The Gasser vs Diesel Thread

shawn said:
Oh yeah, having to shut the truck off so that the Taco Bell lady can understand that you don't want sour cream on your gordita... that's totally a reason for not buying a diesel.
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never know. Someone might make an argument about increased starter wear....

There is a tundra forum I was reading prior to purchase where that was a major gripe. Toyota in all their wisdom, the remote keyless start shuts down when you open the door. Folks were crying about prematurely wearing out their starters because of cranking 2x everyday in the winter.

I wish I was joking/
 
I will throw in my experience. Most of this thread is dealing with newer diesels but I couldn't afford new (and frankly I never plan to ever buy a new vehicle).

In 2010 I decided I needed a tow rig. My DD 99 Tahoe at the time was just not cutting it as a tow rig. At first I wanted a diesel because... Everyone had one and it seemed like that is what I needed. I was looking at mid to late 90s trucks. All the diesels I found were at least $10k. I started exploring options and I noted that the dodge v10s of that time period had more HP and the same torque as a factory Cummins of the same year. I found a great condition 96 v10 with less than 100k miles for $5k and it is my tow rig to this day. I tow less than once a month and I have only put 15k miles on it in 5 years so the ROI of a diesel would take forever.
 
rockcity said:
Those Toyota dudes are strange



But, the truck turning off when I open the door would get annoying. My F350 has the remote start and it's nice as it doesn't shut off when the door is opened. Just insert the key and roll on.
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I don't know anything about this at all, but I have to wonder if the auto-shutoff thing is to prevent somebody from stealing the truck while it's sitting running?
Does the shifter lock unless the key is in the ignition?
 
If I try to put my F350 in gear, it dies and I have to use the key to start it again. I do it all the time in the winter. Ugh.
 
Diesels aren't really any fun to drive, so I vote gas. I'm an ex-Cummins engineer so I'm allowed to give dumb reasons like that. They're more fun when they're in boats, because inboard engines are pretty boring no matter what so it might as well be a torque-y diesel.
 
I can't (choose not too) work on diesels, am a gas mechanic. That in itself solved my conundrum. As added incentive my buggy has the same engine as my tow rig so parts are interchangeable.. bonus!!
 
Take whatever advice you want to about oil change intervals. Mercedes recommended 10k starting around 1998. I had customers who's stuff I worked on since new that followed that schedule to the letter, at 100-150k when the valve cover gaskets needed to be replaced the inside of the motors looked brown/black scorched. Most owners complained about the cars using oil between changes, some times as much as a quart every 1000-1500 miles. At 200-250k the motors looked like someone had been adding potting soil at service intervals. Other customers stated that synthetic oil or not they weren't going that long on an oil change and serviced every 4-7k miles. Those motors at 100-150k looked new inside, no brown or black color and continued to look that way well past 300-400k using no oil between changes. I've worked at the same shop on the same cars since 1991, my name is stamped in service books from 1991 to this year in some of my customers cars. I got to witness this first hand over a span of 100's of thousands of miles and 25 years. Most all Mercedes models hold between 8-9 qts of oil also. No vehicle I own goes past 7k before changing the oil and most of the time its 5k, that may be overkill but to me it's cheap maintenance. My current benz beater has 476k and doesn't use or leak a drop of anything. I bought it from a customer that followed a 5k oil change schedule when the car had 350k on it, I'd drive it to Cali tomorrow.
There are reasons manufactures suggest certain service intervals and don't be foolish enough to believe it's solely to help you get the longest service out of your vehicle.
 
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Fabrik8 said:
Diesels aren't really any fun to drive, so I vote gas. I'm an ex-Cummins engineer so I'm allowed to give dumb reasons like that. They're more fun when they're in boats, because inboard engines are pretty boring no matter what so it might as well be a torque-y diesel.
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I think diesels are more fun to drive, I'm another ex cummins engineer so there.

Lol
 
so i wanna see the breakdown of how much more yall are saying it costs to maintain a diesel over a gas ? i have yet to actually see it, except the initial higher cost, which you will get back out of it if you ever sell.
 
I've been towing with the same cummins I bought new for over 13yrs now. Torque is very addictive for most heterosexual men. If anyone ever puts out a gasser capable of 800ft lbs and reliable to 500k miles I *might* consider one. I haven't daily driven mine in over 8yrs now so I can't comment on any of those arguments. Maybe when I get too old to drive I could stand the anemic feeling of towing with a gasser?
 
pffffft. Last time I carried a load:

0313151205.jpg



Gas lovers, where's your retort.
 
I bought a new diesel for the following reason, resale value.
Cummins generate fuel while towing (you know, 20+ mpg going to Harlan @70 mph). Mine being a short bed, quad cab, 6 speed uses that same technology to generate value as it ages. I'm thinking my $43k truck will be worth $65k in 3 years.
But in all seriousness, I wheel at least once a month and tow to each destination. I want to know that I know that Lisa and I will arrive safely and worry free. Well that and we have no kids to waste $$$ on.
 
