East Coast Offroad Race League

The ONLY way this will work is if someone is making money off it. The whole "doing it for the sport" is BS. Run the damn thing like a business, make the tough decisions based on the business model and run with it. it isnt like there will be a shortage of us rednecks wanting to come.

Make some bleachers for the rock sections or something like that. More paid butts in the seats. If you always think of what will make this better and what will bring more people to enjoy then you haev a base guideline right there.
 
The reason is "must" be a series is because then the racers and fans "own" the business, not the track owners.

Other examples of this - Dixie Run, Great Smokey Mtn Trail Ride, HUGE events, that the "land owner" just shut down.

By becoming a business that allows us to create a consistent experience for the fans, racers, vendors AND land owners.

I don't think a single person on here complained about the land owners and organizers getting paid for WORKING. I certainly expect Ricky and Johnny to make money on this, otherwise it will never work.

[My expectation is 4-5 annual events to start with... ONE person will be THE main contact for each of them otherwise folks will get burned out. But if you just have ONE to worry about per year and get to enjoy the others, much funner for you and the whole crew. So the example would be say RICKY concentrates on the Eldorado Stables Event, XYZ is coordinator on say an event at Callantee, UUU is the coordinator at......etc]

YES, you can run an event or two for free, but that gets old FAST. Long term if we want this to be an organized series of racing, there WILL be money involved for those putting in the time hours and MONEY INTO the organization/series.

Then the volunteers (which are going to be needed in a big way) WILL be compensated in various fashions. Here is an example:

Volunteers needed a tow strap, first aid kit and fire extinguisher at every workstation. Guess what, at the end of the weekend, they are yours, thanks for your help. (Plus a couple tshirts and a ballcap) The cost, probably $100 a volunteer...but I bet I get alot more hands raised to help out!?

This is the same way I run my business, you realize how LITTLE it costs to keep an employee happy? Our firm buys lunch during tax season every Saturday, cost is maybe $20-50 depending on the meal....but guess what, we are THERE working on a SATURDAY 15 weeks in a row.

Those little things are what makes or breaks an organization and that is why I wanted to start this and create a business model. Ricky - looking fwd to talking with you and the others that have PM'd me. Let's hang loose and talk this weekend sometime, I am slammed tonight and tomorrow night.

My email

sammyh
AT
triad.rr.com

That may also be the best way to chat since I can get them on the blackberry and respond.

Don't think anyone's feelings got hurt too bad here, but also got some fantastic ideas so far in this thread.

Insurance - we got a couple solid quotes so far.

Next - will be working with my attorney on building solid waiver forms, and contracts that will be signed with the land owners, racers, vendors, etc.

Concurrently with that - I think defining the rules will be the next major step and I would ask that you folks that actually RACED (or plan to) please tell us what you would prefer in classes (and rules)

Right now I think there is room / place for a "STOCKER" class, but there will be some strict rules to keep those guys safe.

I am not sure 3 classes are needed / or how we seperate the "Pros" like Will / Big Woody / (3rd KOH guy slips my mind) from RatLabGuy, Brenden and the other DD/Modifieds?

Best ideas I have heard on that so far is the POINTS based systems where we assign points per modification / tire size, etc.

Finally - if we have TOO many classes, then they are hard to fill up, ie, they had to combine C/D. I think instead I would rather combine B & C...and somehow "define" D

Sam (hoping the boss will understand that yes this is biz) Hinton
 
Fayetteville track

We have found land in the Fayetteville area and are in the process of getting everything together to build the track. I hope to build a twin track so trucks can run side by side with a barrier in between so you get the race feeling without the potential of injury. I have been looking into insurance and what it will cost and so far the info I have been given isn't cheap. I will continue to try and figure this out so we can give racers and fans all the 4x4 fun they can handle. If anyone would like to get involved please feel free to come by the shop and I will show you what we got. Wilson/ Wilson Off Road
 
Almost forgot

The property has a water source, but I am going to need equipment to cut the track. It will take sometime, but I am involved and hope that the other racers see that.
I don't know how the classes should run but I found out this weekend that on that track we raced you were better off with a 6 cyl, my V-8 had to much power and got me into trouble. The same thing happened to my other driver with a V-8. I am not trying to make excuses, I had to beat 4.19 and that is racing! Wilson/ Wilson Off Road
 
I think that what I am about to talk about next will spark off lots more discussion, we may end up splitting this part off, but sent out PM's this morning.

