'82 Jeep Scrambler Daily Driver

[CAROLINA ROCKRUNNER]

Also could be crossmember

 

[orange150]

@CAROLINA ROCKRUNNER I think you might be on the right track. Took it out to try to get a video of how much you can see the movement in the stick and it hit me that this might be coming from the front. There is zero movement in the wheel though.

Got it home, jacked up the front, and the drivers' side wheel bearing has some play.. Not a lot though, not enough in my extremely uneducated opinion to be making the amount of vibrations I'm getting.. but what do I know.

I guess this is enough of an excuse to just go ahead and get my front end regeared to match the back.


.gif of the video. I wasn't going too fast as there was too much traffic. This also isn't nearly as strong as it gets, but you get the idea
Direct link to .gif: Imgur GIF

 

[CAROLINA ROCKRUNNER]

Man the reason I think it is the front is I had the same problem at 55. Long tube was bent from tellico damn I wish it was still open. Take it tarheel 4wd cost me $250 with new tube. Hell the red rocker said it best (I can't drive 55)haha

 

[paradisePWoffrd]

does the steering wheel shake like that also? If not, I doubt its in the front. Does the shifter vibrate like that all the time, or just at those speeds?

Have a gopro? Mount it up under the vehicle and take it for a drive.

 

[orange150]

does the steering wheel shake like that also? If not, I doubt its in the front. Does the shifter vibrate like that all the time, or just at those speeds?

Nothing in the steering wheel, it actually tracks straight as an arrow. The shifter only does that as I get close to the 60mph zone, usually starts around 56/57mph, and gets way worse.

Have a gopro?

I wish.

 

[orange150]

Engine RPMs don't have any effect on the vibration. I put the clutch and dropped it to neutral and it was still going..

Output shaft on D300 is tight. Driveshaft/u-joints are new from Tom Woods. D44 rear end was just gone through and installed at ECGS. So that part of the rotating assembly should be good. I guess my next move is to double check that my driveshaft isn't out of phase?

I guess the best way to do that would be to lay a level over the D300 output and check to make sure it's perpendicular to the frame (assuming the frame is straight...)?

 

[paradisePWoffrd]

Have you tried to put the rear on jack stands and take it upto speed? Or maybe a friend with a gopro or knock off action cam that you can stick under while driving?

Do you have a steering damper on the front axle? I don't think it is upfront, however, but a damper would mask some vibration in the wheel.

Tried rotating the tires or swapping on another set?

I guess the best way to do that would be to lay a level over the D300 output and check to make sure it's perpendicular to the frame (assuming the frame is straight...)?

pickup an angle finder analog or digital and measure the angles of the yokes/driveshaft. The rear axle should point ~2-3 degrees down when stopped.

 

[orange150]

Have you tried to put the rear on jack stands and take it upto speed?

Tried rotating the tires or swapping on another set?

Just had it up on jack stands. Ran it up well beyond 60 and no big vibration. I might have time tomorrow to go get my tires balanced and rotated..

Do you have a steering damper on the front axle? I don't think it is upfront, however, but a damper would mask some vibration in the wheel.

I don't have one currently. But like you, I'm not completely sure it's up front..

pickup an angle finder analog or digital and measure the angles of the yokes/driveshaft. The rear axle should point ~2-3 degrees down when stopped.

I was talking about the driveline being parallel to the frame, like this

 

[strange1]

the small amount you may be off side to side on your trans mount wouldn't be that noticeable. take the driveshaft loose on one end and turn it 180 degrees and try it again.

 

[strange1]

you bought new driveshafts, correct? Didn't pull them apart for any reason? Make sure the weights didn't fall off.

 

[orange150]

the small amount you may be off side to side on your trans mount wouldn't be that noticeable...

That's kind of what I was thinking.

..take the driveshaft loose on one end and turn it 180 degrees and try it again.

you bought new driveshafts, correct? Didn't pull them apart for any reason? Make sure the weights didn't fall off.

Yes, new shafts from Tom Woods. I didn't pull them apart or anything, just pulled them out of the box and installed them in the Jeep. Think I should still try to pull them apart and rotate?

 

[strange1]

I probably wouldn't pull them apart.

 

[strange1]

I'm guessing the rear is a standard 2-joint shaft. How close are the angles on each end to being equal? I think someone said earlier that you want the pinion a couple of degrees low to compensate for the springs loading up under torque.