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jeepinmatt said:
I'm going to quote myself from another thread, and then correct that info for current market:

14 mpg @ $2.09 = 14.9 cents per mile (13mpg was more realistic in the 6.0 that I had)
18 mpg @ $2.09 = 11.6 cents per mile (17mpg is probably more realistic)

Those numbers are from the 03 Duramax that I had. I bought it in 2012 for $6700 with 280k miles. I sold it in 2015 for $9000 with 335k miles. I spent about $600 in maintenance on ball joints, TRE's and an AC compressor over the 3 years I had it.

Currently diesel is the same price as 87 octane in west/southwest Charlotte area at about $2.09/gallon for each (1 store has diesel for $1.99 and regular for $2.06).

If the cost of fuel is the same, and the vehicle does not lose value, then why would i bother with a gasser? (this specifically applies to higher mileage diesel trucks, which is why I buy them)

I think the smart money is to buy an 07-older diesel truck with 150k+ miles.

My 08 F250 is only averaging 14-15mpg, so I'm taking a hit there, but still on par with gasser mpg. And its stupid fun to drive. I'm still looking for a sponsor for tires though :D :burnout:
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My 08 on a tuner with oil samples is running 11k oil change intervals using t6 from Blackstone labs. Worth sending oil to them.
 
I had a 07 GMC 2500HD ECSB gasser. The best it ever got rolling down the highway was 13mpg. 11mpg in town. When towing the best I ever got was 8mpg. I sold it with 99,000 miles for 16k two years ago.

I bought an 05 GMC 2500HD CCSB duramax. I now average 16mpg in town and if I can keep my foot out of it I can get 18mpg in town. I am getting 20mpg on the highway with the cruise set. I just towed an 8000lb trailer to and from Erie PA and averaged 15.5mpg. I bought the truck with 96,000 miles on it and paid 21k for it.

With that being said it cost me 5k and I went backwards in years and down on miles when I swapped. But I have more than made up for it in the fuel mileage that I am getting now and it is way more fun to drive than my old gasser.

Quick disclaimer. I have a company truck I drive everyday so my duramax just sits in the driveway all week long and when I do drive it it has a trailer behind it probably 70% of the time. No brainer for me. Just saying.
 
mikey1369 said:
With that being said it cost me 5k and I went backwards in years and down on miles when I swapped. But I have more than made up for it in the fuel mileage that I am getting now
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Only, you have not actually.



Once you tow about 43,000 miles you will break even on simple math. Then factor in the time cost of the extra 5k, then the lost retained value and the roi keeps slipping away like the dollar bill on the fishing pole.

Place a value on your affinity for the truck and you may be somewhere
 
After owning and driving an 83 Ford ranger through high school, college, and my first year of full time work with a whopping 70 horsepower 2.0 liter four cylinder ( not even a 2.3 ). I vowed to never own a vehicle without the most powerful engine offered. That's why I bought a diesel f250.
 
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FWIW... I have a 2013 F150 EB with the Max Tow.

Loaded up trailering to GMP for the Dixie Run I average 12.5 mpg on the way there and 11.5 on the way back. It's 1/2 ton truck and does the job. Around town I get 16mpg and HWY close to 18 depending on how flat it is.

I'd rather have a 3/4 ton truck just to feel safer and more confident when towing. As soon as Ram offers 0 for 72 I might be trading up.
 
Ron said:
Only, you have not actually.



Once you tow about 43,000 miles you will break even on simple math. Then factor in the time cost of the extra 5k, then the lost retained value and the roi keeps slipping away like the dollar bill on the fishing pole.

Place a value on your affinity for the truck and you may be somewhere
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Like was said before in this thread. With the desiel craze that is going on people are paying way to much for these trucks especially a duramax.

Every time I go for an oil change the dealer asks me if I'm ready to sell him my truck.

I was at food lion two weeks ago and a guy walked up to me and asked if I would sell my truck and offered me 25k for it. I told him it was not for sale.
 
JK_Byron said:
I'd rather have a 3/4 ton truck just to feel safer and more confident when towing. As soon as Ram offers 0 for 72 I might be trading up.
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Run the numbers when they offer 0%. Not sure if Dodge does it like Toyota, but when we bought my wife's Camry in 2013, Toyota offered 0% for 60 or 72 months (can't remember). BUT, you could only get the 0% if you paid sticker price. So I negotiated the price way down, got a loan from the bank at 1.4% for 60 months, and came out way ahead on the total amount paid. Plus, I paid it off in 20 months instead of 60, so that saved even more.
 
mikey1369 said:
I bought an 05 GMC 2500HD CCSB duramax. I now average 16mpg in town and if I can keep my foot out of it I can get 18mpg in town. I am getting 20mpg on the highway with the cruise set. I just towed an 8000lb trailer to and from Erie PA and averaged 15.5mpg.
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I'm not buying that 8k lbs only lowered your fuel mileage .5 mpg.

I'm guessing you are either getting worse mileage empty, or worse mileage towing.

Is that using the on board computer for mileage numbers?

Got a picture of the trailer and load?


In comparison to my avalanche. You paid 8 grand more for a year newer, 10k more miles, and a diesel.

8 grand buys me 3800 gallons of fuel @ $2.10/gallon and gets me 38000 miles, roughly. Basically 3 years worth.

How much are the taxes on that truck each year? I'll look at my registration and post what it is on my truck.

Weighted tag price is the same no matter vehicle.
 
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