Difficulty of Daniel

[ghost]

Just so you guys know....those of us that went to the Forestry Service meeting at the zoo were told that the Big Branch trail and Goldmine trails were in the running for being re opened.
Also, were were informed that UNF has a history of well planned and well maintained trail systems and that through their audit, they didnt find anything the EPA or anyone else could possibly complain about.
Infact, this audit is why Big Branch is being re opened...the bald eagle that made its home there seems to have relocated, so the area is no longer an endagered species habitat.

Sweet! Another trail! Where is Big Branch located?

 

[yield2me]

We rode Daniel the weekend of the 14th in our buggies. The bottom ledge has an undercut that requires knowing how you have to hit it in your rig. The second ledge was nothing I thought. The upper section was as fun/difficult as you wanted to make it. Go far left for easy, or zig zag the right for fun.

Rob

 

[DRaider90]

Sweet! Another trail! Where is Big Branch located?

If I am not mistaken the Big Branch Trail is apart of the trail near Falls Dam that is over halfway to being opened. This was discussed at some length during the work day Hunt Camp meeting with the FS. If I remember correctly the mileage estimate of new/reopened trail will be 2 miles.

Here is an old map from an old discussion I had:

Not to de-rail the thread, back about Daniel.

Can anyone that has done Daniel recently tell me if the new guard railing got put up, or if any of the hazard trees got cut down?

 

[cj777]

Just so you guys know....those of us that went to the Forestry Service meeting at the zoo were told that the Big Branch trail and Goldmine trails were in the running for being re opened.
Also, were were informed that UNF has a history of well planned and well maintained trail systems and that through their audit, they didnt find anything the EPA or anyone else could possibly complain about.
Infact, this audit is why Big Branch is being re opened...the bald eagle that made its home there seems to have relocated, so the area is no longer an endagered species habitat.

Awesome. That's great to hear.

 

[cgm147]

did daniel about an hour ago guard rail was kinda up no trees in the way. a group of us went down and back up made no problem locked rear open front

 

[drkelly]

Sweet! Another trail! Where is Big Branch located?

I have posted this map on here before. As best I can remember, it went from the top of Falls Dam, down around the mountain, and then connected across the road from Wolfs Den.

 

[Sal-XK]

I have a two question and a statement first the questions. Is the work the FS does on Daniel purposely done to keep its trail difficulty from getting to hard? Or is there work to keep run off or damage that could get it closed fixed resulting in its difficulty not getting harder? Now my statement, after taking my slightly modified XK threw every trail but Daniel I have scaled back my mods dramatically to keep the trails interesting and fun. I've decided to only add some armor and a rear locker now this way I can enjoy more of the trails making me think and work to get threw it. If we get a new trail I can't conquer I will modify just enough to make it. Thanks in advance for answering the question just trying to understand how they keep the trail from progressing.

 

[Hitchhiker]

Did Daniel this last weekend. The difficulty is up quite a bit from the first time I went there this year.

The TJ's with 4" lifts had to think about lines a bit but just fun for them. I managed to scrape the back window on my XJ on that stupid tree right past the hair pin turn back to the left. That tree seems to be almost impossible not to hit with my jeep. It's going to come down eventually with the way the dirt is wearing out around it.

Over all I'd still say this is the most fun trail, it's also the most stressful trail for me with the off camber leaning into trees in an XJ though.

 

[NickMaul]

I managed to scrape the back window on my XJ on that stupid tree right past the hair pin turn back to the left. That tree seems to be almost impossible not to hit with my jeep.

i sail pass that tree every time. Maybe its a height issue for XJs. I am only lifted 3.5"

and the few months i have been trail riding at ure daniel has not gotten any harder. i am open front and rear and can do the entire trail, plus going up the right side

 

[DRaider90]

Or is there work to keep run off or damage that could get it closed fixed resulting in its difficulty not getting harder?

You got it right.

