Duke Energy High Bill?

Fabrik8 said:
I totally agree, and the cost is pretty much dead-on from a few rough quotes on system replacement that I got during repair work.

But, where does a split system go? In the small unconditioned attic upstairs? In the undersized laundry room? In a small addition to be built specifically to house mechanical bits?

This is my dilemma right now.

I'm still thinking up options, knowing that the flex ducts are leaky (from bad install quality) and should probably be replaced after 30 years, and it's a 3.5 ton unit for a 1800sqft house in climate zone 3. I'd have to get calcs done, but if we are going to stick with a gas pack then something like a 2.5 or 3 seems more logical, especially if we rip the attic ducting out for the upstairs (400sqft) and use a mini-split up there. I need my own thread for this shit for some serious discussion, it stresses me out but I want to do it in a logical way.
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I can't help you there. I have a crawl space with plenty of room. My plan is for two units to get zones and shorter ducts.
 
shawn said:
I can't help you there. I have a crawl space with plenty of room. My plan is for two units to get zones and shorter ducts.
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Putting the units in the crawlspace? Hadn't thought about that, but I guess it makes sense if the crawlspace is encapsulated. Hmm. That could be a good option, given a unit of the proper height. Better in an encap crawlspace than an unconditioned attic.
 
Just got mine, it was about $20 higher than last month, but in line with the same period of last year. I bet they are passing the cost of xmas bonuses for the CEOs on to the consumers. :rolleyes:
 
I dont buy all the conspiracy. I check my meter and keep these greedy SOBs and Tesla Murderers somewhat honest. They would have had to speed up the meters manually on all non wireless ones.
 
Duke Energy here, my bill was lower than last year for the period of 11/17-12/19 by about 10%. We'll see what the next month runs.
 
CasterTroy said:
Not from my experience. Samsung, Mitsubishi, fujitsu.....etc lock out the condensor at 30-32
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Interesting, as I had heard similar stuff. A local contractor here uses mini-splits or inverter comp units in almost all of his houses, and claims that the efficiency is better and operating costs are lower. Not sure if he is FOS or what.

Fabrik8 said:
I totally agree, and the cost is pretty much dead-on from a few rough quotes on system replacement that I got during repair work.

But, where does a split system go? In the small unconditioned attic upstairs? In the undersized laundry room? In a small addition to be built specifically to house mechanical bits?

This is my dilemma right now.

I'm still thinking up options, knowing that the flex ducts are leaky (from bad install quality) and should probably be replaced after 30 years, and it's a 3.5 ton unit for a 1800sqft house in climate zone 3. I'd have to get calcs done, but if we are going to stick with a gas pack then something like a 2.5 or 3 seems more logical, especially if we rip the attic ducting out for the upstairs (400sqft) and use a mini-split up there. I need my own thread for this shit for some serious discussion, it stresses me out but I want to do it in a logical way.
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I am in a similar thought process. I have an older HP/AC with oil furnace backup. System seems to run well for the age, other than occasional furnace issues. I plan to replace it in the next year or so, just trying to figure out what with. Talking to some technicians, they seem to be against Gas unless you have a NG tap/meter. They indicate alot of issues with propane units. Most of them just recommend all elec.

I dont really want to put mini-splits in the rooms of my house, but some of the under-floor or inverter replacement units have peaked by interest, if they work better/cost less to operate.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
Talking to some technicians, they seem to be against Gas unless you have a NG tap/meter. They indicate alot of issues with propane units.
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Would love to hear from anyone that can substantiate/call BS on those techs claims...

Once we get thru the lending hurdle, we'd planned heat the rest of the winter with propane wall heaters and look into replacing the oil furnace with a propane unit, since it already has central air... not a fawking "gas pack", I agree with @shawn that it's the mostarded concept ever! A bud has one and hates it all seasons...
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
Talking to some technicians, they seem to be against Gas unless you have a NG tap/meter. They indicate alot of issues with propane units. Most of them just recommend all elec.
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Propane is dirtier, so there's probably more maintenance required on the furnace. It's also a bunch more expensive - running apples/apples 92% AFUE propane vs NG, NG saves you $1,200 per year at $3/gallon for propane and $0.90/therm for NG.

