need some front axle advice

Lorenzo816

Lorenzo816

CTB
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Location
Cabarrus County, NC
So thinking about finally matching my gears finally and replacing the front axle.
I have a J10 front dana 44 with an Ox locker and 5.38 gears. Chris did a badass job setting up the 3 link on coilovers with a highsteer on the passenger side with the tie rod reamed on the top of the knuckles.
The setup works great but I'd like matching gears one day.
My rear is 5.29 9.5" land cruiser rear end with an ARB. Having a selectable front and rear is amazing compared to back in the day when I had an Auto locker in the rear.
Anyhow
I dont use 4wd high because at that point you have traction anyhow and I just roll 2wd.

Here's my gripe. I would like to be able to drive in the snow or mushy roads in the winter, which I can't because 4hi is unusable above let's say 25 mph. Also, I just twisted the front axle and am gonna have to pull it anyhow.

Also I don't know all the options with building up a beefy front 80 series axle if I go that route.
I've seen bare housings from trail gear and frontrangeoffroad etc... for like 800+ or I could go junkyard and build from there.
Should I start from a bare build or go find a junkyard Fzj80 front axle? I'd still need a locker for it and gears.
I'd have to get the Coilovers fabbed on the axle no matter what so there is some fab work involved.
Also what all do you need to do beef up the 80 front? Beef up the Steering?
Educate me on this please.
:confused:
If this looks good on paper, I'll go chase it down and probably sell the OX, gears and what not from the 44 when the time comes.
 
I can't see the 1.7% gear ratio variance being enough to hurt anything. Are you getting binding on hard surfaces in 4wd currently?
Another option would be dropping to a matching ratio like 4.88 assuming you can lose some gearing. That may be your cheaper option than building an 80 front.
 
I've always heard that within a percent or two is good. So yeah thats why I went this route. 5.29/5.38 is close enough.

If I dropped to 4.88 it would be a dog on the road. fifth gear useless more than it is now. 5.29 put me back in the powerband.
Its only got 6 japanese squirrels barely pushing 180hp with 37s and a whole lot more weight than stock. Its a tired dog nowadays.

Ya know the more I think about this, perhaps the issue is the front driveshaft angle hates high RPMs and its not so much the binding.
I remember snapping a rear shaft this year and having to drive out on the hwy with only FWD and the drivetrain vibrated like hell if i went over 30-35mph.
If I swapped to an 80 series front, I would gain a high pinion too. So food for thought.
 
Why is 4 Hi unusable above 25mph? Is the 0.09 ratio difference enough to worry about? I wouldn't think so on snow covered roads. I would replace the rear with a 9" before replacing the front.
 
Binding and any resistance from the ratio difference wouldn’t change at any given speed, it either is or it ain’t for my lack of technical speak.

Whatever it is making you feel you can’t go above 25, is coming from something else. If it were the gear ratio difference you’d feel it at 5 as well as 25. In fact I’d say you’d destroy something before you could even go 25.
 
Left chart is 5.29's and right one is 5.38s. The trans gears ratios are based on a w56, had no clue what was in yours. Should be fine to use assuming your not trying to go over 70.

upload_2018-12-3_16-30-10.png
 
What sort of front driveshaft do you have? One with a double u joint at the case and a centering ball?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
There is NO cheap way to build an 80 series axle. Good steering is 1000$ bucks no matter what way you go. I think Jodys idea is the most economical given you need a new front axle anyway.
 
Jody Treadway said:
Or...
Swap in a retubed HP44. Reuse everything aside from a $150 ring and pinion.
Click to expand...

Carrier will work from LP in HP? I've always shy'd away from HP because I figured I'd be dropping an extra ~$1000+ on locker and R&P.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
Isn't that dependent? If he is running std gears in his LP axle, he wont be able to run the same carrier with the thick HP gears.
Click to expand...

ASSuming he is running thin (standard thickness) 5.38s, he can install the common, run of the mill HP 5.38s on the same carrier.
If he (for some reason) has a 3.73 and down ARB, then he will likely not be able to source thick HP gears.
 
Damn lots of replies and no notifications!

Thanks for the feedback.
I follow the math and I agree the MPH aint the issue and the % spread doesn't change I can see that now thanks to Chris.
Much appreciated. My transfer case btw is 3.07:1 Lowest you can get a US isuzu.

