Packing heat on campus

[uglyjeepoffroad]

So his personal freedoms are less important than those who are uncomfortable with a gun?

 

[Banned User]

Are you really that self absorbed? Can you not stop for a minute and consider those around you that may not feel comfortable with you carrying a firearm on campus?... ...Step outside of your own-itty-bitty-world for a minute and consider the folks around you.... ...Because it isn't as essential as you have convinced yourself it is.


Me, me, me is all I get out of your poor excuse of written expression. Perhaps, you should spend less time cleaning your daddy's gun and more time practicing the spelling, grammar and punctuation.

This isnt about me, I figure im safe in a lightning storm because the odds are i wont get struck, just like I figure the odds are i wont get caught in a shooting somewhere... yeah it would suck, but im not worried about it at all actually.

I dont even live on a campus. The whole reason i push for this is because i believe that EVERYONE has a right to protect themselves. I dont want to see another psycho go storming through a school shooting kids who are legally not allowed to carry defense. I push for it for my female friends who walk on campus late at night, wishing they could have their pistols on them.
And sure, it sounds nice for raleighjeepguy to say that the kid should have never been on VT campus to begin with, but crimes cannot be preveted all the time.

Eric Harris- "There is nothing you guys could have done to prevent any of this."
for those of you who do not know, Eric harris was one of the shooters at columbine.

He was right, and despite the fact that he and Dylan Klebold had been arrested before, were in counseling, took anti-depressants, and were all around scary kids, there was still nothing to stop them from strolling into the west wing cafeteria with two duffel bags full of pipe bombs and weapons under their coats. The one teacher that was killed, William Sanders, was a CC permit holder, but he wasnt allowed to carry it with him at the high school. He saw the two shooters many times before they saw him. how many people might still be alive if he could have used his pistol? Maybe it wouldnt have changed anything but i believe as humans, we deserve to have the chance.

Tragedies happen, and i feel like there is no harm in having the capability to defend yourself just in case.





an bye thuh way, i honestlie dunt care at al whut my punktuasion looks like, so quit being my english teacher.

 

[Futbalfantic]

Not everyone has had a positive experience with firearms and their personal safety, so while for you it reassures safety, for others it can cause severe disruption of normal functionality.

That is the hole point of CC, so that others do not know you have a firearm on your persons. Everyone I know that CCs doesn't tell a sole that they have the firearm. Only reason I know is the fact that I've seen them take it out to go into banks, etc.

 

[FishHunt]

Because guns do not belong on school grounds. Are you really that self absorbed? Can you not stop for a minute and consider those around you that may not feel comfortable with you carrying a firearm on campus? Ever known anyone involved in a violent crime with a firearm? Some folks are affected negatively by the experience for the rest of their lives.

I wonder if the students at Virginia Tech that were shot dead, the ones that could have defended themselves and their peers were negatively effected by the rules and laws that created the unatural 'gun free zone' killing field? The rest of their lives were a short few minutes running away and hiding under tables in fear knowing there was no one close by that was armed that could or would save them. Their ideal 'gun free zone' Utopia really brought the suck for the defenseless students, their family and friends. Good thing they had those rules and laws in effect or who knows what may have happened.
<><Fish

 

[kcarroll]

So his personal freedoms are less important than those who are uncomfortable with a gun?

No, I am just trying to show that we all have equal rights in this world and that students with guns on campus are not a great idea.

This isnt about me, I figure im safe in a lightning storm because the odds are i wont get struck, just like I figure the odds are i wont get caught in a shooting somewhere... yeah it would suck, but im not worried about it at all actually.
I dont even live on a campus. The whole reason i push for this is because i believe that EVERYONE has a right to protect themselves. I dont want to see another psycho go storming through a school shooting kids who are legally not allowed to carry defense. I push for it for my female friends who walk on campus late at night, wishing they could have their pistols on them.
And sure, it sounds nice for raleighjeepguy to say that the kid should have never been on VT campus to begin with, but crimes cannot be preveted all the time.
Eric Harris- "There is nothing you guys could have done to prevent any of this."
for those of you who do not know, Eric harris was one of the shooters at columbine.
He was right, and despite the fact that he and Dylan Klebold had been arrested before, were in counseling, took anti-depressants, and were all around scary kids, there was still nothing to stop them from strolling into the west wing cafeteria with two duffel bags full of pipe bombs and weapons under their coats. The one teacher that was killed, William Sanders, was a CC permit holder, but he wasnt allowed to carry it with him at the high school. He saw the two shooters many times before they saw him. how many people might still be alive if he could have used his pistol? Maybe it wouldnt have changed anything but i believe as humans, we deserve to have the chance.
Tragedies happen, and i feel like there is no harm in having the capability to defend yourself just in case.
an bye thuh way, i honestlie dunt care at al whut my punktuasion looks like, so quit being my english teacher.

