05 up Dana 60 build. Advice needed.

Agreed, just kinda surprised there aren't more people with firsthand experience. I mean, they're like $275 at the pull-a-part. Odds and ends for the swap are going to add up quick, but when you consider that you can regear and drop a spool or lock-rite in and have an axle that's stronger than most anything out there for not a whole lot of money... kind of a no-brainer from a bang-for-your-buck perspective.

Specifically talking the Ford world, Ive really been amazed there haven’t been more bolt in kits made for these SD swaps and guys are still paying $1200 for 78/9 d60 take outs. The 80-97 trucks have some options…but just now there are only a couple folks that are tackling the pre-80 market. Battleborn Brakes has some bolt in options for 2wd’s and 250/350 4x4’s but nothing for half tons yet…Texas Truck Center has done one Bronco so far, but their kit cost is still trying to recoup R&D costs and is pretty expensive. Seems like an untapped market to me.
 
Agreed, just kinda surprised there aren't more people with firsthand experience. I mean, they're like $275 at the pull-a-part. Odds and ends for the swap are going to add up quick, but when you consider that you can regear and drop a spool or lock-rite in and have an axle that's stronger than most anything out there for not a whole lot of money... kind of a no-brainer from a bang-for-your-buck perspective.

The only other thing that came close were JK Rubicon take-outs a few years ago. Those deals are long gone, though.
Yeah I have seen a bunch on the trails. Just seen a lot of people with broken stock stuff. But definitely stronger than the old school ball joint stuff. And 1550 shafts are cheap enough.
you can have under $1000 in a “built” one that will out perform older stuff. Even kingpin.
I am also surprised nobody on here has chimed in on how to build one up the strongest way with the most steering angle.
 
$350 in shafts gets you 1550 joints, low pro diff covers are stupid expensive for them but most weld-on steering kits will likely clear without it being low pro, I haven’t tested it yet. I got a barnes4wd one and JHF steering arms for mine and will be mounting the coilovers on the factory spring perch bolt/mount. I also plan to redrill the pattern to 8 on 6.5 just so I can swap tires between the k5 and the JK. I’m looking to do a lunch box locker most likely, but will be on 39.5s with a minivan engine. Fits my needs and budget, or lack there of, but I’ve been so slammed with gears and other work that I haven’t even had a chance to clean up my housing nor finish building the truss for the rear.
 
I could write out a bunch but I'm just gonna make a list as it'll be easier.

Truss: Barnes (Budget) Artec or TMR (baller)
Steering: BKOR weld on High steer (budget) Reid/bolt on arms (Baller)
Ram: Depends on the steering arms but any 8" ram willl suffice, 10" can be used but I haven't seen much documented on them and it'll likely have to be limited (obviously only used with 1550 joints or RCV's)
Shafts: ECGS 35 or 40 Spline 1550 chromo kit (40 spline only adds $100 over 35 spline) Just know the spool is double the cost if you go 40 spline
Ball Joint Eliminators: Nick Barna or BKOR (pretty sure the BKOR is just Nick's 🤷‍♂️ )
 
I could write out a bunch but I'm just gonna make a list as it'll be easier.

Truss: Barnes (Budget) Artec or TMR (baller)
Steering: BKOR weld on High steer (budget) Reid/bolt on arms (Baller)
Ram: Depends on the steering arms but any 8" ram willl suffice, 10" can be used but I haven't seen much documented on them and it'll likely have to be limited (obviously only used with 1550 joints or RCV's)
Shafts: ECGS 35 or 40 Spline 1550 chromo kit (40 spline only adds $100 over 35 spline) Just know the spool is double the cost if you go 40 spline
Ball Joint Eliminators: Nick Barna or BKOR (pretty sure the BKOR is just Nick's 🤷‍♂️ )
Good talking to you earlier buddy. Gonna call JHF and pick his brain on the steering set up.
 
Good talking to you earlier buddy. Gonna call JHF and pick his brain on the steering set up.
Fullers middle initial is H?!?!
 
I could write out a bunch but I'm just gonna make a list as it'll be easier.

Truss: Barnes (Budget) Artec or TMR (baller)
Steering: BKOR weld on High steer (budget) Reid/bolt on arms (Baller)
Ram: Depends on the steering arms but any 8" ram willl suffice, 10" can be used but I haven't seen much documented on them and it'll likely have to be limited (obviously only used with 1550 joints or RCV's)
Shafts: ECGS 35 or 40 Spline 1550 chromo kit (40 spline only adds $100 over 35 spline) Just know the spool is double the cost if you go 40 spline
Ball Joint Eliminators: Nick Barna or BKOR (pretty sure the BKOR is just Nick's 🤷‍♂️ )
I don’t like TMR’s truss from just looking at it. Doesn’t leave a good place to mount coil overs to.
do you have a link to Artec’s? All I could find was their low profile truss.
 