However as Wilson Offroad posted a moment ago (and VERY cool stuff you have going / def want to get with you on being part of the series!) I realized I am missing folks in some of my PM's


Here is part of the concept (one Class) I am thinking of, essentially a wider version of the defunct FTOY class:

"East Coast Buggy" - this MAY include part of the original frame , but I am thinking of going with a standard buggy frame instead that you hang YOUR parts on.

4 cylinders (will need to be in a HP range)

"stock" axles (to be defined by vehicle, example maybe D30/??)

Tires?? (Not sure if you want to put a range on them or not)

This will allow any of the various crowds to get involved, hang their parts on a "common" buggy frame and then wheel against each other.

It allows US to define the strength and protection built into the frame itself for safety.

Ok, let the firestorm begin on this....

By the way if you are interested in being an "official" BUGGY provider please PM me as well. I sent out some direct PMs earlier to those I thought would be interested, but again I realize there are folks on here that maybe interested that I did not contact directly.

I suspect we will end up setting a "price point" of some sort to be fair to the shops / so they can all make some money on this and of course some folks will want to pay them to build turn key buggies or 75%, etc.

Sam
 
Too cost prohibitive, you eliminate 90% or more of your grassroots race crowd right there. Even if someone wanted to build a buggy, who wants to spend the time and energy building some piece of 4 cylinder junk that is only useful in this race series. Sure a few people would, but most that are interested in this sort of thing just don't have the budget.
 
awspence said:
Too cost prohibitive, you eliminate 90% or more of your grassroots race crowd right there. Even if someone wanted to build a buggy, who wants to spend the time and energy building some piece of 4 cylinder junk that is only useful in this race series. Sure a few people would, but most that are interested in this sort of thing just don't have the budget.
Click to expand...

Agreed,

That would knock me out of it,

I have a "trail rig", that i would like to race a few times a year, But I do not have the budget to build a race only buggy.
 
The "buggy" class its own, you still have Stockers and Mods but this MAY be class #3?

The FToy owners that I have seen all wheel their "race" rigs all the time. So some folks may transition to that being their primary rig.

(Assume for the moment you have a trail rig and can spend under $2k for a buggy chassis, would that tempt you?)

Like I said this is an alternative... You certainly see alot of those running around and this opens it up beyond a single Manuf (Toyota)

Basically trying to "level" the playing field for a buggy class and I am guessing there is a % of folks that this will appeal to. We are NOT gonna make everyone happy for sure.

The comments from the guys that raced last weekend / up at Mtn City, etc are the ones weighted the most heavily. Those are the ones we are expecting will be interested.
 
As a 3rd class i think it is a better idea. I would still see it either not getting the numbers to survive, or taking a very long time. How is the Ftoy doing in popularity? I have no idea, I don't frequent pirate or any other site that talks about them. Any chance of simply adding the actual ftoy to these races, or do they belong to a higher sanctioning body that wouldn't like that??
 
If you have insurance concerns ask Doug (bansil) about the event in mtn city. It was insured. Our biggest expense was EMS had to be there.
 
Ricky - Not sure who you thought was attacking you, I know you've done a ton of work and do deserve to make as much money at it as you can. My advice was to help you succeed and not loose out by narrowing the potential market. Your place down there would be in a perfect situation to be on the receiving end of any growth/expansion in this types of events. You have involvement with 2 large 4x4 specific events under your belt (plus others). When there are additional choices people will pick the places that they like to go to when they can. There is money to be made and anyone with the desire to host these events can see that potential.

My .02 is stop focusing on the 'classes' and specific events. Focus on the value add and $$ making aspects. Offer premium camping areas. Better pay per use facilities,locked/keyed/maintained porta-johns. Covered car port type rental areas. Rent fold up lawn chairs, umbrellas, rain coats, Rent out tents, anything that the average idiot is likely to forget, loose or break while their down there. You have a very captive audience. As I said before make your location the desired place for people to go..