Do your female friends take self defense classes? No? Then what makes you think they would go to the range and practice ? And I am not harping on women, just using your example. I know a couple of women that can shoot better than most of the men I know. Pepper spray, personal alarm, walking stick or baton, tasers and stun guns, lots of other choices that would be just as effective at self protection at night right now.
Why not press the university for more security, escorts and lights now? If this is such a big deal to you personally, what else are you doing to change the situation other than exchanging 1's and 0's on the internet. I am with you on protecting ones self with a firearm, we differ in opinion when it comes to schools. I think CC holders aught to be able to carry everywhere, banks, post office, etc, just not schools.

That is the hole point of CC, so that others do not know you have a firearm on your persons. Everyone I know that CCs doesn't tell a sole that they have the firearm. Only reason I know is the fact that I've seen them take it out to go into banks, etc.

I know that is the point, but that is not reality. The folks I know that carry are usually gun enthusiasts. It's hard to not talk about them, the ammo, accessories, work/mods done, etc. In a casual environment where you don't see the same people everyday, it is easy to keep it on the d/l, but in a classroom setting, I bet it wouldn't take long for word to get out. For sure it wouldn't take long in a dorm.

I wonder if the students at Virginia Tech that were shot dead, the ones that could have defended themselves and their peers were negatively effected by the rules and laws that created the unatural 'gun free zone' killing field? The rest of their lives were a short few minutes running away and hiding under tables in fear knowing there was no one close by that was armed that could or would save them. Their ideal 'gun free zone' Utopia really brought the suck for the defenseless students, their family and friends. Good thing they had those rules and laws in effect or who knows what may have happened.
<><Fish

I usually respect most of what you have to say but come on. No shit they were affected. Do you know anyone who lost someone? I sure do. Tragedies involving gun violence will always occur in our society, there is nothing we can do to prevent it. I am just trying to get across to Chase that there are valid reasons to not have guns in students hands on campus.
Students with guns on campus will not fix the problem of gun violence on campus. It will only provide those that wish to harm people, another way to do so. More guns on campus provides more access to those who we wish to keep them away from. We don't live in a time/place where you can keep a gun in a gun rack in a truck anymore, at least I don't think so. I wish we did, but we don't.

 

[raleighjeepguy]

And sure, it sounds nice for raleighjeepguy to say that the kid should have never been on VT campus to begin with, but crimes cannot be preveted all the time.
Eric Harris- "There is nothing you guys could have done to prevent any of this."
for those of you who do not know, Eric harris was one of the shooters at columbine.

Eric Harris=kid who shot up a high school. You can't use him in any of this b/c it can't be prevented with any form of your
thinking. No kids in a high school are going to have guns so yea he was pretty much dead on.

I wonder if the students at Virginia Tech that were shot dead, the ones that could have defended themselves and their peers were negatively effected by the rules and laws that created the unatural 'gun free zone' killing field?

For some reason I feel most of them would prob be anti guns period.
Heres your list of school shootings in the last 10 years.