 

[orange150]

Yep, your standard 2 joint drive shaft.

I'll check that next. Hopefully I'll be able to find time before the weekend.

 

[strange1]

My money is on the driveshaft. That gif of the shifter looks like a much higher speed vibration than you get from a tire. But I have been way wrong before.

 

[strange1]

I'll play with RPMs and report back.

I don't think it's the axle since it did it both with the AMC20 and the D44.



I don't think it's death wobble, it didn't start until after the AX15 swap.

Driveshaft angle was probably borderline to begin with, the additional length of the ax15 (however small) was probably all it took.

 

[paradisePWoffrd]

Just had it up on jack stands. Ran it up well beyond 60 and no big vibration. I might have time tomorrow to go get my tires balanced and rotated..




I don't have one currently. But like you, I'm not completely sure it's up front..




I was talking about the driveline being parallel to the frame, like this
View attachment 208599

The suspension isn't quite loaded on a jackstand like it is on the street, but you also removed the tires from the equation.

while the angle shouldn't effect much, if it is more than a few degrees out of parallel, it could give a vibration. You want both yokes to be parallel horizontally and the axle to be a few degrees below parallel in the vertical plane.

 

[orange150]

Small update on this:
I'm taking the Jeep to 4WheelParts to get the tires balanced and rotated tomorrow to double check what Discount Tire did. I also told them I've been chasing a vibration so I'm hoping they will take note to if the wheels are out of round or anything.

If that doesn't turn anything up I'm going to take the driveshaft to get it checked out to make sure it's balanced.

I also asked if someone could stabilize that .gif:

Huh, .gif won't load. Here's a direct link: stucktothefloor

 

[orange150]

And the plot thickens-
When I did the YJ spring conversion, I used Old Man Emu springs. OME makes their own bushings for their springs, but they're really expensive; so I just bought some standard YJ poly bushings. The issue is that OME springs are a .25" narrower than stock YJ springs, so there is a bit of a gap between the spring and the end of the bushing / shackle.

Today at 4WP the tech drove my Jeep around, pulled it in, looked around, and immediately noticed the gap between the bushings and the springs.
He thinks that's the cause of my vibration. That there is so much play between all the springs with all that gap on each spring that it's causing vibrations.
He said he would still balance the tires, but his money was on all that slop.

I'm not apposed to that idea, and I've been putting off buying the correct OME bushings and Crabtree shackles since I did the lift.

So that's what I'm going to do next, and go from there...

 

[strange1]

Flat washers to fill the gaps. Unless the bushings are shot and need replacing anyway.

 

[orange150]

They're not shot, but washers won't close the gap. The bushings are butted up against each other (see post #2). The OME bushings have a thicker.. flange(?), to close that gap.

I've read where some guys shave down one or both bushings to close the gap but that seems like too much of a band-aid on a major component of something I drive daily. I'd rather just do it right, without a bunch of stacked washers and what not.

 

[paradisePWoffrd]

I would cut half the difference of the inner side of each bushing, and cut down the sleeve. Then put a greased fender washer on each side of the bushing if needed.

As long as u don't cut too much off, you will be no worse than you are now.

While those bushings could be causing ill handling, I don't think they are causing that vibration.

Did the tire balance net anything?

 

[strange1]

It wouldn't even worry about taking too much off as long as you had that washer to hold it tight. Greaseable bushings usually have a gap between the two. I also doubt it would cause any vibration at all. Sloppy handling in the turns for sure.

 

[orange150]

Did the tire balance net anything?

So 4wp didn't balance. They put their money on the bushings and said I could still pay for the balance and rotation if I wanted.. it was expensive, I didn't want to.

So, I went to a different Discount Tire (where I get free balance and rotation) this morning and explained to them what's been going on. They said that all the tires balanced out ok, but ALL of my wheels are out of round. All of them. One is especially bad, two are bad, one is just a little bad. I bought all five off Craigs for $100, so I can't say that I'm surprised...

With that bit of information, I'm thinking about getting some aluminum wheels to reduce rotational mass and also to get some weight off my original CJ spare tire carrier.

Discount carries these Level 8 Trackers that I was thinking about. $92/ea. Thoughts?

Edit: goodness that's a large picture!

 

[strange1]

.....They said that all the tires balanced out ok, but ALL of my wheels are out of round. All of them....

I'm confused. If all of the wheels are bad enough out of round that replacing them becomes a good option, how did they "balance out OK"?