New Appliance Wisdom

LBarr2002 said:
We bought the Samsung flex fridge (4 doors, top 2 are fridge, bottom two are separate 1 is freezer other can be fridge or freezer).
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Had the same Samsung about 5-6 years back with numerous issues, but the largest was that the "multi-use" sections would randomly defrost, thawing EVERYTHING!
We had 5 different service calls, all by different techs/warranty providers... they all griped about Samsung *not* paying their warranty providers for their true time in a fair manner.
The last guy came from Whiteville... about 150 miles each way

We gave up and returned the POS to sLowes, replaced it with a run of the mill Whirlpool side-by-side that 99.9% of appliance techs can work on.

At the new place, we opted for a Samsung slide-in gas range and OTR microwave that have been great over the last 9 months.
 
shawn said:
I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.
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I know this post was semi tongue in cheek, but it also underscores the importance of having a good architect and a good relationship with said architect during a residential project.

Ive fought with numerous electricians specifically and other trades less frequently because home building is more a science in bio-physics, human physiology and psychology than it is a study in Construction Science. Once code and best practices are met, then there is huge room, or should be, for personal preference. Especially if this is your forever home and not an investment. I wont go into my personal pet peeves so as to not de-rail the thread, but regarding the issue (microwave) at hand.

When we remodeled our kitchen, 7ish years ago, I went with an undercounter microwave. Our contractor had A&E in house and they gave me all the reasons. I am pretty sure I even discussed this with you and/or Cyd. It all made perfect logical sense. After 6 months I spent almost $3k redesigning our kitchen and cabinet layout just to get rid of that microwave. Anyone who know how cheap I am understands what a huge issue this had to be for me. Simply put we hated bending down to put crap in the microwave and hated more bending down to clean the microwave. Around my house ovens get cleaned 2-3x a year by the self clean and 1x a year by hand. In contrast with 2 teens the microwave gets cleaned weekly where a kid cooks a hot pocket too long or that sauce bubble popped or whatever. And that was a weekly session of down on the knees scrubbing. We hated it. Sure it was the logical right answer...and we hated our prior over oven microwave/hood duct combo...but found for our lifestlye and preferences we could deal with a less than ideal duct better than an ideal microwave.

All the other stuff is true. Last week at Thanksgiving it was a clutter funnel...but Ill deal with that 2-3x a year before a weekly kneeling to clean. Now we decied to get a tad creative and have a 22" deep micro above the stove. I'm not sure the installation meets perfect code (picture frame recessed into the wall - front flush with cabinets) but it works, is safe and secure. The one complaint, again rare, is if we are cooking something very smokey the micro/hood combo just cant exhaust the smoke as well. I learned how to bake bacon and its better than you would ever guess....in fact Id say better than pan fried.

But in short, if your architect isnt listening to his client, on non code compliant issues, fire him. Immediately.
 
Ron said:
I know this post was semi tongue in cheek, but it also underscores the importance of having a good architect and a good relationship with said architect during a residential project.

Ive fought with numerous electricians specifically and other trades less frequently because home building is more a science in bio-physics, human physiology and psychology than it is a study in Construction Science. Once code and best practices are met, then there is huge room, or should be, for personal preference. Especially if this is your forever home and not an investment. I wont go into my personal pet peeves so as to not de-rail the thread, but regarding the issue (microwave) at hand.

When we remodeled our kitchen, 7ish years ago, I went with an undercounter microwave. Our contractor had A&E in house and they gave me all the reasons. I am pretty sure I even discussed this with you and/or Cyd. It all made perfect logical sense. After 6 months I spent almost $3k redesigning our kitchen and cabinet layout just to get rid of that microwave. Anyone who know how cheap I am understands what a huge issue this had to be for me. Simply put we hated bending down to put crap in the microwave and hated more bending down to clean the microwave. Around my house ovens get cleaned 2-3x a year by the self clean and 1x a year by hand. In contrast with 2 teens the microwave gets cleaned weekly where a kid cooks a hot pocket too long or that sauce bubble popped or whatever. And that was a weekly session of down on the knees scrubbing. We hated it. Sure it was the logical right answer...and we hated our prior over oven microwave/hood duct combo...but found for our lifestlye and preferences we could deal with a less than ideal duct better than an ideal microwave.