March 24, 1998
Jonesboro, Ark. Four students and one teacher killed, ten others wounded outside as Westside Middle School emptied during a false fire alarm. Mitchell Johnson, 13, and Andrew Golden,
April 24, 1998
Edinboro, Pa. One teacher, John Gillette, killed, two students wounded at a dance at James W. Parker Middle School.
May 19, 1998
Fayetteville, Tenn. One student killed in the parking lot at Lincoln County High School three days before he was to graduate. The victim was dating the ex-girlfriend of his killer, 18-year-old honor student Jacob Davis.
May 21, 1998
Springfield, Ore. Two students killed, 22 others wounded in the cafeteria at Thurston High School by 15-year-old Kip Kinkel. Kinkel had been arrested and released a day earlier for bringing a gun to school. His parents were later found dead at home.
June 15, 1998
Richmond, Va. One teacher and one guidance counselor wounded by a 14-year-old boy in the school hallway.
April 20, 1999
Littleton, Colo. 14 students (including killers) and one teacher killed, 23 others wounded at Columbine High School in the nation's deadliest school shooting. Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, had plotted for a year to kill at least 500 and blow up their school. At the end of their hour-long rampage, they turned their guns on themselves.
April 28, 1999
Taber, Alberta, Canada One student killed, one wounded at W. R. Myers High School in first fatal high school shooting in Canada in 20 years. The suspect, a 14-year-old boy, had dropped out of school after he was severely ostracized by his classmates.
May 20, 1999
Conyers, Ga. Six students injured at Heritage High School by Thomas Solomon, 15, who was reportedly depressed after breaking up with his girlfriend.
Nov. 19, 1999
Deming, N.M. Victor Cordova Jr., 12, shot and killed Araceli Tena, 13, in the lobby of Deming Middle School.
Dec. 6, 1999
Fort Gibson, Okla. Four students wounded as Seth Trickey, 13, opened fire with a 9mm semiautomatic handgun at Fort Gibson Middle School.
Dec. 7, 1999
Veghel, Netherlands One teacher and three students wounded by a 17-year-old student.
Feb. 29, 2000
Mount Morris Township, Mich. Six-year-old Kayla Rolland shot dead at Buell Elementary School near Flint, Mich. The assailant was identified as a six-year-old boy with a .32-caliber handgun.
March 2000
Branneburg, Germany One teacher killed by a 15-year-old student, who then shot himself. The shooter has been in a coma ever since.
March 10, 2000
Savannah, Ga. Two students killed by Darrell Ingram, 19, while leaving a dance sponsored by Beach High School.
May 26, 2000
Lake Worth, Fla. One teacher, Barry Grunow, shot and killed at Lake Worth Middle School by Nate Brazill, 13, with .25-caliber semiautomatic pistol on the last day of classes.
Sept. 26, 2000
New Orleans, La. Two students wounded with the same gun during a fight at Woodson Middle School.
Jan. 17, 2001
Baltimore, Md. One student shot and killed in front of Lake Clifton Eastern High School.
Jan. 18, 2001
Jan, Sweden One student killed by two boys, ages 17 and 19.
March 5, 2001
Santee, Calif. Two killed and 13 wounded by Charles Andrew Williams, 15, firing from a bathroom at Santana High School.
March 7, 2001
Williamsport, Pa. Elizabeth Catherine Bush, 14, wounded student Kimberly Marchese in the cafeteria of Bishop Neumann High School; she was depressed and frequently teased.
March 22, 2001
Granite Hills, Calif. One teacher and three students wounded by Jason Hoffman, 18, at Granite Hills High School. A policeman shot and wounded Hoffman.
March 30, 2001
Gary, Ind. One student killed by Donald R. Burt, Jr., a 17-year-old student who had been expelled from Lew Wallace High School.
Nov. 12, 2001
Caro, Mich. Chris Buschbacher, 17, took two hostages at the Caro Learning Center before killing himself.
Jan. 15, 2002
New York, N.Y. A teenager wounded two students at Martin Luther King Jr. High School.
Feb. 19, 2002
Freising, Germany Two killed in Eching by a man at the factory from which he had been fired; he then traveled to Freising and killed the headmaster of the technical school from which he had been expelled. He also wounded another teacher before killing himself.
April 26, 2002
