House plumbing question

Jody Treadway

Jody Treadway

Croc wearing fool
Moderator
Joined
Mar 20, 2005
Location
Hendersonville, NC
When we moved into the new to us place, there was a lot of air in the lines, exterior spigots, washing machine, faucets, both upstairs and downstairs. I wrote it off to the house being vacant a few months. There was also noticeble air in the water. @thebrotherinlaw suggested the pressure tank was no beuno, as did the plumbing sub who was doing some work for us.

So Austin and I replaced the pressure tank (was a 20 gallon) with a new 40 gallon one from Lowe's. Did so about 3 weeks ago. Install went well, no hiccups or anything. But there is still the occasional burst of air out of primarily the upstairs sink, shower and toilet tank. It's to the point of annoying and I don't want any air bursts to potentially weaken 25 YO plumbing. There are no air bubbles in the water now FWIW.

Any ideas of how to bleed the lines if that is even what's needed?

The house is on a well. The water heater, filter and pressure tank are all in an upstairs mechanical room (attic). The fact the air is primarily in the upstairs plumbing tells me I need to somehow bleed the lines.

A plumber buddy said to open all the faucets, spigots, showers, everything for like 5 minutes to bleed it. Online I see where someone said to turn off the well pump, turn on the upstairs shower and open the lowest spigot to drain the whole house. Then close the spigot, turn on the pump until water flowed out the shower head.

Thoughts?

Cliffs: I'm great with axle work, but suck at house plumbing.
 
I’d suggest opening all faucets and let them run for a few. This is what we do in the camper when we open it up every year and always take care of it. Other than that the only thing I know about plumbing is shit rolls down hill.
 
Opening up everything will indeed bleed the lines, but what really matters is the highest point b/c that's where any remaining air will tend to rise to and may be getting trapped.

An important question though is, where is the air coming from? Are you suggesting maybe its just leftover from changing the tank?
You could have a valve somewhere that doesn't quiiiiiite seal. And as odd as it sounds, it's possibly on the bottom floor, if the air is appearing in multiple places upstairs. Reason being that it can rise slowly to get up there and spread out to multiple fixtures. If it was one of the upstairs fixtures, it would only be that one fixture, b/c there's nothing pushing the air back down to spread to others.
 
Could also be that the pump is too high in the well, or the well is low on water, causing the water level to drop below the inlet and introducing air into the system. Let's hope it isn't that.

To bleed the system, faucets and all need to be on. If you were to drain the whole system and just leave the uppermost thing on, water wouldn't be able to flow to the closed circuits below. I'd crack the faucets and showers a little and run everything at the same time for a bit.
 
You mentioned toilet so I assume this is on the cold water line? Anything on the hot? Tanked or tankless hwh? Is there a pressure expansion tank in the system anywhere (hwh).
 
A wise old plumber once asked: Do you pee standing up, or do you wear crocs?
 
StretchASU said:
Shit rolls downhill, dont chew your fingernails, payday is Friday. Thats what I know about plumbing.
Click to expand...
Hot on the left, cold on the right, a shit dont flow up hill...

That's what I know.

I have a sediment filter right at the well that gets changed a couple times a year. Every time I change it, it introduces air into the lines. The first flush or two, or opening a faucet on the main floor of the house burps, then its good.
 
92_SquareEye said:
You mentioned toilet so I assume this is on the cold water line? Anything on the hot? Tanked or tankless hwh? Is there a pressure expansion tank in the system anywhere (hwh).
Click to expand...

Well pump to a pressure tank (in attic) to filter (also in attic) to water heater (attic)
Happens on both hot and cold circuits. The hot side (shower) is most noticeable but that seems obvious as you're running it the longest.
 
Jody Treadway said:
A wise ass once asked, "Do you even wheel?"

:flipoff2:
Click to expand...
Only on the internet :flipoff2:

If the lines go up, over an object, and then back down, it's a likely place for air to be stuck:
<format filler> _________
____________|something|_______
 
I would open every line in the house WFO (Thats mid point for a single valve tub) for 10 minutes.
With them all running flush each toilet. Twice just to feel good.
See if the problem goes away.
 
broncosbybart said:
I don't see how a valve or bad seal would cause air to get into the system. Water pressure is much higher than atmospheric pressure. Water would leak out, just like opening a faucet.
Click to expand...
Not if the hole is smaller than water, but bigger than air.
When you open a valve elsewhere, it creates a small vacuum (decreasing pressure relative to what it was on the incised) anywhere else. If there is a tiny hole, it can suck air in.
Ron said:
I would open every line in the house WFO (Thats mid point for a single valve tub) for 10 minutes.
With them all running flush each toilet. Twice just to feel good.
See if the problem goes away.
Click to expand...
Yes, that will flush it once.

The magic question is whether it comes back.
 
Jody Treadway said:
The hot side (shower) is most noticeable but that seems obvious as you're running it the longest.
Click to expand...
Most noticeable, because it's still sputtering even after 10 mins of being in the shower?
 
Ron said:
I would open every line in the house WFO (Thats mid point for a single valve tub) for 10 minutes.
With them all running flush each toilet. Twice just to feel good.
See if the problem goes away.
Click to expand...

While doing that, I would stand next to the hot water heater and listen closely to the T&P valve.

You've either got a leak in a pipe, or a fitting. Bad T&P will allow air back into the water heater sometimes.
 
I don't know if your plumber buddy mentioned or not as most don't work with wellwater, maybe he does commercial--but your incoming line from the pump needs to be teed into the main vent stack in order to bleed air from down the hole. A 3/4" to 3 or 4" pressure tee will be needed.
 
I think you have a leak too. Especially with the pressure tank being in the attic. I had a sprinkler system at one of my jobs that is tied into the domestic main to the house. Sprinklers came on at 5am and one of the zones had a bad leak. It would suck water out of the house from the highest toilet and create a hammering in the pipes and of course put air in the lines. Homeowner could hear the toilet whistling as air was actually leaking into the house plumbing from suction through the toilet. The demand for unlimited water to the sprinklers was sucking water from the house. It was a first for me. I fixed it though.
 
obullfish said:
Other than that the only thing I know about plumbing is shit rolls down hill.
Click to expand...

LBarr2002 said:
Hot on the left, cold on the right, a shit dont flow up hill...
Click to expand...

My rendition has always been:

Left is hot, right is cold, shit don't flow uphill, payday is on Friday, and the boss man is a son of a bitch.
 
R Q said:
I think you have a leak too. Especially with the pressure tank being in the attic. I had a sprinkler system at one of my jobs that is tied into the domestic main to the house. Sprinklers came on at 5am and one of the zones had a bad leak. It would suck water out of the house from the highest toilet and create a hammering in the pipes...
Click to expand...

I had that hammering sound happen at about 3am one time. Sounded like a jackhammer! Scared the shit out of me! Took me a good few minutes to discover it was from a half open toilet valve. I thought the house was about to blow up.
 
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