Keep in mind, though - if you have NG heat, you need at least one other NG appliance in the house to get the most cost savings. Otherwise, you pay NG base rate fees from April through October, but don't have any usage to go along with them.
 
shawn said:
Keep in mind, though - if you have NG heat, you need at least one other NG appliance in the house to get the most cost savings. Otherwise, you pay NG base rate fees from April through October, but don't have any usage to go along with them.
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I didn't like that arrangement, so I bought an expensive gas range to justify the monthly base rate. Might go tankless too for the same reason. o_O

Flawless logic. :D
 
shawn said:
Propane is dirtier, so there's probably more maintenance required on the furnace. It's also a bunch more expensive - running apples/apples 92% AFUE propane vs NG, NG saves you $1,200 per year at $3/gallon for propane and $0.90/therm for NG
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I can't find any sources saying propane is "dirtier" than NG... most say it's toss up.
Regarding expense... while propane is 1.5-2x more for the same energy, it's also 100(+)% more efficient...
and then there's that whole UN-availability in BFE due to NG being a gas/cost of an HG tank & compression system
 
Caver Dave said:
I can't find any sources saying propane is "dirtier" than NG... most say it's toss up.
Regarding expense... while propane is 1.5-2x more for the same energy, it's also 100(+)% more efficient...
and then there's that whole UN-availability in BFE due to NG being a gas/cost of an HG tank & compression system
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Not sure I'm buying your claim on efficiency, when that's already built into the "same energy" equation
but there's the flexibility of being able to plan ahead, store it, scour for deals, transport it, etc. Can't do that w/ NG, you're stuck w/ whatever the supplier want to charge.
 
Build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a night. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

I've nothing useful to add other than I like our heat pump. 2016 was under $150/mo. Not sure what December and January will cost yet. Fingers crossed under $200.
 
Caver Dave said:
Regarding expense... while propane is 1.5-2x more for the same energy, it's also 100(+)% more efficient...
and then there's that whole UN-availability in BFE due to NG being a gas/cost of an HG tank & compression system
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I'm just giving you the numbers that come out of the calculator. I want to heat a certain size space with a certain efficiency furnace using a certain fuel at a certain cost. It says NG is cheaper by $1200/yr. If you can't get natural gas in the boonies, it's a calculation between electric and propane.
 
I also dont mind my gas pack last one made it 18 years my bills where never bad it seems ridiculous in theory but it works just fine and when i needed a new one i called the supply house and installed it with 1 friend in 4 hours 3500 bucks and i hope to get another 18 years

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 
shawn said:
I'm just giving you the numbers that come out of the calculator. I want to heat a certain size space with a certain efficiency furnace using a certain fuel at a certain cost. It says NG is cheaper by $1200/yr. If you can't get natural gas in the boonies, it's a calculation between electric and propane.
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Id definitely believe it. We have NG as our primary heat but are on the edge of town and where it's available. All my friends w propane in roughly similar homes have higher annual costs.
At the end of the day, its all about therms, the unit of energy output. And the cost per therm is just higher w propane.
 
Also youch, wife just sent me this.
$100 more than normal.
Furnace was running nonstop for about 2 weeks.
 

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We just got our bill. It’s gonna hurt. I also had a 240v heater running in my shop to keep it about 50* for my dogs.
 
Our bill came yesterday and was lower than the same billing period last year (significantly) and only a little bit higher than the previous month. I think (hope) our duct repairs & upgrades are making a difference, even if it still isn't what @shawn wants it to be.
 
trailhugger said:
Our bill came yesterday and was lower than the same billing period last year (significantly) and only a little bit higher than the previous month. I think (hope) our duct repairs & upgrades are making a difference, even if it still isn't what @shawn wants it to be.
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No welding this month, and very little power tool usage. Was it an actual meter reading, or an estimation?
 
Good points... meter reading, as far as I can tell.
 
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