Erfurt, Germany 13 teachers, two students, and one policeman killed, ten wounded by Robert Steinhaeuser, 19, at the Johann Gutenberg secondary school. Steinhaeuser then killed himself.
April 29, 2002
Vlasenica, Bosnia-Herzegovina One teacher killed, one wounded by Dragoslav Petkovic, 17, who then killed himself.
October 28, 2002
Tucson, Ariz. Robert S. Flores Jr., 41, a student at the nursing school at the University of Arizona, shot and killed three female professors and then himself.
April 14, 2003
New Orleans, La. One 15-year-old killed, and three students wounded at John McDonogh High School by gunfire from four teenagers (none were students at the school). The motive was gang-related.
April 24, 2003
Red Lion, Pa. James Sheets, 14, killed principal Eugene Segro of Red Lion Area Junior High School before killing himself.
Sept. 24, 2003
Cold Spring, Minn. Two students are killed at Rocori High School by John Jason McLaughlin, 15.
Sept. 28, 2004
Carmen de Patagones, Argentina Three students killed and 6 wounded by a 15-year-old Argentininan student in a town 620 miles south of Buenos Aires.
March 21, 2005
Red Lake, Minn. Jeff Weise, 16, killed grandfather and companion, then arrived at school where he killed a teacher, a security guard, 5 students, and finally himself, leaving a total of 10 dead.
Nov. 8, 2005
Jacksboro, Tenn. One 15-year-old shot and killed an assistant principal at Campbell County High School and seriously wounded two other administrators.
Aug. 24, 2006
Essex, Vt. Christopher Williams, 27, looking for his ex-girlfriend at Essex Elementary School, shot two teachers, killing one and wounding another. Before going to the school, he had killed the ex-girlfriend's mother.
Sept. 13, 2006
Montreal, Canada Kimveer Gill, 25, opened fire with a semiautomatic weapon at Dawson College. Anastasia De Sousa, 18, died and more than a dozen students and faculty were wounded before Gill killed himself.
Sept. 26, 2006
Bailey, Colo. Adult male held six students hostage at Platte Canyon High School and then shot and killed Emily Keyes, 16, and himself.
Sept. 29, 2006
Cazenovia, Wis. A 15-year-old student shot and killed Weston School principal John Klang.
Oct. 3, 2006
Nickel Mines, Pa. 32-year-old Carl Charles Roberts IV entered the one-room West Nickel Mines Amish School and shot 10 schoolgirls, ranging in age from 6 to 13 years old, and then himself. Five of the girls and Roberts died.
Jan. 3, 2007
Tacoma, Wash. Douglas Chanthabouly, 18, shot fellow student Samnang Kok, 17, in the hallway of Henry Foss High School.
April 16, 2007
Blacksburg, Va. A 23-year-old Virginia Tech student, Cho Seung-Hui, killed two in a dorm, then killed 30 more 2 hours later in a classroom building. His suicide brought the death toll to 33, making the shooting rampage the most deadly in U.S. history. Fifteen others were wounded.
Sept. 21, 2007
Dover, Del. A Delaware State Univesity Freshman, Loyer D. Brandon, shot and wounded two other Freshman students on the University campus. Brandon is being charged with attempted murder, assault, reckless engagement, as well as a gun charge.
Oct. 10, 2007
Cleveland, Ohio A 14-year-old student at a Cleveland high school, Asa H. Coon, shot and injured two students and two teachers before he shot and killed himself. The victims' injuries were not life-threatening.
Nov. 7, 2007
Tuusula, Finland An 18-year-old student in southern Finland shot and killed five boys, two girls, and the female principal at Jokela High School. At least 10 others were injured. The gunman shot himself and died from his wounds in the hospital.
Feb. 8, 2008
Baton Rouge, Louisiana A nursing student shot and killed two women and then herself in a classroom at Louisiana Technical College in Baton Rouge.
Feb. 11, 2008
Memphis, Tennessee A 17-year-old student at Mitchell High School shot and wounded a classmate in gym class.
Feb. 12, 2008
Oxnard, California A 14-year-old boy shot a student at E.O. Green Junior High School causing the 15-year-old victim to be brain dead.
Feb. 14, 2008
DeKalb, Illinois Gunman kills five students and then himself, and wounds 17 more when he opens fire on a classroom at Northern Illinois University. The gunman, Stephen P. Kazmierczak, was identified as a former graduate student at the university in 2007.