Also that tree has been marked for removal. Its a dead tree and considered a hazard.

 

[koolaid5]

This comment pertains to Daniel only:
What I always hear is a lot of people complaining that Daniel is too difficult. This is accompanied with lots of hemming and hawing about doing Daniel. I have not been to URE since April this year but I have wheeled Daniel every time I go for the last ten years. Daniel is a moderate trail by the standards of other trail systems in the region. A lot of folks do a lot of hand wringing because it is, and has been considered extremely difficult for too long. Yes there are a couple places that care must be taken but nothing a bone stock Jeep driven by someone with some sense couldn't handle. Imho, if there is no environmental impact by letting nature and use go unchecked then let the trail mature into what it could be, an extremely difficult trail. Should that ever happen I'll be happy to use it until such time as my rigs won't be able to traverse it any longer, at which time I'll gladly step aside to let the bigger rigs have at it. Further more, I'd rather see my tax dollars used to create new trails in URE rather than make sure "extremely difficult" trails are passable by all vehicles. Let's try not to follow the example of the US school system of teaching down to the least capable, I.E. making our trails passable by any vehicle with any skill driver. The inexperienced and incapable will have a lot to do but the experienced and the capable will get bored and get in trouble or skip URE altogether.

I enjoy running Daniel and all the trails at URE but if the FS is going to list it as "Extremely Difficult" it's difficulty should be along the lines of "Pull Cable" at Callalantee, otherwise, it needs to be reclassified.

Well said...

 

[Rox&Mud]

Well said...

Thanks

 

[burrellsjeep]

Well put Rox.

 

[Tacoma747]

Agreed, but I would like to see a bone stock jeep with ANY driver go up Daniel, the ledges would be impossible (at least the lower one). Even the upper hillclimb is pretty tough if you are not locked because of all the loose rock.

I say don't touch it, let it get harder. It is still a cakewalk compared to "difficult" or "moderate" trails at other places.

 

[Rox&Mud]

Agreed, but I would like to see a bone stock jeep with ANY driver go up Daniel, the ledges would be impossible (at least the lower one). Even the upper hillclimb is pretty tough if you are not locked because of all the loose rock.
I say don't touch it, let it get harder. It is still a cakewalk compared to "difficult" or "moderate" trails at other places.

Come out with us this weekend, you may just see that.

 

[Tacoma747]

Come out with us this weekend, you may just see that.

Meet you at the bottom of Daniel at what time on saturday? I want to see a bone stock jeep go up the lower ledge without getting a tug Heck, i want to see one go up the 2nd ledge and the upper hillclimb too...

 

[Rox&Mud]

Meet you at the bottom of Daniel at what time on saturday? I want to see a bone stock jeep go up the lower ledge without getting a tug Heck, i want to see one go up the 2nd ledge and the upper hillclimb too...

Oh, now there are qualifications.
Seriously, I haven't seen the ledge since May. I know most folks will need a tug or a winch. When I get there Friday night we are making a quick run just to look at the ledge(s) before we take a full convoy of stock to mildly modifieds up to it on Sunday. We will run it Sunday sometime though.
PM your #, I'll call when were headed that way if you want to watch.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Daniel Seems to be on of the most Changing Trails. For the most part I have never really had much trouble on it. but there is allways something new.

These Trails are for FS access to the forest, so if the FS can not access them then they can not monitor the forest and trails. So the FS needs to do what ever they need to to keep the trails passable

We Just use them for our fun

 

[Tacoma747]

You are the one that said it, I guess you don't think it can be done now I saw a modified TJ flop (well, saw it on it's side/nose) coming down Daniel. Saw other modified Jeeps attempting to come up the lower ledge, I'd LOVE to see a "bone stock" one come up it

I *might* would come down for a ride on saturday, not sure yet since I was there last saturday. I like just going to Kodak to watch/play.