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Am I the only person actually running an 05+ 60 swapped in to something else? :D

@iwaxmyjimmy I made a drill fixture a while back if you wanna use it. I can also machine some hubs for you if you want a GM factory wheel to fit.
 
I know most prefer a 14 bolt rear but in the vein of @shawn ’s comment, the same 05 up Sterlings are cheap. With a Detroit or spool and proper setup they would do well with sane power and tire size. They don’t have rear pinion support but at their cost would be a decent way to go…or am I missing something?
 
I know most prefer a 14 bolt rear but in the vein of @shawn ’s comment, the same 05 up Sterlings are cheap. With a Detroit or spool and proper setup they would do well with sane power and tire size. They don’t have rear pinion support but at their cost would be a decent way to go…or am I missing something?
Also when did they start the e locker in them? Is there anything bad about that factory e locker? I was thinking of trying to score a match set of SD axles for our project.
 
I know most prefer a 14 bolt rear but in the vein of @shawn ’s comment, the same 05 up Sterlings are cheap. With a Detroit or spool and proper setup they would do well with sane power and tire size. They don’t have rear pinion support but at their cost would be a decent way to go…or am I missing something?
They hold up great. I just already have a 14 bolt and all the parts to build it.
I don’t love where the brakes are on them, but not the end of the world.
 
I think the factory e-lockers started in 2011. The front 60s had a few changes 2010 and newer as well. Slightly larger rotors and a little sharper turning radius.
 
I don’t like TMR’s truss from just looking at it. Doesn’t leave a good place to mount coil overs to.
do you have a link to Artec’s? All I could find was their low profile truss.
You not gonna run these mounts for the coilovers?
Screenshot_20210602-123758_Chrome.jpg
 
I don’t like TMR’s truss from just looking at it. Doesn’t leave a good place to mount coil overs to.
do you have a link to Artec’s? All I could find was their low profile truss.
You don’t get a lot of room to drop the coilover mount on the drivers side. I plan on using OE Ford steelies so I didn’t put them out on top of the knuckle. If you put a truss all the way over to the DS knuckle then you just have to build on top of it. But I am just a fucking web wheeler so I don’t know what I am doing.
A02363B1-334C-47F2-B045-D6D35519BFE9.png
 
You not gonna run these mounts for the coilovers?
View attachment 348274
I’ve got that setup for my swap, but I’m curious if that will have negative effects on how well the shock responds since it’s so high over the centerline of the axle. Also curious on anyone else’s thoughts on that line of thinking. I got excited when I ordered them so I could be one of the cool kids with coilovers sticking through the hood.
 
I don’t like TMR’s truss from just looking at it. Doesn’t leave a good place to mount coil overs to.
do you have a link to Artec’s? All I could find was their low profile truss.

This is the truss I'm running

Edit* Read the bright red print at the beginning of the description of the truss

 
I like this truss, would just need to build up the passenger side where the upper link mount is.
cut that factory coil spring perch off the C or mount the shocks off the back of the truss/front of the truss. How would you set up a mount for coil overs and bypasses with this axle?
not doing it right off, but down the road maybe.
building the chassis to accommodate for trailing arms in the rear and bypasses up front in the future just in case.

3273C094-8F97-4F81-A85F-2C878187CADA.jpeg
 
I could write out a bunch but I'm just gonna make a list as it'll be easier.

Truss: Barnes (Budget) Artec or TMR (baller)
Steering: BKOR weld on High steer (budget) Reid/bolt on arms (Baller)
Ram: Depends on the steering arms but any 8" ram willl suffice, 10" can be used but I haven't seen much documented on them and it'll likely have to be limited (obviously only used with 1550 joints or RCV's)
Shafts: ECGS 35 or 40 Spline 1550 chromo kit (40 spline only adds $100 over 35 spline) Just know the spool is double the cost if you go 40 spline
Ball Joint Eliminators: Nick Barna or BKOR (pretty sure the BKOR is just Nick's 🤷‍♂️ )
Do you prefer Nick Barna's over American Iron? I have seen both, just not sure if there is real world showing one is better?