 

[raleighjeepguy]

Heres the people your argument relates to

October 28, 2002
Tucson, Ariz. Robert S. Flores Jr., 41, a student at the nursing school at the University of Arizona, shot and killed three female professors and then himself.
April 16, 2007
Blacksburg, Va. A 23-year-old Virginia Tech student, Cho Seung-Hui, killed two in a dorm, then killed 30 more 2 hours later in a classroom building. His suicide brought the death toll to 33, making the shooting rampage the most deadly in U.S. history. Fifteen others were wounded.
Sept. 21, 2007
Dover, Del. A Delaware State Univesity Freshman, Loyer D. Brandon, shot and wounded two other Freshman students on the University campus. Brandon is being charged with attempted murder, assault, reckless engagement, as well as a gun charge.
Feb. 8, 2008
Baton Rouge, Louisiana A nursing student shot and killed two women and then herself in a classroom at Louisiana Technical College in Baton Rouge.
Feb. 14, 2008
DeKalb, Illinois Gunman kills five students and then himself, and wounds 17 more when he opens fire on a classroom at Northern Illinois University. The gunman, Stephen P. Kazmierczak, was identified as a former graduate student at the university in 2007.

5 shootings in 10 years on college campuses.

 

[kcarroll]

@RJG

Assuming the data is accurate, it looks like we should be putting more parents in jail for not securing their firearms.


@Chase,

So, does buying a pistol for your underage son constitute a straw purchase? Do you know what a straw purchase is and why it would be bad to admit it on an open, public forum?

So you are a Marine, under 21 and in college? ROTC?

Thats the type of pistol i own. It is registered in my dads name and i dont carry it places because i am not 21 for another few months.

What is your background in terrorism control? USMC, training, and common sense

 

[raleighjeepguy]

So you are a Marine, under 21 and in college? ROTC?

I was gonna question that but saved myself the headache.

Thats the type of pistol i own. It is registered in my dads name and i dont carry it places because i am not 21 for another few months.

prob wouldn't admit that either. Your responsibility bit flies out the window.

@RJG

Assuming the data is accurate, it looks like we should be putting more parents in jail for not securing their firearms.

assuming the data is accurate it seems 90% of our problems lie in middle schools, high schools, and elem schools. We should def get these kids strapped.

 

[uglyjeepoffroad]

No, I am just trying to show that we all have equal rights in this world This is a fact. But one person's right to defend themselves should not be infringed upon by someone else's "right" to dislike guns and that students with guns on campus are not a great idea. This is your opinion. Someone not liking guns in no way presents an effective argument as to why a legal CCW holder should be forced to disarm to enter some places, and allowed to carry elsewhere. Besides, where do you think it would be easiest for someone to steal a gun: Out of a vehicle? or off of a CCW holder?

1

 

[uglyjeepoffroad]

assuming the data is accurate it seems 90% of our problems lie in middle schools, high schools, and elem schools. We should def get these kids strapped.

Talk about apples and oranges...

These schools are rarely a "campus" style setup. They are usually all inclusive in one or two buildings. Security can control the entrances and exits. They are also used by CHILDREN.

A college campus can sprawl over 100s of acres. There is no way to control who comes on or off. Security can really only respond to a problem, rarely can they prevent it. They are also used by ADULTS.

 

[Mac5005]

But don't forget what led up to the end of the shooting spree August 1, 1966, on the Top of the Clock Tower, University of Texas.

Allen Crum, was deputized on the scene, he was a volunteer, that was close by, and was able to go and get his rifle, only to help the situation. History shows, that if it had not been for him, the standoff would have lasted longer, and possibly led to more deaths.

-Stalkers and Shooters, by Kevin Dockery, Chapter 20

 

[kcarroll]

Originally Posted by kcarroll View Post
This is a fact. But one person's right to defend themselves should not be infringed upon by someone else's "right" to dislike guns
This is your opinion. Someone not liking guns in no way presents an effective argument as to why a legal CCW holder should be forced to disarm to enter some places, and allowed to carry elsewhere. Besides, where do you think it would be easiest for someone to steal a gun: Out of a vehicle? or off of a CCW holder?

I don't mean someone who doesn't like guns "because guns are evil".
examples - girl is raped at gunpoint, a victim of a home invasion, watching a parent get shot, etc
Those sort of things affect kids forever. School should be a safe place where everyone can focus on learning and not be anxiety ridden over so and so has a gun with them everyday. If they aren't safe at school, it is the responsibility of the school to make it so. It costs big bucks to get an education, if you don't feel safe, then you are not getting your moneys worth.
I'm not generally in favor of limiting personal freedoms, but fucking weapons have no business in schools. I don't see continuing to not allow weapons in schools in anyway restricts your "right" to defend yourself. College is optional, you don't HAVE to go, you could get an online degree.
Is it so hard to understand? Weapons have never been legal at school. Why should they be legal if kept concealed? If they should be legal to carry concealed, then it should be legal to open carry.
I would be apprehensive about any moron that can pass a one day class being allowed to carry a firearm on school campuses. Just because your kid has a drivers license, doesn't mean I would want my kid riding to school with yours. Just because you are a licensed contractor, doesn't mean I want you to build my house. Any moron can pass a class, that doesn't qualify their judgment or common sense. It just means they can follow directions for an afternoon.
Different strokes for different folks.

 

[kcarroll]

But don't forget what led up to the end of the shooting spree August 1, 1966, on the Top of the Clock Tower, University of Texas.
Allen Crum, was deputized on the scene, he was a volunteer, that was close by, and was able to go and get his rifle, only to help the situation. History shows, that if it had not been for him, the standoff would have lasted longer, and possibly led to more deaths.
-Stalkers and Shooters, by Kevin Dockery, Chapter 20

There will always be occasions where breaking the rules is the right thing to do.