Volunteers - Every time I've been to any event that relied on volunteers for man power I have always felt that they really didn't do a great job of attracting 'good' competent people. Simply offering free admission is great for some people. Possibly offer some other things to make the weekend more enjoyable for them. Separate camping area with private outhouse/facilities. Special parking area, special access to the course pre/post event time for slow speed stuff. (crawling areas). Shift/rotation to see/do different things over the weekend. Possibly all this stuff was offered/provided but in the announcements I didn't see anything other than the admission/camping costs and the 'experience' to have helped out. Possibly that would attract people with other special skills that you may need. EMT/Fire etc..

Anyway good luck.... I'm curious to see what all happens over the next year or so...
 
I am still batting around ideas on the classes.

One suggestion (by me) is to come up with a buggy chassis that could be bought for under $2k. Then "stock" type axles underneath it combined with 4cyl engines.

Essentially the FToy, but open for all brands (Jeep, Ford, Isuzu, Samurai) etc. The worry is that is too cost prohibitive and not what folks want.

Another suggestion I got was to just have a "Stock XJ" class...my only worry is there is a bunch of guys that would exclude, sure it makes technical stuff easier but...(and having too many classes means not enough participation)

Regardless I expect to have a "stocker" class which is basically the "A" class that we saw at Eldorado.

Then a MODified class and UNlimited class. (Will define the difference in Stock vs Mod vs UNLimited using a points system is my guess)

Insurance seems to just be a matter of filling out the paperwork for the events OR we also have a ballpark quote for the YEAR for "unlimited" events.


I guess the next thing to do is setup the group of advisors and investors.

IF you own land / racetrack and interested please send me a PM.

If you are interested in helping setup the website, technical inspections, becoming an "official" vendor (buggy chassis supplier, etc) send me PMs as well.

I need to talk with Ricky / hoping he will be the coordinator for the Eldorado race... my goal is to have ONE person in charge of a given race / try not to burn anyone out.

Will assemble more information into a NEW thread and then lock this one down.

Sam
 
We are still rolling!!

I have got approval from 3 locations already that are looking forward to ECORS racing in 2010!! (We are hoping to talk with Ricky / Eldorado as well / they will be part of the series!!)

Right now we are trying to decide on a location for this fall for our kickoff event and then run a full season for 2010. We have a place we want...hoping to hear some good news on that soon! :) [You know who you are!]

Stockers, Modifieds and Unlimited are the three classes that we are going to shoot for in season ONE.

Season TWO we are thinking very seriously of having an ECORS buggy design that will be built such that folks can take a stocker and bolt the parts on and have a nice little "inexpensive" buggy for trail riding and racing.

ECORS will be providing more details / hoping to get a face to face meeting soon with the principals / our final budget hammered out and cash in the bank to start purchasing equipment!

I think I have seen / participated 20-30 emails on it in the last 5 days, just trying to not swamp everyone here with information overflow!!

THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN... Trophies... Points Standings... Year End Payoff for the Series Leaders... Cool stuff for our volunteers... and EXCITING race action for the fans and racers!!

:driver:


Sam
 
rockcity said:
You can still drive down. Its only like 8 hours away :flipoff2:
Click to expand...

Yeah... only 8 hrs... without a tow rig.
It's one thing to set up a buddy or two to be willing to haul haul yer broken ass home an hour or so.
Crossing 3 states, esp multiple times a year, is another issue.

Don't get me wrong - I'm all in support of it and do what Ican to be involved. I just wish I lived closer (or had a fatter wallet).

This is def pushing me closer to the "get a tow rig" point though.
 
. know I got the tow dolly and pulled my yj all over the east coast with my zj
 
I don't think I can make it to TN right now, truck needs a new front end and I need to renew my tag, and I need to detune the XJ to meet A requirements. eerrrgh
 
Keep in mind, the class requirements posted are being revised as we speak. Final class requirements should be posted within a couple days so check back
 
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