Boirl Scouts

I keep my red herring in my pants, thankyouverymuch.

Also, where did I express any opinions in this thread? Please go quote those posts for me. My memory is short, and my attention span is shorter.
 
You didn't...that's why I said you win. I understand how the internet works, you're the swinging dick around here, you swung your mighty hammer. So rather than perpetuating and having the mob of white knights jump in, I bowed out. But I apparently didn't bow out soon enough. So I'll say it again...you win.
 
I'm confused. You said I was giving you a hard time because you disagreed with me. I didn't know I'd expressed any opinions.

I just want you to make an honest, cogent argument. Think of me as Mr Miyagi for your brain.

Until then, get your ass back to painting the fence.
 
shawn said:
I'm confused. You said I was giving you a hard time because you disagreed with me. I didn't know I'd expressed any opinions.

I just want you to make an honest, cogent argument. Think of me as Mr Miyagi for your brain.

Until then, get your ass back to painting the fence.
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You clearly thought I was wrong with the definition of a word and I was rendering false statements. That's where we disagreed. So I said you win as a preemptive strike to prevent a completely pointless discussion such as this.
 
I should, but i won't.
'Dre out.
My kneegro ass is going to bed.
 
UTfball68 said:
You clearly thought I was wrong with the definition of a word and I was rendering false statements. That's where we disagreed. So I said you win as a preemptive strike to prevent a completely pointless discussion such as this.
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Sheldon Cooper is that you??? :lol:
 
Rearranging complete thoughts and or thought processes to better argue a differing point of view with no true substance. Is that a straw man??? Or inclusive politician? I really didn't think my earlier points were contradictory in the full context. Either way I am no hypocrite. As for debating points of view I have no other logical, rational, statistic, or raw data to divulge. But in my heart when this is implimented my son will have earned his Eagle. He will also carry a disappointment in what the program has become. The same resentment unfullfilled Girl Scouts deal with. We keep dumbing down what was exlusive and elite for specific groups. This is like wealth distribution in economics. Everybody just gets poor in the long term. Capitalize on our differences. Recognize them and make it special for a season of growth and maturity. I have invested my evening in this because I feel very strongly toward it and our youth...our future. I can tell you this......a small part of the future finds the matter very close to his heart. He also recognizes plenty in this thread as both laughable and disturbing. He is 17 there is hope.....the force is strong with this one..
 
Back to the point.

As men and fathers, it is now up to US to defend masculinity and ensure that OUR boys grow up to be men who understand their place in this world.

It is more critical now than ever, that we put the time and energy into our families and our children, and we don't fail them.

Because Society is going to hammer them with 'progressive values' that are counter-productive to society and their individuality.
 
Holy fuck people
All this bantering and very few have put forward any real information as to what the plan or intention is from BSA.
Which, once you stop and listen to, actually resolves 90% of the issues raised here.

My background, for reference:
I'm another Eagle Scout, but also was a Cubmaster when my son was in Cubs, and now am an asst. Scoutmaster for our Troop. I've stayed very plugged in w/ the district and have been in some kind of leadership role for many years now.
This has been brewing a long time, and came right from the top. In August, all the Districts were given info to get out to solicit feedback from leaders, which was used to make the decision regarding how to move forward. Video from the BSA President etc. Guess what - overwhelming support, once people had all the info.

Background facts:
- It is widely recognized that (1) there are more single parents than ever and its hard on them to have kids (boys and girls) doing different things. By adding girls to the program, it also bring in BOYS whose parents otherwise could not bring them. This has been proven in other things that went co-ed. (2) girl scouts of USA SUCKS BALLS in comparison. Widely recognized by girls. They want to do what Boy Scouts do. They don't like the GSA program.

- Scouts in almost ALL other developed countries is co-ed, and has been for a long time. Guess what - it works there too.

- In looking down this road, the BSA President laid out several requirements that were MUSTS:
- there would be NO change to requirements for boys or "softening" of the program. End of story.
- requirements for girls MUST be either the same or of equivalent rigor. No "making it easier" them.
- They are NOT advocating for mixed co-ed patrols, activities etc. Rather, Troops can still be either all boy, or even all girl, or have both that operate mostly in parallel. How they operate is up to the charter organization. E.g. if an old school Baptist church wants to sponsor a boy-only Troop - fine, they do it, and if you want you kid in a boy only Troop, send him there. Meanwhile the girl who wants to be around just girls goes to a girl-only Troop.
The notion with mixed-troops is that they would likely operate segregated. Maybe start off opening ceremony together, then split for patrols, majority of meeting. On campout, camp mostly separately, join up for campfire and other large components.
- hence it is widely accepted and believed by all of admin that boys act differently around only boys, and that is a good thing to maintain and is intended as such. Unfortunately the press releases overlooked this critical detail.

- BSA specifically reached out to GSUSA about this and asked them to join forces. BSAs requirement though was that they had to change their program to match BSAs, to avoid watering it down. Guess what, Girl Scouts ignored this offer. So BSA moved onward.

