I could know about welding. Then one day I saw someting I welded fail and it was a real eye opener. At that point I realized that peoples lives relied on my welds and I needed to go back to the drawing board. www.weldingweb.com is a great place to pick up useful information. It helped me a lot.

Everyone has their own style or technique and you will hear a thousand different opinions, not all are bad. For example, a month or so ago I was down at Carolina Truggies picking up some parts and Alex and I were shooting the crap about welding. We fired up his machine and each layed a few beads. In just a few minutes I saw him do things much different than I do but we both got almost the same result. Shadowing a professional welder is also an excellent way to learn and with time you'll get an idea of what info people give you is good and whats not so good. I still try to look over the shoulder of a welder any chance I get.

I see you're in Harrisburg. My shop is right on 49 at the intersection of Pharr Mill Rd. You should stop by one day and say hey. Maybe you'll catch me on a light day so we can spend a little time going over some stuff. I do offer classes but the shop's been so busy lately I haven't had time to get material together to do it. With all the interest lately I guess it's about time to do one again. I do the classes for 20.00 and hour, usually around 3 hour classes. I supply the welder and all the scrap metal your heart desires and if you get your own machine I'll be glad to spend some time with you dialing it in and getting you comfortable with how it works if you'd like. Let me know if I can help!
 
MarsFab said:
Thanks for all the good words guys I appreciate it!

I firmly believe in buying from one of the big welder manufactures like Miller, Loncoln, or Hobart. A good budget machine for a do-it-yourself guy like you would be a Hobart Handler 187. Its got a lot of the same features at the comparable lincoln or miller without quite as high price and for a home garage if well taken care of it'll last you a life time. Plus consumables are available at tractor supply and northern tool. Thats a good thing to have for a weekend warior considering a lot of welding supply houses aren't open on weekends.

I've been welding since I was 14. (I'm 29 now) I was in high school working for a small misc. steel shop doing handrails and what not. I learned on stick welder which I feel is the best way to learn because it teaches the true fundamentals about melting two pieces of metal together. Unfortunately I was never able to take any classes and I really regret it. There are so many little things that a class will teach you about making a sound weld that you'll never really learn without years of experience. About 5 years ago I was young and though I new pretty much everything I could know about welding. Then one day I saw someting I welded fail and it was a real eye opener. At that point I realized that peoples lives relied on my welds and I needed to go back to the drawing board. www.weldingweb.com is a great place to pick up useful information. It helped me a lot.

Everyone has their own style or technique and you will hear a thousand different opinions, not all are bad. For example, a month or so ago I was down at Carolina Truggies picking up some parts and Alex and I were shooting the crap about welding. We fired up his machine and each layed a few beads. In just a few minutes I saw him do things much different than I do but we both got almost the same result. Shadowing a professional welder is also an excellent way to learn and with time you'll get an idea of what info people give you is good and whats not so good. I still try to look over the shoulder of a welder any chance I get.

I see you're in Harrisburg. My shop is right on 49 at the intersection of Pharr Mill Rd. You should stop by one day and say hey. Maybe you'll catch me on a light day so we can spend a little time going over some stuff. I do offer classes but the shop's been so busy lately I haven't had time to get material together to do it. With all the interest lately I guess it's about time to do one again. I do the classes for 20.00 and hour, usually around 3 hour classes. I supply the welder and all the scrap metal your heart desires and if you get your own machine I'll be glad to spend some time with you dialing it in and getting you comfortable with how it works if you'd like. Let me know if I can help!
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That's awesome. On location and reputation alone I'd like to take a class from you. Regardless I'll need to check out your shop.
 
AX(J)15_tudor said:
Having done some reading would a 110/220 mig with gas option essentially be the best general purpose welder? I have 220 in my barn although i'd need to relocate and one thing I've seen repeatedly is buy bigger or you'll wish you did. I'm certainly not purchasing yet or anywhere close just looking at the destination i'd likely arrive.
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If you have 220 available then buy a 220 machine. Not all wire feed welders are created equal. M.I.G. = metal inert GAS, flux cored welding is a similar process but slightly different result. If you buy a wire welder make sure it's a MIG welder not just a flux core welder. A mig welder will generally be able to use flux cored wire or solid wire. In MIG welding a mix of argon/co2 is used to shield the molten puddle. In flux cored welding the wire is coated in a shielding material that coats the weld as you lay it. Flux core welding will generally yeild more penetration but leave a crusty weld. The better you are with it the easier the crust/slag will chip off and leave a clean shapely weld. Mig welding still gets decent penetration but makes a nice clean smooth bead more like you're used to seeing. plus you have to buy an expensive tank of gas and if the welder didn't come with it a regulator and hose for the tank.

The important thing to take from this is that a flux cored welder can only do flux core welding. A MIG welder can do either process, so initially you can buy a MIG welder and use flux cored wire in it till you have the money for the regulator and tank.
 
AX(J)15_tudor said:
That's awesome. On location and reputation alone I'd like to take a class from you. Regardless I'll need to check out your shop.
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Stop by during the week any time man. 9:00-5:30. I'm usually out of the shop for an hour around lunch.
 