 

[raleighjeepguy]

Talk about apples and oranges...

These schools are rarely a "campus" style setup. They are usually all inclusive in one or two buildings. Security can control the entrances and exits. They are also used by CHILDREN.

A college campus can sprawl over 100s of acres. There is no way to control who comes on or off. Security can really only respond to a problem, rarely can they prevent it. They are also used by ADULTS.

First off I was being sarcastic. Cas quoted Eric Harris who was a high school student. I was marking that remark to point out the difference itt b/c there is a very small occurance of college shootings compared to high school and lower facilities.

Honestly I don't know if your second statement is all that true. Have you taken a look at the elementary through high school facilities these days. Leesville for example is on over 100 acres and incorporates elem, middle, and high schools and is much larger than most small universities and community colleges. You can't just limit the picture to a 30k student va tech or nc state.

But don't forget what led up to the end of the shooting spree August 1, 1966, on the Top of the Clock Tower, University of Texas.

Allen Crum, was deputized on the scene, he was a volunteer, that was close by, and was able to go and get his rifle, only to help the situation. History shows, that if it had not been for him, the standoff would have lasted longer, and possibly led to more deaths.

-Stalkers and Shooters, by Kevin Dockery, Chapter 20

very true but also 40 years ago true. One incident doesn't prove much. There is a probability to everything in life. Now if we could just pull out our magic ball and take a look into a fictional future I'd be all over it.

 

[Banned User]

Do your female friends take self defense classes? No? if you are going to ask a question, why not let me answer it? the ones i am talking about are CC holders, and yes they do.
Then what makes you think they would go to the range and practice ? What does this have to do with being female? Does one's gender have anything to do with shooting skills or enthusiasm?

Pepper spray, personal alarm, walking stick or baton, tasers and stun guns, lots of other choices that would be just as effective at self protection at night right now.They are preventative measures, yes, but they are nothing compared to a firearm. My girlfriend can handle a pistol better than probably the majority of members on this board, but she has said she is totally uncomfortable with the idea of using pepper spray or stun guns or any of that stuff on an attacker. Have you ever been hit by these things? I have been hit with stun guns and tazers, many types of each. Yes they both suck, but they hardly incapacitate. You could easily continue to harm or victimize someone. Tazers on the other hand with put someone on the ground, but they are also prone to malfunction, and are single shot. Would you want to carry a concealed carry postil with only one bullet like barney fife? I like the insurance of having a full mag, and thats with something thats kills in one shot usually. Missfire or miss with a tazer and you are screwed. As for batons, those are usually pretty worthless in self defense. all that is is having longer arms. its hardly a defense against a gun-weilding criminal.

Why not press the university for more security, escorts and lights now? i totally agree with that, Who wouldnt want to have a Chuck Norris in every dorm? But it is also expensive and will raise tuition and taxes. Students with CC are volunteer security at no cost to the school. plus a shooter knows to avoid a security guard, or take him out first. CC makes it so he doesnt know who or where the security is.

If this is such a big deal to you personally, what else are you doing to change the situation other than exchanging 1's and 0's on the internet. Getting the word out there is just important to me as my own rights. Most people are scared of guns as a result of misinformation or out-right lies from the media. Back in the day almost every family had guns, knew how to use them, and valued them. Home invasions were also Extremely rare. people need to know that guns are not evil. People can be evil, guns cannot. many have said CC on campus might make some uncomfortable (they shouldnt even know, but thats besides my point) If more people were informed about CC, they probably wouldnt be afraid of it.
I am with you on protecting ones self with a firearm, we differ in opinion when it comes to schools. I think CC holders aught to be able to carry everywhere, banks, post office, etc, just not schools.im glad you are a gun guy, but that makes no sense to me. Schools could benefiet from CC more than most other places.

I usually respect most of what you have to say but come on. No shit they were affected. Do you know anyone who lost someone? I sure do. The first i ever knew of was a good friend of mine in middle school who lost her dad. He stopped an an ATM at night, got out of his truck and saw two men at the other end of the building. he turned around and started walking back to his truck, only to get approached by the men, demanding money. after a fight, he was hit in the chest with 3 9mm rounds, robbed, and left. At first the verdict was that he would be paralyzed but he died after 3 days in intensive care due to an undetected bloodclot. The kicker is that he was a CC holder, and it happened on one of the few nights he didnt have his pistol with him because he left an evening service from church and didnt like carrying his pistol under his dress clothes.

