Blue Book Value

Ron

Ron

Dum Spiro Spero
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Apr 16, 2005
Location
Sharon, SC
Not to start a flame war, just a serious question (and BTW this is not aimed at ANY post on this board)

How do certain vehicles sell for consistently outside of KBB and NADA price ranges?

I have been in the market for a new DD/tow rig for a few months and being the perfectionist, anal retentive ass hole I can be, I have driven no less than 25 trucks, and negotiated with a half dozen private owners.

Here is what baffles me:
Everywhere I look 4wd Diesel ext cab trucks are 1500-3500 and up above EXCELLENT condition private party values (while none of these trucks were true excellent condition vehicles).

I am not arguing that the owners are over valuing, as I have seen many sell for stupid $$$. But if that really is the going price, why would the trade books not reflect it?

Maybe this is a chicken versus egg argument, does the market set the price and the blue book/nada report it, or do the publications set the value and the market works around them.

I just have an inherit problem paying 20% above "value" for a vehicle. Its not a loan question this will be a cash purchase, but it just seems like a bad financial move to me. No one would ever get a house appraised at 250k and saym you know what I really want this house Ill pay 325K, yet I am seeng this everyday in these trucks.
 
First off diesel is all the rage.. And people were sold this BS that a diesel will retain its value better and you will recoupe the engine price back in resale... BUT they failed to factor in that thats ONLY if they actually maintain it and keep up with everything...

They are hoping you don't realize all that or know anything about maintenance..
 
I have noticed the same thing. It seems worst with diesel but I have noticed even gas 4 doors are getting this way.
 
Yeah, I would really like to buy a used diesel 4wd 4 door truck, but Im better off getting one from the dealer.
 
I guess my question is, if this IS what they are selling for, why have the price books not changed to reflect this as the MARKET VALUE?

I mean this is the only thing I have ever seen in my life here dealers are CHEAPER.

EX. the Chevy dealer on South BLVD., whatever they are named these days. Has an 04 F250 XLT supercab, 4x4, diesel, 45k for $20,000 (asking 24 I talked them down to 20)

Truck has a clean oasis (ford service track record and a clear title) Private sellers are asking 26-28 all day for these trucks..
 
I am/was in the same boat. I had been looking for a 2500-3500 Chevy for under 6K and decided I'd just step up and look for something like a 2500 2nd Gen Cummins which seem to be going for right at book value or over by 1-2K. I was able to snag one off ePay out of ATL for 5K under book. I think I just got lucky though..:bounce: .

steveo
 
Kelley is a load of carp anyway. Yeah, it's a good reference, but there are a LOT of other factors that dictate what a vehicle is "worth". Hell... the definition of worth is purely subjective. An 86 CJ-7 might be "worth" 5 grand to me if it's what I want. But Rich wouldn't give you 50 bucks for it.

People also don't understand how KBB works... i see cars for sale all the time where the owner says it's "excellent" according to KBB, or they're listing it at RETAIL. In fact only about 2% of cars sold by a private party qualify.

Bottom line, the thing's worth whatever somebody will give you for it. Supply & Demand (as seen in the '07 GT 500 thread) has the final say.
 
kilby said:
Kelley is a load of carp anyway. Yeah, it's a good reference, but there are a LOT of other factors that dictate what a vehicle is "worth". Hell... the definition of worth is purely subjective. An 86 CJ-7 might be "worth" 5 grand to me if it's what I want. But Rich wouldn't give you 50 bucks for it.
People also don't understand how KBB works... i see cars for sale all the time where the owner says it's "excellent" according to KBB, or they're listing it at RETAIL. In fact only about 2% of cars sold by a private party qualify.
Bottom line, the thing's worth whatever somebody will give you for it. Supply & Demand (as seen in the '07 GT 500 thread) has the final say.
Click to expand...

I understand all that. My complaint is that these vehicles are listing AND SELLING at 1-2k ABOVE RETAIL!!! Why doesnt the retail number reflect this???

Im not bashing the sellers, I guess if anything I am bashing KBB
 
I have noticed the same thing around here, SkyHiK5, and agree with kilby. I was looking at Toyota Tacomas a while back and everyone wanted insane money for them. When I would point out that edmunds, nadaguides, kbb, etc listed them at a certain price for private party, they would pull up the retail listing and say that they could get that price and wouldn't budge. I think that the only group using the suggested pricing from those sites are the stealerships and only when pricing a trade-in. It is very frustrating, especially now that I am in the market for a project 69-75 Blazer. Now those are commanding a ridiculous price, IMO.
 
