Steel sided and framed homes.

Rigid insulation over the studs is becoming more prevalent, No thermal break. For budgeting I'd figure 600S162-54 (6" 16ga studs) and that should span 16' for wind loads on a metal panel.
8" you might be able to go to 18ga but cost is probably about the same since the weight per LF is similar and you are loosing 2" around the perimeter.
 
If you're going to go metal skip all the thermal bridging mumbo jumbo and go straight to insulated panels. Air tight, water tight and 0 bridging.
 
awheelterd said:
If you're going to go metal skip all the thermal bridging mumbo jumbo and go straight to insulated panels. Air tight, water tight and 0 bridging.
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Depends on the SIP product. Some still use a wood spline on the panel edges for stiffness or panel-to-panel fastening, especially EPS panels that don't have very good skin shear strength and need the edges closed out. The air tight and water tight is performed by the same type of exterior barrier system that traditional construction uses, whether that's a housewrap-type product or the seam tape on Huber ZipSystem panels. The panel skin material and panel gaps are still the points that need protection.

If I was building a house for myself, it would be with SIPs. I'm still toying with using SIPs for the garage, just to have fun with something non-traditional. One of the highest regarded SIP companies on the continent happens to be in Mocksville. There are some tradeoffs of course, but I like alternative materials and stuff like that.


Edit: Did you mean metal insulated panels...?
 
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No fries said:
Rigid insulation over the studs is becoming more prevalent
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It's undeniably better in terms of moisture management and thermal, but there are problems with detailing. For example, hard to do and comply with the warranty on a residential window.

awheelterd said:
If you're going to go metal skip all the thermal bridging mumbo jumbo and go straight to insulated panels. Air tight, water tight and 0 bridging.
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Insulated metal panels at these quantities are going to be crazy expensive, maybe $40-60/SF?? They only get affordable when you have big, simple expanses.
 
ponykilr said:
@shawn wouldn’t the condensation issue be there with wood frame and steel siding as well?
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Wood isn't anywhere near as conductive as metal. The siding isn't the problem - the studs are.
 
Fabrik8 said:
Depends on the SIP product. Some still use a wood spline on the panel edges for stiffness or panel-to-panel fastening, especially EPS panels that don't have very good skin shear strength and need the edges closed out. The air tight and water tight is performed by the same type of exterior barrier system that traditional construction uses, whether that's a housewrap-type product or the seam tape on Huber ZipSystem panels. The panel skin material and panel gaps are still the points that need protection.

If I was building a house for myself, it would be with SIPs. I'm still toying with using SIPs for the garage, just to have fun with something non-traditional. One of the highest regarded SIP companies on the continent happens to be in Mocksville. There are some tradeoffs of course, but I like alternative materials and stuff like that.


Edit: Did you mean metal insulated panels...?
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Yes metal insulated panels.
shawn said:
Insulated metal panels at these quantities are going to be crazy expensive, maybe $40-60/SF?? They only get affordable when you have big, simple expanses.
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There's no way they're that high. If you were dealing with a contractor that regularly buys them he could tack your order onto one for another customer and get volume pricing. I'm sure kingspan doesn't just take orders from some Joe blow that wants to skin a 2000sqft house.
 
Problem is looking at residential cost compared to commercial building standards . They are not the same and you're not gonna get a house built at a reasonable cost comparison. Commercial contractors don't wanna deal with residential

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awheelterd said:
How many have you bought?
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2xwqi5.jpg
 
Since I am trying to learn all I can about steel construction (pretty versed in wood construction) I have some questions that might seem elementary to some of you but not to me.

Is a sealant put under the bottom “plate”?

What is used to seal the bottom edge of the steel siding (areas where it is formed, hollows) where it contacts the slab?

What is used to seal the areas like where the siding meets the soffit and such?

How would one go about ensuring the slab height was plenty to avoid any chance of water intrusion once landscaping and such was put in? Just spec a 10” slab edge somehow?

I would like whatever we build to be on a raised earth pad in relation to the surrounding land, including porches and a small “yard” around the house. The purpose is so water gets away from the home and the really intense garden upkeep is easy in relation to the general property of 15 acres. We love ornamental gardening but want much less of it than we currently keep up. Smaller and even more precise and beautiful is the goal. I am thinking maybe no more than 15’ of yard around the home/porches to where it steps down to the surrounding property. So...the house as the highest point, the porches a little step lower and then the yard a little lower to finally the surrounding land (home site is on a knoll). How do you convey this to the grading folks? Am I being stupid here?

Mice are an issue there, we’ve been going for many years and the current mobile home there always has a few mice. Steel and a good sealed up house on concrete we believe will be a better defense for those pests as well as the termite and other wood damaging issues that can arise with time. The long term low maintenance is the other concern as we are older now and I do not want to be really worried about traditional home repair issues as I get into senior citizen territory. This is why all the questions and learning about this stuff. My wife will retire next year and we have around 2 years to figure all of this out.
 
What county is the property in? What is the square footage your looking to have? And what’s the budget?

Your wanting to use expensive forms of construction.

Also unless you are near a big city/town you going to be hard pressed to get someone that knows how to use metal studs to travel more than an hour out of town with the amount of work around now.


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awheelterd said:
:rolleyes:

So you're saying that to skin a 2000sqft, mostly square house like ponykillr is talking about, would cost $120k just for the panels?
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We are talking maybe 24x48 slab size but of course the high outside walls. I am thinking the side walls will be 12’ or if not a ton of additional cost 16’. The loft will be bedroom space.
 
shawn said:
Okay, if you say so.
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awheelterd said:
How many have you bought?
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I do exterior metal panel work (commercial level, and I’m not talking about building McDonald’s) for a living.

I’m a dealer for kingspan, Atas, Pac clad etc and do insulated panels, acm panels, single skin, etc.

Yes. They are $60 sqft installed.

Trust me on this.

Also, they totally suck to put up.

What you are talking about here is the Kingspan carrier panel. If you are building an airport, great product. Building a house, bad idea.

I could write an essay on exterior rigid insulation, Rockwool, and many other ideas on how to do this properly.

My whole hearted advice if you want to be ahead of the curve would be wood frame with a product called Hunter XCI ply.
 
shawn said:
I call bullshit. I have a quote for 19,876 SF for $39/ft.

It's only five years old, but surely the installed cost has gone down since then.
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Huh? How could it have gone down?
I don't really track this market, but the price of steel is way more now than it was five years ago. Plus nobody is desperate for work like they were then.
Hell, inflation alone has been probably 10-12% since then.
 
shawn said:
I call bullshit. I have a quote for 19,876 SF for $39/ft.

It's only five years old, but surely the installed cost has gone down since then.
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:flipoff2:

I give up. I now realize that they add $100sqft to whatever base price you have for a building.

That being said, I don't think they're as wholely unaffordable for a simple house as you're saying. The walls are half as tall as a commercial building so the panels aren't as long nor as difficult to handle. fwiw, they're not too hard to handle if you have the suction rig and a lull.

Regardless, I don't care. We're arguing on the Internet and it has no bearing on my life. Along with trying to get my wife to let me build our house inside of a grain bin I petitioned for a house built with panels. That didn't fly either. My house is built out of boring ass wood :lol:
 
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