May jam or May scam?

[1983Bronco]

This thread is probably going to piss some people off but oh well Let me start off by saying that I know Ricky is a good kid and somehow he seems to be in dept to Johhny some how and that sucks.

I went to May jam with high expetations, after all last year I think the high speed race had over 30-35 competitors in all. I was also told that "several" people had signed up and "several" more were gonna sign up at the track.

So here we go, my co driver has to pay $35 to camp and $25 for the "insurance" to ride, whatever we came to race. So drivers meeting is supposed to be @ 7:00 am, started at more like 10:00am. I already have a bad feeling considering I did not see that many trailers with race rigs. We were told there was 9 competitors in A class and possibly some more coming late. So we go aout and beat the shit out of our jeep so we can make the fast fives the next day. Well turns out there were only 5 total competitors in A class, so basically beat the shit out of my rig for nothing. We could have ran the course in reverse and made it to the finals sunday(top 5). This was frustrating considering we busted a coil spring and our oil pan on the second lap, but still finished.

I had also registered for B class, apparently I was the only one, so at least they gave me my entry fee back when they cancelled the class.

We patched our rig up an ended up winning the next day, which was cool. So Wilsons off road was sponsoring the whole event, which I'm sure was not cheap, they gave me a trophy which I appreciate, and they also told me that Ricky and Johhny had all the gift certificates to give me, which according to Wilsons was alot of stuff. Wilsons had to leave before the payout was to take palce.

OK here is where it gets good. I am waiting around for "awards ceremony with Tom(2nd place A class) and Rob Usnick(2nd place C class and rock crawl winner)". The past 2 years the awards ceremony was always Sunday which I have attended both. Well the mud race ends and May Jam is apparently over, so I ask Ricky when the awards ceremony is and he told me they are not having one. Well I tell him we aint been paid or given any prizes. He said Lorenzo has all the info. So best I can tell this is what went down. Lorenzo figured out the payout, which I'm betting was pretty fair with 1st-3rd each getting a little money and some gift certificates, well then Ricky takes this info to Johnny who I can see is not happy with the payout(IN MY OPINION THIS SHIT SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN WORKED OUT). So after Johhny gets done we win $90, yep I got my entry fee back, and 2nd and 3rd got $0. So Ricky ask us how we want to divi up the gift certificates, well guess what, no gift certificates were even printed up, except for a $200 gift certificate good for $200 off an Ox lockeer @ full price, so basically you have to spend $900 to get $200 off. The other gift certificates were to Wilson off road, but they were not on paper, basically a verbal promise. Now there was a big difference between what Wilson said we were getting and what we actually received from Ricky. I'm also betting Wilsons did not know that some off the gift certificates from them did not make it to the racers, I have not had a chance to ask him and get his opinion on the situation, but something tells me he aint gonna be happy. So to recap for winning I got my entry fee back($90) and a gift certificate I have to spend $800 to redeem, 2nd place got $0 money and a verbal promise for a gift certificate, 3rd place got $0 and a verbal promise for a gift certificate

Now look, I realize racing is an expensive hobby and I do it for fun, but this was the most frustrating and unorganized race Ive ever been apart off. If you want to be greedy and keep the entry fees thats fine, but be up front about it and at least have trophies for 1st-3rd and tell us there will be no payout and dont tell us we are getting gift certificates that have not even been printed. And dont make us wait around for 4.5 hours on Sunday to tell us how bad we got screwed. To call this event unorganized would be kind.

Also Rob Usnick went out there and put on a show and got 2nd in C class even after flipping his high dollar rig and winning the rock crawl. You know what he went home with, NOTHING, no money, no trophy....nothing. Those of you that know him, know that he is a stand up guy that always races hard, and for him to leave empty handed was bullshit.

Most of you that know me know that I love to race and rarely bitch about how the races are run..hell I'm just happy to have a place to race....but I just could not keep quiet on this one

 

[RatLabGuy]

Suckage man. Not sure what to say - except that you're a pretty well known racer by now, and probably the best thing you can do now is let it be known you're done w/ that venue, maybe that will 'splain something to Johnny.

 

[kcarroll]

damn

 

[rbo1577186]

Welcome to a motorsport promotion trying to get started. Most all are like this for financial reasons.

Even many established promotions screw whoever they can. The gift certificate prizes and "credits" are similar as the one you mentioned, it's pretty much worthless.

 

[Turtle Mechanic]

Sorry to hear Brad,we figured this would happen,because of last years crap,that's why we didn't show up.....I'm glad cause that would of sucked.
So it appears that.....EDITED before posting.........well it has pretty much been buried
Don't know what to say to this "

Welcome to a motorsport promotion trying to get started. Most all are like this for financial reasons.
Even many established promotions screw whoever they can. The gift certificate prizes and "credits" are similar as the one you mentioned, it's pretty much worthless.