Also, It seems there are a number of folks running Branik 40 spline shafts. RCV & Overson were making stub shafts that spline directly into the hub with no slug. I feel like I saw that CTM or Branik might have been also?

Hydrodynamic on Pirate/Irate had a bolt on arm, that I liked the look of. Not sure if he sells it or would provide the files. There does seem to be folks that have had the weld-on arms break/crack at the welds. Likely due to improper prep/weld.

I know @Bebop has experience putting together these axles, so he can probly overload us with knowledge.
 
Do you prefer Nick Barna's over American Iron? I have seen both, just not sure if there is real world showing one is better?

Also, It seems there are a number of folks running Branik 40 spline shafts. RCV & Overson were making stub shafts that spline directly into the hub with no slug. I feel like I saw that CTM or Branik might have been also?

Hydrodynamic on Pirate/Irate had a bolt on arm, that I liked the look of. Not sure if he sells it or would provide the files. There does seem to be folks that have had the weld-on arms break/crack at the welds. Likely due to improper prep/weld.

I know @Bebop has experience putting together these axles, so he can probly overload us with knowledge.

No experience with the American Iron. I will say we had to hone fit the shoulder bolt and I added grease grooves to @Joe J. when we did his.

@Bebop does have quite a bit of knowledge on this stuff and I'm sure he'll chime in.
 
I’ve got that setup for my swap, but I’m curious if that will have negative effects on how well the shock responds since it’s so high over the centerline of the axle. Also curious on anyone else’s thoughts on that line of thinking. I got excited when I ordered them so I could be one of the cool kids with coilovers sticking through the hood.

Those are the same as the mounts in my WFO SAS kit. I can tell you that they work great with a radius arm setup. Not sure how much different a link setup would be.

I like how the other setup was just inside of the inner Cs too though. Definitely gives you more room vertically if you can spare the room on the width.
 
Starting to build my front axle. It’s a 2006 ford Dana 60
Going in a buggy. Axle will clear front of motor so no need for low profile truss.

Which high steer kit is best?
Which truss should I run?
Which double ended ram is needed?
Which ball joint eliminator is best?
Which 40 spline shafts and spool should I go with?

so many options for all this. Just want to get the best stuff.

All of these questions are hugely depending on how deep your pockets are.
Also, your post doesn't say if it's a 250/350 or a 450/550 Dana 60. This changes some of the answers.
I'm going to answer on a 250/350 platform since it's the most common option.

You said you want the best stuff, so here it is:

- BKOR keyed high steer arms with Reid knuckles

- Truss I'll leave it up to you. Many good options

- Howe dual piston race ram or PSC XR ram

- Nick Barna BJEs

- RCV Big Bells and Mark Williams spool









Now that you've learned nothing, here is the tech and explanations:

- BKOR is the only company offering keyed arms on a SD platform. They only offer it on Reid knuckles but it's a badass setup. Definitely the stronger SD based steering system out there. If that's too much, BKOR offers machined stock knuckles with bolt on arms. Not as strong but plenty already. That's what I have on my buggy and I've "tested" them thoroughly. Weaver Fab also offers a similar product that works well. I'm not a fan of weld on setups but they have been proven to work in lighter buggies or with a clean driver. If you intend to power you way into shit I've seen them fail. Multiple times. IMO that's not the place to skimp on.

- Ram throw will depend on desired steering angle and high steer arm construction. Generally the more angle the better. With the BKOR arms you need a 8" throw ram to achieve close to 40 degrees. As far as which ram to get, PSC or Howe would be my go to. If you want the best option, I'd suggest the PSC XR (if you can find it, it's kind of elusive) because of the chromoly shaft (stronger) and the fact it's built in 1 piece (seen a few "normal" PSC rams unthread and split in half). Howe makes a single piece shaft 8" ram that's even better, it uses a dual piston for maximum rigidity but comes with a 10" body which is harder to package. Going back to throw, if you want to max out steering angle, you can push to a 8.75 (close to 45deg of steering) or 9 (will get to 45) or 10" (all the degrees but you'll have to limit it to keep the shafts alive. 8.75 and 10" options exist in 2.5" or 2.75" diameters from PSC. 9" is a 3" body. The bigger the body, the more force it'll make, the slower the steering. My personal buggy has a 2.5 and I'm happy with it, but I don't heavy rockcrawl. I'd rather have a quick steering. For a slower build with bigger rock garden tendancies I'd look into the 2.75. The 3" is very powerful but hard to package and you need a big pump to move it (Scotts or TT style).