Go to Texas and buy a diesel...all of them around here are overpriced from what I've seen. KBB is nothing more than a guide, it all boils down to what someone wants for something and what someone will pay.We sell many cars throughout the year and when someone brings up a KBB value (especially on late model diesel cars), we usualy laugh and say, go find one for that price and we'll buy it.
 
KBB is nothing more than a guide, it all boils down to what someone wants for something and what someone will pay.
Click to expand...

I will pay a little more for a car I'm interested in if I know it's been well maintained. Not their asking price, but somewhere in between.
 
A lot of people use the blue book value to get a general idea and then go to auto trader to see what they are going for and hit in the middle somewhere. If you were selling a car and the blue book value was 1000 but they were selling for 2500 what would you sell it at? The public really price a vehicle more than the seller, it is what people will pay then anything else.
 
My observations indicate that when gas prices went over $3 last year, the used diesel truck prices went up almost 25%. Since then, as gas prices have dropped, used diesel truck prices have stayed up along with continued high diesel fuel prices? I presume many diesel owners are burning WVO, biodiesel and God forbid used ATF and that is driving the demand side of the economics curve despite high diesel fuel costs.

My $0.02 :beer: ahhhhhhhhhhh
 
The KBB price is a guide and not a absolute price. How ever from what I found is that any one who will pay more that KBB is a ID10T! you can find stuf way cheaper than that. you just have to look in the right places.

Some People think there junk is worth all that $$ and they are pricing it way high. But that does not mean that they are selling it for that price. I will never pay more than 75% of KBB which is about Whole sale KBB, and alot of times you can get them for even less.

When people trade in there Junk they usual get screwed by the dealer and if you are ready you can snatch the vehicle from them for slightly more than the dealer will pay them.

If you are looking for a tow rig look in Texas there are a Shiet low of trucks there and they are cheap because there are so many of them
 
OK, let me add my 2 cents,
It (KBB) is based on all 50 states avg and they try to adjust to local zip. OUt west trucks are cheeper because it cost more to insure and maintain. When I was in denver I looked at a few and they were cheep. That is why dealers will pick you up at the airport and people are driving west to find deals on trucks, several on the board have done just that...
Also a reason that people are asking more is they need more...
From this: (1)the new truck you want will cost more and they want to get as much as they can to help pay for it. (2) people are paying more now then ever for something to drive. It cost them more to drive it. With that, they owe more then ever and will not tell you anything about what they owe.
You ever sell something for 500-1000 and they can't pay with out talking to the bank and borrow money? I know a lot of people that are upside down on loans and may never get out of it, the value drops at the same rate they make payments.
I see that all the time selling guns at the shop... People come in and try to sell a gun to me for the same price it is in the shop and don't even think about markup on it. Its on the CC and they need to pay it off so they want the same back. People even think that they can recover the taxes paid for it.Why should I pay more or close to the same as I can get it new then mark it up to sell at the shop.......
When people ask what I think is high I offer low then deal or walk away. No problem there is more then one person selling stuff.
Jon
 
FYI: if you want a Diesel Truck worst place to look is on a 4x4 or Diesel forum.. those guys know what they can sell them for..

look in local papers or out in country when traveling..or just go west or south like others have (Bigwoody, Thecarman, etc)

I got mine because I was at right place at right time..
I was at a car repair shop and happened to walk outback, saw truck asked who's it was owner said guy hates it and wants to sell it.. I called and 2 weeks later I had it..Yes I have done a lot of work but stil worth it

BUt as for KBB.. I usually look to see what they say "they think" the vehicle should be worth but that is it..I always try to pay lower then what it is listed in KBB
 
And to add on top of all this...

CASH IS KING !!!

Someone actually looking at a vehicle in person with cash in their pocket is worth more than some tire kicker sending emails of making repeated phone calls...

Also if someone is still making payments or upside down they are motivated. Every payment that they have to make puts them further in the hole and makes the truck that much older..
 
True on the cash.

I am notorious for finding bargains, just been kinda tough on this. I am patient and something will turn up, it always does, I just hope soon :flipoff2:

Also the only reason the KBB price is so critical to me, is it is tied directly to the Insurance company's valuation charts.

So if you buy over KBB and total it on the way home, you aint getting what you paid...

Ron..(still hunting a deal)
 
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