The above comment is BS
they are established, well they were
ECORS is just getting started and they are paying,yes it's a slow learning process but to screw people multiple times,that is uncalled for........
This is my .02 on the deal.
Once again Congrates on winning,again
and sorry you got screwed.

 

[cumminsdzl]

That sucks to hear Brad. We ended up leaving on Saturday after the races were over. I was afraid the payouts were gonna be a bunch of crap when i saw how few people were actually racing.

I was a little suprised when we got there Friday night. The "grudge pull" was going on, and 90% of the people pulling had a beer in their hand, and 95% of the crowd watching did. In my opinion things were starting to get a little too rowdy for an actual "event". If this was just a party in some dudes back yard, then thats fine, but to put your name on an event and then let competitors drink while competing is asking for trouble.

 

[Ricky B]

No Probs, I knew this was coming, I can't thank Brad, Rob, Jason, Tommy, and everyone else that raced enough for coming out and putting on a show for us.

Give me a minute for my response gotta go back through and make sure I don't miss anything, like I said, Brad Is the man, probably my favorite ECORS racer too, cause he ain't skeered to Hold Down The Skinny Pedal

So Hopefully no-one, especially you Brad, will take this as me arguing with you, just gotta make a response as best as possible with what I know.

Anyway if everyone could do me a favor just give me a few min to type up my response, if a ton of yall reply while i'm trying to type it will mess up the response, I want to make sure I address everything.

Thanks

 

[1983Bronco]

No Probs, I knew this was coming, I can't thank Brad, Rob, Jason, Tommy, and everyone else that raced enough for coming out and putting on a show for us.

Give me a minute for my response gotta go back through and make sure I don't miss anything, like I said, Brad Is the man, probably my favorite ECORS racer too, cause he ain't skeered to Hold Down The Skinny Pedal

So Hopefully no-one, especially you Brad, will take this as me arguing with you, just gotta make a response as best as possible with what I know.

Anyway if everyone could do me a favor just give me a few min to type up my response, if a ton of yall reply while i'm trying to type it will mess up the response, I want to make sure I address everything.

No prob Ricky, again I know your heart is in the right place, your doin this because you love the sport, again I'm not mad at you

 

[Bigben75ford]

yep why I didnt show up this year plus didnt feel like paying 35 bucks to camp somewhere for unorganized event again......

 

[RatLabGuy]

yep why I didnt show up this year plus didnt feel like paying 35 bucks to camp somewhere for unorganized event again......

X 2 for me!

they are established, well they were
ECORS is just getting started and they are paying,yes it's a slow learning process but to screw people multiple times,that is uncalled for........

And the critical difference here is, R3 from the get-go admitted and planned on not making any money, and in fact likely being in the hole, for a good long while as part of an established business plan. E.g. looking at the real long-term schitick.

 

[Ricky B]

OK, first off let me start by making the comment that I am a Promoter so to Speak, and Regardless of What I think of anyone, I will not speak badly about a business relationship I have because A - Its Bad Business, and B - From a Personal Moral Standpoint I've been making an effort here lately to not talk bad about anyone in general

Also If you'll notice Every page on my website has a disclaimer on it that basically says I'm just a promoter, I don't handle the monies to an event or the Money handling decisions - It is all the event/land owners deal, although I do what I can to make sure its right If I'm a part of the event at any level because my name is on it.

Regardless here goes, I'll try to break it all down as best as possible.

This thread is probably going to piss some people off but oh well Let me start off by saying that I know Ricky is a good kid

Thanks man, I have mutual respect for you as a racer/person as well as appreciate the efforts you put forth this year trying to talk people into Racing

I went to May jam with high expetations, after all last year I think the high speed race had over 30-35 competitors in all. I was also told that "several" people had signed up and "several" more were gonna sign up at the track.

True, I did kinda dance around the question when people asked me how many had signed up, although I don't think I had ever mentioned more than 10 at any point, If I did I apologize.

But bear in mind It's my Job to make things about any event sound a lot better than they actually are - Its up to me to get people excited about stuff

As far as sign ups at the track I think 3 of the people out of the 7 that said they would come/sign up, didn't show/race.

The main issue IMO with Racer numbers are the fact that the first year there was over 100 racers because of the "brand new" hype and national Mag Coverage promise and the fact that the American Wheeler Sean Dude was just really good at making things sound a lot better then they were.