- I only have experience with Nick Barna style BJE. I have no problems with them and they do the job. My main complaint against the other guy is the fact the C needs machining. The Nick Barna one can be installed with no specific tools easily. Do yourself a favor and weld the the insert inside the knuckle too. The top weld only isn't enough, I've seen a few break there. Be very carefull on install of the shoulder bolt. The tolerance is super tight and I've seen a few gall up really bad. Pre-heat before welding and let it cool down in a welding blanket for a night before trying to install. Use plenty of antiseize and go easy on it. If it's good, it should almost go by hand. If you have to force on the bolt, back off immediately and re-check everything.

- Best 40sp shafts are probably Tubeworks with the SPL140 joint. I know you said you wanted the best, but I think the shafts are north of 7k a pair. Not sure you want to spend that much. RCV Big Bells are around 4k and have been holding up in the back of a 1500hp bouncer in race use, so, should you choose this route, you should be fine. But it's not "the best".
Branik just released their Legacy 1550 units and they are a great option too. Just no warranty like RCV does. Ouverson is another option, but I've heard or multiple failures (not first hand experience). In the cheaper end of the spectrum, ECGS, Branik and BKOR all offer a 4340 solution which I believe, uses the same forgings. They each will machine them in house to length and to fit their axles. Cost is around 2500 with a set of drive flanges. They hold in the rear (steering axle) of a BKOR bouncer with a 427ci engine making about 650hp. Once again, IDK what's your goal with this buggy and why you need "the best", but I believe that option will do everything that a regular wheeler will need. BKOR offers a lifetime warranty on these, just like the RCV stuff. Hard to beat. One thing to know, the custom length stuff takes time. And, to my knowledge, ECGS is the only company out there stocking 40sp SD length shafts. Not sure how their warranty works?
No matter what, I wouldn't sweat any of the options in this list since the Dana60 ring and pinion will be the first thing to go, and not the 40sp shafts.

- Spool wise, I believe Mark Williams is the best option. I don't have specific data on Dana 60 stuff but on 14 bolts they are a notch above everyone else, in craftsmanship and strength. I've heard and seen a couple of other brand spool failures which were solved by going to MW products. That's what I run in my buggy.

Hope this helps.



Edit since I'm reading the rest of the topic and the answers:

Ball Joint Eliminators: Nick Barna or BKOR (pretty sure the BKOR is just Nick's 🤷‍♂️ )

BKOR sells the Nick Barna BJEs
 
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Edit 2 for some engine tech in an axle topic :

Stall will depend on the cam. I've got a guy that does custom grinds. 50 bucks more than off the shelf and totally worth it.

I do know that you'll likely have a grocery list for the cam swap. Cam, springs, lifters, pushrods, spring seals, seals, locks, oil pump, timing set...it adds up quick.

A TBSS intake is a good upgrade too, along with a bigger throttle body and some long tubes.

See the last line of my previous post!

All depends on what you want out of it. I wanted massive amounts of torque. Our setups would be about the same, but you'll have half a point more compression.

You don't need all this shit in a buggy IMO.
The little hp gains you will get by changing the intake to a TBSS and bigger TB won't matter one bit after it makes its way through the driveline. He isn't racing. Reliability, cost and ease to find spare parts at the local parts store will prevail.
Get a BTR Stage 2 Truck cam, some springs, slap some 799 heads on the thing, 8.1 injectors, reuse everything else and go tear up the woods. That's plenty enough.

Make sure your gas pedal has a stock or close to stock leverage ratio. That's a huuuuge problem with a lot of the buggies I drive. Makes for a shitty driving experience, at no fault of the tune or the engine.

Spend the time on the dyno. A well tuned engine will make a world of difference in terms of midrange and throttle response.

I'd give anyone a ride in my buggy and switch between the 3 tunes I have for it. The stock basemap from Holley, my first tuning session and the second.
The engine doesn't feel more powerful in any of the tunes.
In terms of throttle response and crispness though, the more time spend adjusting the timing map and fueling makes a big impact.
It's easy to make hp. The drivability is the hard part.







I have a "stock" 5.3 in my pile. It's enough for 99% of the wheeling out there. And I'll try pretty much anything. Only times I find myself wanting more is on some hillclimbs. Never on an obstacle. And even then, there is always a way to get up it. Line choice is everything.

That's my 4500lbs buggy with said 5.3. It was enough to bring it to one of the steepest stuff at Windrock. Geometry and suspension tuning play a bigger role than engine output in most cases.

 
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