- right now (in Fall 2018) it is ONLY integration at Cubs level. Even then, single-gender Dens. LATER, after a lot of input, sometime 2019 they'll start with middle-high school level (current Boy Scout ages).

- Yes, it's about enrollment, and ultimately $$. Annual dues had to go up a lot this year b/c enrollment is down. The biggest excuse is not video games or cost, its an increasing desire from parents for their kids to do things at the same time. BSA is in fact a business, they have to stay in the black. Can't blame them for that.

OK so those are the facts this is based on. So, no, there is no agenda to neutralize genders. There is no push to make things easier You still have the option of single-gender Troops, since it is widely expected many charter orgs, especially churches, will prefer this route. its not an intentional slight against girl scouts. They offer an inferior product and refused to get on board, so they're being pushed out of the way.

I'll also be the first to say, yeah, Scouts is not what it was when I was a kid. I'm in it now as a leader to help try and FIX it for my son and at least make his Troop awesome. But that's a separate issue.

As a dad of a 12 y/o boy and 7 y/o girl, I'm very happy about this. My daughter has been begging for years to do the same things her brother did. She is soooo disappointed in Girl Scouts. They literally barred our Daisy Troop from going camping. And as a Scout leader - I don't see the big deal. My bigger concern is, with all these girls, are we gonna get an equal increase in parental involvement to help run things???
 
shawn said:
Ad hominem...
Click to expand...
By can you REALLY add hominy to anything by itself? I mean it makes decent grits but other than that, you can't really ADD just hominy to something and make it better. Just doesn't work
 
RatLabGuy said:
Holy fuck people
All this bantering and very few have put forward any real information as to what the plan or intention is from BSA.
Which, once you stop and listen to, actually resolves 90% of the issues raised here.

My background, for reference:
I'm another Eagle Scout, but also was a Cubmaster when my son was in Cubs, and now am an asst. Scoutmaster for our Troop. I've stayed very plugged in w/ the district and have been in some kind of leadership role for many years now.
This has been brewing a long time, and came right from the top. In August, all the Districts were given info to get out to solicit feedback from leaders, which was used to make the decision regarding how to move forward. Video from the BSA President etc. Guess what - overwhelming support, once people had all the info.

Background facts:
- It is widely recognized that (1) there are more single parents than ever and its hard on them to have kids (boys and girls) doing different things. By adding girls to the program, it also bring in BOYS whose parents otherwise could not bring them. This has been proven in other things that went co-ed. (2) girl scouts of USA SUCKS BALLS in comparison. Widely recognized by girls. They want to do what Boy Scouts do. They don't like the GSA program.

- Scouts in almost ALL other developed countries is co-ed, and has been for a long time. Guess what - it works there too.

- In looking down this road, the BSA President laid out several requirements that were MUSTS:
- there would be NO change to requirements for boys or "softening" of the program. End of story.
- requirements for girls MUST be either the same or of equivalent rigor. No "making it easier" them.
- They are NOT advocating for mixed co-ed patrols, activities etc. Rather, Troops can still be either all boy, or even all girl, or have both that operate mostly in parallel. How they operate is up to the charter organization. E.g. if an old school Baptist church wants to sponsor a boy-only Troop - fine, they do it, and if you want you kid in a boy only Troop, send him there. Meanwhile the girl who wants to be around just girls goes to a girl-only Troop.
The notion with mixed-troops is that they would likely operate segregated. Maybe start off opening ceremony together, then split for patrols, majority of meeting. On campout, camp mostly separately, join up for campfire and other large components.
- hence it is widely accepted and believed by all of admin that boys act differently around only boys, and that is a good thing to maintain and is intended as such. Unfortunately the press releases overlooked this critical detail.

- BSA specifically reached out to GSUSA about this and asked them to join forces. BSAs requirement though was that they had to change their program to match BSAs, to avoid watering it down. Guess what, Girl Scouts ignored this offer. So BSA moved onward.

- right now (in Fall 2018) it is ONLY integration at Cubs level. Even then, single-gender Dens. LATER, after a lot of input, sometime 2019 they'll start with middle-high school level (current Boy Scout ages).

- Yes, it's about enrollment, and ultimately $$. Annual dues had to go up a lot this year b/c enrollment is down. The biggest excuse is not video games or cost, its an increasing desire from parents for their kids to do things at the same time. BSA is in fact a business, they have to stay in the black. Can't blame them for that.

OK so those are the facts this is based on. So, no, there is no agenda to neutralize genders. There is no push to make things easier You still have the option of single-gender Troops, since it is widely expected many charter orgs, especially churches, will prefer this route. its not an intentional slight against girl scouts. They offer an inferior product and refused to get on board, so they're being pushed out of the way.