A class is very helpfull. We didnt have to pay for any consumables at durham tech. It gives you the foundation to be a solid welder. plus when you lay down a big ole cat turd, you have someone around that knows why it happens instead of you scratchin your head. If your self motivated, goto amazon and buy ISBN 1-4018-1046-2 and 1-4018-1048-9. thats welding principles and applications 5th edition and the lab manual.
 
OK I have stayed out of the advice as long as I can LOL

As said, you will be able to do more, with a 220V welder. you don't have to have a garage with 220 run to it. I know of a couple folks who have run an extension cord out of their home, hooked into a stove outlet. YOu also have dryer outlets, but they may not have heavy enough wire going to them, and you may just keep poping the breaker.
I have used Lincoln welders, Hobart, and miller. low end welders, not professional ones. all of these were 160 amp and up.
all were similar in the welds once I got it dialed in.
for me the items I use most are:
welding pliers, these are used to clean the gas nozzle, cut welding wire, and remove hot tips and nozzles.
welding spray, helps-s to keep stuck spatter off nozzle and tips, as well as work piece.
welding gloves, I don't use them as much as I should for welding, but I do use them for holding a piece to weld it, and for picking up hot pieces.
A auto darkening welding helmet. I have the flip shield, and the older style that you ave to flip the whole thing down with a nod of your head, but, I have neck issues, and a lot of this, then my neck starts getting sore.
A welding cart. Really it's a luxury, but sure makes things easier. I have seen everything from a modified shopping cart, to store bought. Mine was an old hand truck, and I used it one of my first projects. some bad welds on that thing!
a grinder. A must for cleaning the welding area. I actually have collected several, so I don't have to keep changing the type of head I am using. A grinding disk, a knotted brush, a flapper disk, a cutting disk.
safety glasses. A must for when grinding brushing and so on. A trip to the ER sucks to get metal out of your eye.
extension cord. needed for the grinders, and the welder. Get a good one. when I say good, I mean stay away from those cheapo cords with small wire, for a grinder, a 12ga is good, for the welder, 6 is good. At least have been for me. the longer the cord, the bigger the ga you need because of voltage drop. I am not an electrician, but we have some guys here that can advise on that better than me.
other tools I use
a portaband, a sawzall, magnets, c=clamps, vice grips(many types)
probably leaving something out, but a good start.

a nice looking weld can be good, or not good. It might look good, but if you flip it over, you can see if you have penetration to make sure it's strong.

If you burn through, you are too hot and or holding in one place too long
if the wire "pushes back" you are too cold, or not a good ground.
these are just some of my observations.

But the best advice I can give, is get some instruction from someone who knows all about it.
 
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Thanks for the advice upnover. I have a 220 source but will likely relocate mine if I do get a welder so I can avoid having to run a huge heavy extension, which will save me on cost too in the long run. I've got a grinder, although not air (another toy needed), and I've definitely learned first hand how bad and expensive rust in the eye feels to know eye protection is a must. Many of the other items I have been amassing so the big items now are education and funds for a good welder. I think the latter will afford me plenty of time to apply energies on the former, lol.
 
WOW! Just read this thread!

What drama!:popcorn:
 
I'm going to tell you something a little different than these guys. Not much different, but a little. Look at your needs and consider what you might use it for if you decide to buy a welder. Most of what you get from stepping up to a 220v welder is going to be duty cycle. It will run longer without having to rest. You'll also potentially have more power on tap to burn something thick in a single pass. If you're like most folks, though, then your day will be spent doing very little welding compared to cutting, fitting, grinding, etc. A 220v welder is going to be heavier and less versatile as far as welding on location is concerned. A 120v welder spooled up with flux can be pretty competent on anything up to 1/4", and go anywhere you can find a good 15 or 20A circuit. With proper metal prep, you can build your bumpers, cages, whatever. I'm not talking about your HF cheapo flux welder, but a good unit. I've used several. I started with the HF Fux 100 POS boat anchor welder. Worthless. I picked up a Lincoln 100hd with the gas kit. It was really a fantastic little welder on either flux or gas. Then I bought a Miller 175 220v welder. Used it a lot, but still picked up the Linc occasionally. Bought a Miller (I like the blue) 180 and sold the 175 and the Linc. I used the 180 a little, but found myself missing my Lincoln. I was turning down jobs I could have used it on because of it's on-site capability. So now I have the big Miller and a Craftsman I picked up off C-list. It's an oddball made by Century with infinitely variable voltage control. Believe it or not, I love the little Craftsman! It's only an 85 amp unit, but it's a well-built welder, and that counts for a lot. I can throw it in the back of the truck and go fix some tree stands at the Christmas tree lot. I can pick it up and drag it outside to fix the lawn mower I'm working on without having to worry about gas blowing away. It's light and easy to use. You just have to learn to work within your limitations.

My point is: 220 is nice. Gas is nice. Neither are absolute necessities. If you come across a good deal on a 220v welder, by all means, jump. But I've seen a lot of nice Lincoln 140s and the like on the used market lately, and you shouldn't pass on a good deal just because it's a 110 unit. The Miller 140 is an awesome welder for the average home hobbyist, for instance. If you think you're going to end up at your buddy's house working on his junk, too, definitely consider starting with a good 120v unit, then moving up to a 220v later on if you feel the need. However, never sell your 120v welder!
 
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