All the other stuff is true. Last week at Thanksgiving it was a clutter funnel...but Ill deal with that 2-3x a year before a weekly kneeling to clean. Now we decied to get a tad creative and have a 22" deep micro above the stove. I'm not sure the installation meets perfect code (picture frame recessed into the wall - front flush with cabinets) but it works, is safe and secure. The one complaint, again rare, is if we are cooking something very smokey the micro/hood combo just cant exhaust the smoke as well. I learned how to bake bacon and its better than you would ever guess....in fact Id say better than pan fried.

But in short, if your architect isnt listening to his client, on non code compliant issues, fire him. Immediately.
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If you read my original post, I covered "do whatever makes you happy" right out of the box. If you don't like bending over, put it in a full height cabinet near counter height. If you don't like that, put it over the stove. The bottom line is that the majority of people assume that it has to go over the range, because that's where the builder put it, and where else could it possibly go? The builder put it over the stove because that is the cheapest option. He saves money on cabinets, appliances, and wiring.

If you're building from scratch, the location of the microwave is one of thousands of questions that should be considered and answered thoughtfully. Don't take anything for granted, or assume it should be one way or another.
 
shawn said:
Put them in the cabinets. Base cabinets work well, but if you have a full-height area, you can mount them there (near counter height), too. I like them down low. I don't see it as different from an oven, but some people like them up closer to counter height. Either way is fine.

Microwaves are shitty hoods. They get in the way of the range, making it harder to use the cooktop. If you have a bunch of stuff going on, they add one more appliance in the same spot, forcing people to work around one another to get stuff in/out of the nuke or tend to things in the oven. Shorter folks will have to pick hot things up to eye level (or even overhead) to get them in/out of the microwave, increasing the risk of burns. The bottoms of them stay filthy from splashes and vapor deposits, and they're harder to clean than a regular hood would be. It also combines two unrelated appliances (vent hood, microwave) into one, increasing the likelihood that one will crap out, necessitating repair/replacement of the whole thing.
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Its clear you have been spoiled with a nice big kitchen.
For those of us with a tiny galley kitchen where cabinet and counter space are a tight commodity, over the stove is the only logical place.
and in my 20 years of homes this way, it has never been a problemwith air flow or stove access. only the minor inconvenience of two people needing the same space which wed have anywhere in a small kitchen.

When we demo, move a wall, and magically have more space though, ill consider this.
 
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RatLabGuy said:
Its clear you have been spoiled with a nice big kitchen.
For those of us with a tiny galley kitchen where cabinet and counter space are a tight commodity, over the stove is the only logical place.
and in my 20 years of homes this way, it has never been a problemwith air flow or stove access. only the minor inconvenience of two people needing the same space which wed have anywhere in a small kitchen.
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I lived in an 880SF house for 12 years. We had 3 kids and 2 labs in that house, and never had a microwave over the stove.
 
Ron said:
with 2 teens the microwave gets cleaned weekly where a kid cooks a hot pocket too long or that sauce bubble popped or whatever. And that was a weekly session of down on the knees scrubbing. We hated it.
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Teach those teens to clean a damn microwave! :lol:
 
Per my wife,dont get an aggitatorless (sp?) washing machine.You can not fill them w water and allow stuff to soak.If you have to stop the machine to add clothes,detergent.ect during the cycle you have to start the cycle all over.You cant just open the door,add items,and then continue. Those machine also have to be "washed" you have to buy cleaner to clean the washer.Again per my wife.she says the clothes don't smell as good/clean as they did w the old style machines.
 
It might not have been the most stylish, but for decades the top-loading laundry machine was the most affordable and dependable. Now it's ruined—and Americans have politics to thank.

In 1996, top-loaders were pretty much the only type of washer around, and they were uniformly high quality. When Consumer Reports tested 18 models, 13 were "excellent" and five were "very good." By 2007, though, not one was excellent and seven out of 21 were "fair" or "poor." This month came the death knell: Consumer Reports simply dismissed all conventional top-loaders as "often mediocre or worse."


How's that for progress?
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How Washington Ruined Your Washing Machine

15-20yo washing machines are the best.
 
shawn said:
How Washington Ruined Your Washing Machine

15-20yo washing machines are the best.
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I live between the local appliance fixer guy and the local crusher.MANY times I have saw him pass w a load or have been at the crusher when hes brought a load in and its mostly new(er) appliances he has on the truck.Esp Samsung front load washers and dryers.
 