I'll also be the first to say, yeah, Scouts is not what it was when I was a kid. I'm in it now as a leader to help try and FIX it for my son and at least make his Troop awesome. But that's a separate issue.

As a dad of a 12 y/o boy and 7 y/o girl, I'm very happy about this. My daughter has been begging for years to do the same things her brother did. She is soooo disappointed in Girl Scouts. They literally barred our Daisy Troop from going camping. And as a Scout leader - I don't see the big deal. My bigger concern is, with all these girls, are we gonna get an equal increase in parental involvement to help run things???
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Thank you...those were facts I was looking for, rather than nostalgia, opinion and feelings.
 
I have a question. I wasn't in the boy scouts and my sister wasn't in the girl scouts so I honestly dont know anything about them. Do the boy scouts not have the same or at least similar activities as the girl scouts do? I am just curious as to why a girl would want to be in the boy scouts or a boy in the girl scouts unless they actually had vastly different activities. I just always assumed that both organizations were about outdoors and camping and wearing really odd uniforms.
 
I haven't read any of the other comments here but I can only say what I know. I was in an awesome troop growing up that tight me so much. When my daughter was old enough she joined the girl scouts and don't last long at all. The program sucked and she hated the fact that they didn't camp or do outdoor activities like pioneering projects and the likes. As I told her, either make the changes yourself out move on.
 
RatLabGuy said:
Holy fuck people
As a dad of a 12 y/o boy and 7 y/o girl, I'm very happy about this. My daughter has been begging for years to do the same things her brother did. She is soooo disappointed in Girl Scouts. They literally barred our Daisy Troop from going camping. And as a Scout leader - I don't see the big deal. My bigger concern is, with all these girls, are we gonna get an equal increase in parental involvement to help run things???
Click to expand...

Thanks for clearing that up, it does indeed make it sounds pretty awesome.

I know my sister was in Girl Scouts, back in the early 90's while I was in Boy Scouts. And I thought theirs sucked in comparison. I think the argument you (and BS of A) makes is very valid and I support it.

Heck, I'd love to get involved.
 
Holy shit
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
superman27344 said:
I have a question. I wasn't in the boy scouts and my sister wasn't in the girl scouts so I honestly dont know anything about them. Do the boy scouts not have the same or at least similar activities as the girl scouts do? I am just curious as to why a girl would want to be in the boy scouts or a boy in the girl scouts unless they actually had vastly different activities. I just always assumed that both organizations were about outdoors and camping and wearing really odd uniforms.
Click to expand...
No, they don't. The programs and what is emphasized are VERY different.
For Boy Scouts, camping, outdoor skills, and learning by doing things are key components. It has a very regimented list of requirements for moving up in ranks and earning merit badges. Girl Scouts (from what I've seen with my daughter and talking to friends) is focused much more on social/societal skills and various normal-life skills, and while there are specified requirements, the actual details of how you meet them are more up to the girls or troops to figure out on their own. BSA is very organization-heavy, while GSA is not at all.

Hence, girls want to do the boy scout program b/c it is very different (and much better IMO).

We have an annual STEM merit badge day thing here at the local Army research post. For year it has been Boy and Cub Scouts. Last year they widened it to include Girl Scouts. It was a fiasco b/c the GSA leaders who volunteered to run classes had no clue how to go through a list of requirements and make sure the students could specifically demonstrate X, Y, and Z after being taught. A lot of the BSA leaders wanted to un-invite them this year. Their solution, to avoid looking like assholes, was to have the GSA arrange and do their thing in parallel to the BSA volunteers but didn't bother trying to mix leaders etc.
 
GotWood said:
I haven't read any of the other comments here but I can only say what I know. I was in an awesome troop growing up that tight me so much. When my daughter was old enough she joined the girl scouts and don't last long at all. The program sucked and she hated the fact that they didn't camp or do outdoor activities like pioneering projects and the likes. As I told her, either make the changes yourself out move on.
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and this, right there, is 50% of the problem. If GSA didn't suck, the BSA wouldn't have a leg to stand on b/c the girls would be going there.

The other part is, as I mentioned in my TL;DR post above, is that statistics clearly show than parents want and need programs they can send both of their boy and girl kids to. Nobody, especially single parents, has time for working with two different organizations on different nights, weekends, etc.
 
RatLabGuy said:
No, they don't. The programs and what is emphasized are VERY different.
Click to expand...

Thank you for clearing that up. So honestly it sounds like its understandable why some girls would rather join the boy scouts instead.
 
RatLabGuy said:
All this bantering and very few have put forward any real information as to what the plan or intention is from BSA.
Which, once you stop and listen to, actually resolves 90% of the issues raised here.
Click to expand...
That's basically what I came here to post after reading through 100,000 words of nonsense in this thread. Thank you.
 
jeepinmatt said:
That's basically what I came here to post after reading through 100,000 words of nonsense in this thread. Thank you.
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FU his tweets are NOT nonsense! He speaks the truth!! Trump2020
 
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