This comment pertains to Daniel only:
What I always hear is a lot of people complaining that Daniel is too difficult. This is accompanied with lots of hemming and hawing about doing Daniel. I have not been to URE since April this year but I have wheeled Daniel every time I go for the last ten years. Daniel is a moderate trail by the standards of other trail systems in the region. A lot of folks do a lot of hand wringing because it is, and has been considered extremely difficult for too long. Yes there are a couple places that care must be taken but nothing a bone stock Jeep driven by someone with some sense couldn't handle. Imho, if there is no environmental impact by letting nature and use go unchecked then let the trail mature into what it could be, an extremely difficult trail. Should that ever happen I'll be happy to use it until such time as my rigs won't be able to traverse it any longer, at which time I'll gladly step aside to let the bigger rigs have at it. Further more, I'd rather see my tax dollars used to create new trails in URE rather than make sure "extremely difficult" trails are passable by all vehicles. Let's try not to follow the example of the US school system of teaching down to the least capable, I.E. making our trails passable by any vehicle with any skill driver. The inexperienced and incapable will have a lot to do but the experienced and the capable will get bored and get in trouble or skip URE altogether.

I enjoy running Daniel and all the trails at URE but if the FS is going to list it as "Extremely Difficult" it's difficulty should be along the lines of "Pull Cable" at Callalantee, otherwise, it needs to be reclassified.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Do you ever tell your friends "hey I made it all the way down wolfs den!"?

yes in my Saturn

 

[tkob1060]

Meet you at the bottom of Daniel at what time on saturday? I want to see a bone stock jeep go up the lower ledge without getting a tug Heck, i want to see one go up the 2nd ledge and the upper hillclimb too...

I've been with bone stock 2 and 4dr JK's that have gone up it first and 2nd ledge last year. These vids are from this year. The 4dr door is stock rubicon but I believe he did not turn on his lockers.





Are you saying there is a 2nd ledge again this year? It was filled in when I was there in may.

 

[DRaider90]

The 2nd Ledge has been filled in, but for all purposes its still called the 2nd Ledge. It only takes a couple good rain storms and it will be back to normal.

The definition of stock has changed over the years, especially when your talking about Rubicons. They are geared low, have better clearance/bigger tires, and have lockers. I don't know about other people but when I am talking stock I am thinking in this range:

30.1-40.1 Crawl Ratio (That means no 4:1 t-case gears etc)
Open/Open Diffs (Maybe LSD/Open)
235 to maybe 31" tires
No Lift/Low Clearance

A perfect example would be the stock Isuzu Trooper on 235s, open/open, no lift, and a 2.3 engine up Daniel no straps/recovery. I know Peter has pictures up on here somewhere of him doing it. But that was back in 2008.

I have made it up Daniel in a lot of different configurations of the past years. And every time you do the Daniel trail you never know how it will turn out. I have had perfect runs, then just a day or two later have a run from hell. You never know what will happen.

 

[Rox&Mud]

You are the one that said it, I guess you don't think it can be done now I saw a modified TJ flop (well, saw it on it's side/nose) coming down Daniel. Saw other modified Jeeps attempting to come up the lower ledge, I'd LOVE to see a "bone stock" one come up it
I *might* would come down for a ride on saturday, not sure yet since I was there last saturday. I like just going to Kodak to watch/play.

Well, I know you weren't there on Sunday but had you been...

you would have seen a few stock Jeeps traverse the entirety of Daniel with out winch or strap. Some pics are already up from our trip from the other group members. I'm still going through mine to pull the good ones to post, I only took a few hundred.

Oh, the second ledge is coming back.

 

[biggoofy]

I wheeled all of Daniel sunday with Rox&mud with out pulling any cable and im in a ZJ with a 2" bb and 31" ats open F/R just needed some good spotting

 

[Reid]

^
l
l
l
better ask for proof...he thought he did daniel on saturday but really did Rocky Mtn loop


just messing with ya.