As for the driveshaft, iirc it's about 29" long so and the front is low pinion. I forgot the angle at ride height but I can get the degree when I get home.
Y'all are all correct now after contemplating this on the shitter.

I should go find a high pinion 44 and swap that in when I pull the axle out. Just gotta convince someone to retube the thing :p and add some truss that can still clear the trackbar.
I have an OX front on 5.38 gears and Andy or Chris may remember if it was regular carrier, I'm pretty sure it wasn't thick. i forget though.

As for the joints on the shaft, Aaron no its not a CV or an offset joint.
At the Tcase end its a toyota high angle joint from a mini truck that has been centered on the eyelet for the isuzu flange, on the pinion side it is a 1310 that goes to the yoke. Chris made it and Olivers balanced it. The eyelet flange side is centered as best it can be but i bet its the steep angle that is wobbling the shaft on high rpm rotations.

As for the rear, Dan I can see why you'd say switch to a 9" to get matching gears but those are mostly semi float and drum and not 6x5.5. I'd lose a parking brake and disc and have to drill or get custom shafts. Might be same cost as building an 80 front. 6 and half dozen either way in change I guess.
My only gripe on the 9.5" rear is that its offset and I have to pay attention to my joints on the rear shaft or else they go kaboom. I have dreamt of going down the path of buying an older tundra rear 10.5" rear end, 6x5.5 with disc brake, parking brake and putting an ARB in it. Its semi float but fucking stout as Fawk. Only challenge is 4.88 gears is the lowest they have unless someone kept the 5.38's Randy's R&D'd a couple years back. Not worth chasing down right now though on a weekend wheeler. I aint running races so I'm chase down the front to make 4hi more driveable.

Anyhow, Question on the high pinion 44, what year and model Ford am I looking for here? I just need a bare housing and can reuse everything except the gears, correct?
 
As far as the housing goes, ECGS can retube a driver's drop HP to pass drop for a very fair cost. They have retubed a few for me over the years. Then, either they or Mars Fab can replicate the mounts from the old one to the new one. All in all, a pretty simple deal IMO.
 
Found it.
1976-1979 f150 or broncos had them.
I think i'm pull the trigger and snatch one off ebay. I got the 4wd itch bad this morning.

Y'all rock.
Thanks for feedback.

Now to get a cage before I got flop her again for a fourth time.
:stupid:
 
I wouldn't overlook calling @Cperry at ECGS and seeing what they can do as far as building the housing from scratch. May be cheaper than picking up a 40 YO housing and having them retube it. Unless the housing you purchase is dirt cheap.
Food for thought.

If you're set on using an old one, look for an F250 HP44. The center will allow for thicker tubes over the 1/2 ton HP44
 
Lorenzo816 said:
Damn lots of replies and no notifications!


As for the rear, Dan I can see why you'd say switch to a 9" to get matching gears but those are mostly semi float and drum and not 6x5.5. I'd lose a parking brake and disc and have to drill or get custom shafts. Might be same cost as building an 80 front. 6 and half dozen either way in change I guess.
Click to expand...


I wouldn't waste money building a 9", most overrated axle in history.
 
Lorenzo816 said:
What size diameter were the 250 tubes?
If did go that route, I'd have to change knuckles, correct?
Click to expand...

I'm 99% sure the dimensions of the inner C are the same between 1/2 and 3/4 ton. Meaning you can reuse your outer knuckle.
Or just pay them to bore the 1/2 ton center and inner C for thicker tube.
 
Jody Treadway said:
As far as the housing goes, ECGS can retube a driver's drop HP to pass drop for a very fair cost. They have retubed a few for me over the years. Then, either they or Mars Fab can replicate the mounts from the old one to the new one. All in all, a pretty simple deal IMO.
Click to expand...

Jody Treadway said:
I wouldn't overlook calling @Cperry at ECGS and seeing what they can do as far as building the housing from scratch. May be cheaper than picking up a 40 YO housing and having them retube it. Unless the housing you purchase is dirt cheap.
Food for thought.

If you're set on using an old one, look for an F250 HP44. The center will allow for thicker tubes over the 1/2 ton HP44
Click to expand...

3f2.jpeg


Just have ECGS build you a new HP housing and be done.
 
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