Tragedies involving gun violence will always occur in our society, there is nothing we can do to prevent it. I am just trying to get across to Chase that there are valid reasons to not have guns in students hands on campus.I agree, but those reasons are heavily outweighed by the valid reasons why there should be CC on campus

Students with guns on campus will not fix the problem of gun violence on campus. they might stop a shooting in progress though.

@RJG
@Chase,
So, does buying a pistol for your underage son constitute a straw purchase? Do you know what a straw purchase is and why it would be bad to admit it on an open, public forum?Trust me, i know terminology. HE owns the pistol, fair and square, he owns several. He owned it since I was 6. HE also owned most of the long guns in my gun case. He bought me my first deer rifle when i was under 18. Most peoples parents who hunt do. Legally they are still his but Im not going to go through the trouble to transfer them. When the time comes, my brother and i will have the rest of his guns but we are not going to go and take them out of dad's name, and half of them aren't in his name anyway because they were given to him or passed down to him. Hes not worried about me doing it either Becuase he knows i'm not going to commit crimes with them. I only have only bought an AR-15, two shotguns, and a varmint rifle. Those belong to me. The Sig. that i will be carrying when I am 21 is his and always will be his. Even if my son gets it it will still say my dad bought it.


So you are a Marine, under 21 and in college? My original enlistment was going to be active duty, until i got smart and realized i didnt want to go 4 years without a getting a degree. I switched to the reserve side(which sucks) so i could attend school for 2 years. As soon as school is done, i will either be activating or getting out, depending on whether or not i want to go career. YEs im under 21 until september. I enlisted almost 2 years ago. ROTC?thats a big no.

There will always be occasions where breaking the rules is the right thing to do. He didnt break any rules, he was deputized which means he was given the authority by the law to act as a police officer. You dont even need to be deputized to act like a police officer. Someone did a bunch of illegal stuff in walmart a few years back, and the police took too long so when he ran away, i chased him down and physically subdued him until the police arrived.

.

 

[FishHunt]

Again I'll have to ask. What are the solutions to the problems created by the 'gun free zones'? How do you plan to make sure the people that are forced to unarmed and defenseless are protected? More restrictive guns laws? We all know that those that seek to harm their fellow man do not care one bit about the rules and laws.

Concealed carry should at the very least should be offered as an option to staff on campus. I also think that the original wording in the United States Constitution says it best.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

If you have any troubled understanding any of the words or meaning in the 2nd amendment then I would be wasting my time trying to explain it to you.

<><Fish

 

[Banned User]

If you have any troubled understanding any of the words or meaning in the 2nd amendment then I would be wasting my time trying to explain it to you.

<><Fish

most of these people dont realize that those right are not even given to us by the 2nd amendment. The second amendment was written to put onto paper the rights we already have and have had since the beginning of firearms




Still others like to say that the term "right of the people" only applies to the militia men. I on the other hand feel like the term "the people" means the EXACT same thing as it does in the 1st, 4th, 9th, and 10th amendments.

 

[uglyjeepoffroad]

I even went back and reread the Constitution and I couldn't find anywhere in there anything that guarantees anyone's right to infringe upon mine because "they are scared" or "they don't like guns" or "My daddy had a gun and he was a bad man, so guns are bad, Mmkay...".

As far as poeple having been raped, or robbed, etc with a gun and now they hate them. I think, more often than not, they would be 1st in line for a CCW permit to protect themselves and others in the future.

 

[kcarroll]

Again I'll have to ask. What are the solutions to the problems created by the 'gun free zones'? How do you plan to make sure the people that are forced to unarmed and defenseless are protected? More restrictive guns laws? We all know that those that seek to harm their fellow man do not care one bit about the rules and laws.
Concealed carry should at the very least should be offered as an option to staff on campus. I also think that the original wording in the United States Constitution says it best.
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
If you have any troubled understanding any of the words or meaning in the 2nd amendment then I would be wasting my time trying to explain it to you.
<><Fish

No one has stated they misunderstood or ask for clarification of the 2nd amendment. I don't think anyone in this thread has suggested or hinted at taking our guns away. We agree on CC for staff, what other wording is there for the 2nd amendment? Gun free zones? They are not new, guns are not being banned from schools for the first time.