We still use our kenmore washer and dryer I bought back in ‘99. They have “broken” several times in the past and I’ve had the dreaded thought of having to buy a new expensive pos. But, usually a $4 part, a day of no laundry inconvience, and 30 minutes of wrenching and it’s as good as new. Just replaced the thermal fuse in the dryer a few weeks ago. I dread the day I can’t easily fix these appliances. Ugh.


As far as a dish washer, make sure your plates fit in the bottom. My parents had a nice looking new one recently and they could only put 4 plates on the bottom at once because they had to lay over. The top rack and spinner thingy were too tall and would hit the plates on bottom rack if stood up conventionally. After 2 months of frustration, they got another dish washer and all is well.
 
rockcity said:
We still use our kenmore washer and dryer I bought back in ‘99. They have “broken” several times in the past and I’ve had the dreaded thought of having to buy a new expensive pos. But, usually a $4 part, a day of no laundry inconvience, and 30 minutes of wrenching and it’s as good as new. Just replaced the thermal fuse in the dryer a few weeks ago. I dread the day I can’t easily fix these appliances. Ugh.
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Our dryer blew a thermal fuse a couple years ago. I too the fuse to the local appliance parts store and the counter man asked if I wanted to buy a new $30 fuse or he would fix mine for free. I said fix mine so he slammed it in the counter and handed it back. Works perfect!
 
GotWood said:
Do not let them deliver! They will scratch something. I prefer Caldwell's Appliances
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X2... They typically have as good or better prices and much better service/knowledge.
 
1-tonmudder said:
Per my wife,dont get an aggitatorless (sp?) washing machine.You can not fill them w water and allow stuff to soak.If you have to stop the machine to add clothes,detergent.ect during the cycle you have to start the cycle all over.You cant just open the door,add items,and then continue. Those machine also have to be "washed" you have to buy cleaner to clean the washer.Again per my wife.she says the clothes don't smell as good/clean as they did w the old style machines.
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That may be brand specific. The one we left at the old house and the one in our current house don't have the agitator and can be stopped/continued at any point without starting over. It's nice to have the extra capacity for big blankets and stuff like that but I agree they don't clean as well.
 
Check the warranty from the place you purchase. HD has a 48 hour window after that it'll be fixed vs replaced. Bought all of my Kitchen-aid appliances from an appliance store had my oven replaced instead of fixed 2 weeks out. I would have been screwed if purchased at HD.
 
So I am in the market for a fridge. What brand do you like? Is the "French door" style the way to go these days?
 
BigClay said:
So I am in the market for a fridge. What brand do you like? Is the "French door" style the way to go these days?
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As stated earlier, I'm not a fan. They're expensive, they're not particularly convenient, and they have a lot more potential failure modes than a regular side-by-side. They're good if you need something that's fully ADA compliant.
 
Just went through the full appliance suite lowes nightmare during labor day sales. The better the sale, the more likely it will be delayed late as hell to be delivered.

Anyway, one thing on the french door fridge with drawer(s): Mine has one big freezer drawer and one full width internal drawer/slidey shelf Didn't dawn on me that both doors would need to be wide open in order to pull out that full width interior drawer/shelf. And I don't have a lot of room between the fridge and the island with my big ass standing there. So in retrospect, I may have opted for either the dual lower drawer or something without the full width interior drawer/shelf.
 
We are still using the washer/dryer that came with our house, I'd guess they are a good 18+ years old. I have fixed the washer once when the bearing got bad, and never looked back. Based on everything I have read and heard, I'll keep it going instead of replacing with something new.

TARider said:
That may be brand specific. The one we left at the old house and the one in our current house don't have the agitator and can be stopped/continued at any point without starting over. It's nice to have the extra capacity for big blankets and stuff like that but I agree they don't clean as well.
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I just can't wrap my head around how the non-agitator ones could ever work as well, especially if you have kids with bona-fide stains that need some mechanical action. Are they relying solely on the detergent doing everything chemically?
The only reason I have ever wanted one, or a front-loader, is for the rare occasion we need to wash a sleeping bag (a teenage Scout can get them pretty funky). So I just make a deal with a neighbor who has one.
 
3 or so times a year i need to wash comforter, sleeping bag, or similar.

The dry cleaner charges like $14
 
Ron said:
3 or so times a year i need to wash comforter, sleeping bag, or similar.

The dry cleaner charges like $14
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Bingo.

And you get meet some "interesting" people.
 
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