I'm not sure what the solution is, that's why we are having this discussion. Perhaps more respect is a good place to start. Respect for people and their life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. Problem is how do we cull all of the entitled, self righteous, self indulged, good for nothing fuck ups that ruin this place for the rest of us? We need to be focusing on the safety of our children as a whole, not "I sure am glad my kid has a gun in his backpack to protect himself".

That's were I think capitalism has hurt our Republic, selfishness. Now I'm not saying capitalism isn't a good thing, but, if there ain't a profit to be made, then it takes a tragedy for us to fix something. My point is, public safety, public educators, etc are too undervalued. We need to start investing in our people, before the big corporations sell us all the way down the river. Less big government, more states rights, move problem resolution closer to the ground. But that is another topic.

 

[kcarroll]

I even went back and reread the Constitution and I couldn't find anywhere in there anything that guarantees anyone's right to infringe upon mine because "they are scared" or "they don't like guns" or "My daddy had a gun and he was a bad man, so guns are bad, Mmkay...".
As far as poeple having been raped, or robbed, etc with a gun and now they hate them. I think, more often than not, they would be 1st in line for a CCW permit to protect themselves and others in the future.

I was only trying to offer a different perspective, not a justification for the emotion. Ever done any counseling for folks who have been victimized by violent crime? If not, I guess that means your thoughts are just that, your own. New flash, speculations based solely on your own opinion and experiences can sometimes be wrong. If you have, I would be surprised. Ever known anyone who has been attacked by a dog? How do they feel about dogs now? How is that any different
You currently don't have the right to carry a firearm on school grounds, so what rights of yours are being infringed upon. How about smokers rights, or aggressive dog owners? It could really go on and on, but the reality is there are restrictions on personal freedoms in our country. Like it or not, I generally do not, but this is one situation where I think it is in the interest of the greater good that firearms continue to be illegal on campus for students.

 

[bigwaylon]

i go to one of the bigger churches in the state and we also have 2 schools that operate out of it. All private schools make their own rules on CC. You better believe that theres people carrying at our church. I know several people who do, and anyone is allowed to.

I'm not a lawyer by any means...and have only been reading up on the subject for a little over a year...

however, there is nothing in the North Carolina Firearms Laws that differentiate public vs private when it discusses schools...the only "exempt" category listed is for home schools...

the prohibited areas include the school grounds and buildings...as well as recreational areas, athletic fields, and any school bus...

I'm not going to doubt people are carrying...

the verbage on the books simply states "educational property", and prohibited items include (open or concealed) gun, rifle, pistol or any other firearm as a felony...dynamite, bomb, grenade, mine or powerful explosive as a felony...and BB gun, stun gun, air rifle, air pistol, bowie knife, dirk, dagger, slungshot, loaded cane, switchblade knife, blackjack, metallic knuckles, razors and razor blades, fireworks or any pointed or edged object (except instructional supplies, unalterned nail files and clips, and tools used for food/instruction/maintenance) as misdemeanors...

it would also include day cares as educational properties...

Greg

 

[bigwaylon]

You people wait 9 pages to come in. My back is killing me

off-topic...if you'd change your settings to 40 posts per page...you would've only had to wait til page 4...and you're back would feel better...

Greg

 

[uglyjeepoffroad]

Ever done any counseling for folks who have been victimized by violent crime? If not, I guess that means your thoughts are just that, your own. New flash, speculations based solely on your own opinion and experiences can sometimes be wrong. If you have, I would be surprised. Ever known anyone who has been attacked by a dog? How do they feel about dogs now? How is that any different

I work with and am friends with a member on this very board who was a victim of a home invasion. My family was robbed when I was younger. In understand the chances.
My son was the victim of a dog attack (our dog). That dog was gone the next day. I have new, smaller dogs, but I am wary of him around others.
I don't need a news flash. I have a mind and can digest facts. Just because I have not directly experienced something does not mean I cannot have an opinion. That opinion may even be a good one.
I have never given birth to a child, but I know it looks like it hurts, so my OPINION is that it hurts.
Following your logic, no one would ever go into a hospital, 'cause I am sure someone you know has died in one. No on would drive a car, 'cause someone you know has been hurt or killed in one.
As for not losing any rights, we have already lost them. we are just arguing that they should be reinstated.

 

[raleighjeepguy]

off-topic...if you'd change your settings to 40 posts per page...you would've only had to wait til page 4...and you're back would feel better...

ONLY B/C I DIDN'T KNOW! but thanks for the future