Second year there was 39 Racers - enough to fill A and B class and half of B class - even without the National Mag Coverage, mainly because at that point everyone was still hyped from the previous year, the second event of anything always carries over the hype of the first

Now high speed races are common place, its nothing new, no hype anymore, because at any given month you can go to a race now, so everyone gets the "oh I'll just go to the next one" mentality. Its unfortunate for anyone who tries to put on events, and stress's us all as event managers/promoters/etc in trying to figure out ways to keep people excited/interested

And that happens in any type of event I do, people get bored with things so quick now a days its retarded, and the lack of $$ that everyone is experiencing with the way times are just makes it even worse.

So here we go, my co driver has to pay $35 to camp and $25 for the "insurance" to ride, whatever we came to race.

Correct Statement, land owners discretion

So drivers meeting is supposed to be @ 7:00 am, started at more like 10:00am.

Correct, we we're delaying for a few racers that had in fact signed up and paid, but had not shown up yet

I already have a bad feeling considering I did not see that many trailers with race rigs. We were told there was 9 competitors in A class and possibly some more coming late. So we go aout and beat the shit out of our jeep so we can make the fast fives the next day. Well turns out there were only 5 total competitors in A class, so basically beat the shit out of my rig for nothing. We could have ran the course in reverse and made it to the finals sunday(top 5). This was frustrating considering we busted a coil spring and our oil pan on the second lap, but still finished.

Also correct, which now that I look back is interesting because I was told there was 9 as well, all though I never checked the papers because its wasn't my job to handle that part and frankly was pretty busy trying to announce the whole event and keep things flowing . . . now i am curious as to where that number came from as well and will ask

I had also registered for B class, apparently I was the only one, so at least they gave me my entry fee back when they cancelled the class.

Correct

We patched our rig up an ended up winning the next day, which was cool.

Def was cool, props for getting it back together and making it happen

So Wilsons off road was sponsoring the whole event, which I'm sure was not cheap, they gave me a trophy which I appreciate, and they also told me that Ricky and Johhny had all the gift certificates to give me, which according to Wilsons was alot of stuff. Wilsons had to leave before the payout was to take palce.

Correct, although I had no idea what the prizes were or the monetary amounts of any sponsors participation until it was time for payouts Sunday.

I specifically stayed out of that side of things and have done so at pretty much every event I've done anywhere this year - I am merely a contracted announcer/advertiser At any event I do - I sell t shirts, advertise, and talk on the mike - thats it

(except for the Feb Mooresville Dragstrip/DPG Benefit Event I did earlier this year, I did handle sponsors and payouts, but never personally took up any of the gate money or had anybody I hired take up any of the gate money - I don't want that freakin pile of nightmare - which sucks because i could easily get screwed by a venue or whoever is taking the money at the gate at any given event, but the problems that come with it are too high for me to take on at this point)

OK here is where it gets good. I am waiting around for "awards ceremony with Tom(2nd place A class) and Rob Usnick(2nd place C class and rock crawl winner)". The past 2 years the awards ceremony was always Sunday which I have attended both. Well the mud race ends and May Jam is apparently over, so I ask Ricky when the awards ceremony is and he told me they are not having one. Well I tell him we aint been paid or given any prizes.

Yea, my fault on that one I had assumed they had already paid out all that while I was announcing the final rounds of the mud race, but in retrospect that was dumb, I can see why Johnny/Lorenzo would have waited on me to do that

He said Lorenzo has all the info.

Correct he, like last year, was in charge of all the racer times/places/etc

So best I can tell this is what went down. Lorenzo figured out the payout, which I'm betting was pretty fair with 1st-3rd each getting a little money and some gift certificates, well then Ricky takes this info to Johnny who I can see is not happy with the payout(IN MY OPINION THIS SHIT SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN WORKED OUT).

OK, Lorenzo and Johnny had done it but had done it different from the way the website stated which was how we did it last year so it had to be redone again - but i mean that was just a clerical error, and then it took me a min to figure it all out cause I seriously can't do math in my head cause i can't hold a thought for more than 2 to 3 seconds, ha and had to sit down and re-figure everything with a calculator

So after Johhny gets done we win $90, yep I got my entry fee back, and 2nd and 3rd got $0. So Ricky ask us how we want to divi up the gift certificates, well guess what, no gift certificates were even printed up, except for a $200 gift certificate good for $200 off an Ox lockeer @ full price, so basically you have to spend $900 to get $200 off. The other gift certificates were to Wilson off road, but they were not on paper, basically a verbal promise.

ok here goes I will explain the break down:

Pro class:
-3 racers - $750 pot
-Johnny pulls out the Gate fee's from the Racing fee (his discretion, he did it last year there just was enough in the classes for it to not matter) - So now your Down to $650 in the Pro class
-The Split last year and this year that has been displayed in the website is 60/40 money to prizes
-So in that case Pro split was $390 cash $260 Prizes
-Now in Mud Racing If there are less than 5 competitors all the purse goes to number one, Johnny choose to follow that rule for this and gave it all to the Winner Thomas White Via Cash, a $400 Chrome Jeep Acc Kit, and a $200 off ox gift Cert
-I felt bad For Rob, i like the guy, and he rolled in spectacular fashion, so I later talked Johnny into giving Rob the last Wilson $300 gift Certificate

Stock Class:
-6 Racers $540 Pot
-Johnny Pulls out his Gate Entry Fee's now your down to $360 pot
-60/40 split $216 cash $144 prizes
-there were over 5 in this class so break it down 3 places . . .
$216 cash over 3 places 1st - $90, 2nd - $70, 3rd - $50
$144 Prizes over 3 places 1st - $75, 2nd - $50, 3rd - 25

OK so the above breakdown is straight from the rules as posted just like it was last year - and frankly that sucks for A class - So to make it to where A class actually gets way more than whats above I gave:

1st his entry fee back in cash, then a $200 off OX certificate, and a $300 BDS-Wilson Cert
2nd a $300 Wilson Cert
3rd a $300 BDS-Wilson Cert

Which IMO is alot better than how it broke down above all three places got more than they would have according to the rules from the last two years

 

[Ricky B]

The other gift certificates were to Wilson off road, but they were not on paper, basically a verbal promise.

Yea, I wish Wilson would'a given us actual coupons or gift certificates, but I'm gonna make some up and sign them and mail them out like i promised, If he doesn't honor them my signature will be on them and I'll make them good one way or another, even though my name wasn't on the event, everyone still associates it to be anyway so I gotta keep my name clear

Now there was a big difference between what Wilson said we were getting and what we actually received from Ricky. I'm also betting Wilsons did not know that some off the gift certificates from them did not make it to the racers, I have not had a chance to ask him and get his opinion on the situation, but something tells me he aint gonna be happy.

This is not cool, I had no idea about this, like I said, I on purpose stayed out of the sponsorship/prizes deal this year and did not know what the prizes were until johnny told me Sunday when it was payout time. Now, everything he told me got given out . . .

So to recap for winning I got my entry fee back($90) and a gift certificate I have to spend $800 to redeem, 2nd place got $0 money and a verbal promise for a gift certificate, 3rd place got $0 and a verbal promise for a gift certificate

A Verbal Promise From Me will stand, like I said even thou my my name isn't on this thing everyone still associates it to be, if Wilson Doesn't hold up to the Gift Cert's I will make sure you get the Money.

Allthou I do wish he'da given us actual certificates to do it with, I'll get some made and signed and mailed out, no probs.

However, in all seriousness, Wilson has stood by all his stuff so far, I have no reason to believe he won't honor his commitment, I have dealt with Shady Vendors b4 and Wilson has never been Shady from the Get Go.

Now look, I realize racing is an expensive hobby and I do it for fun, but this was the most frustrating and unorganized race Ive ever been apart off. If you want to be greedy and keep the entry fees thats fine, but be up front about it and at least have trophies for 1st-3rd and tell us there will be no payout and dont tell us we are getting gift certificates that have not even been printed. And dont make us wait around for 4.5 hours on Sunday to tell us how bad we got screwed. To call this event unorganized would be kind.

Frustrating, yes I can see why you would say that

Unorganized? Well during payout time yea - but In all honesty did the actual race itself seem unorganized? I'd like to know so I can make improvements in future events, seriously let me know, I'd appreciate the feedback.

Trophies has been something Johnny hardly ever does simply because the Mud Racers Came up to us and said they'd rather get paid more then have trophies and he applies a lot of what he does with them to all the Comp's he puts on

Once again I do apologize about the gift certificates, i had no idea on any of it till i went to johnny for the payouts/prizes Sunday afternoon

Also the waiting around I also apologize for, i had to finish up the Mud race though, I can't really walk away from announcing the rest of the event, sorry bout that.

Also Rob Usnick went out there and put on a show and got 2nd in C class even after flipping his high dollar rig and winning the rock crawl. You know what he went home with, NOTHING, no money, no trophy....nothing. Those of you that know him, know that he is a stand up guy that always races hard, and for him to leave empty handed was bullshit.

I agree 100%, thats why I told Johnny I wanted to give him the last Wilson Gift Certificate for A always coming to all his stuff and B "Best of Show"

Wilson Did say he had a Trophy for the Rockcrawl but had already left before I could get it from him, I'm sorry guys i can't really keep track of everything when I'm announcing, and frankly had forgotten about the rockcrawl trophy, thats my fault

Most of you that know me know that I love to race and rarely bitch about how the races are run..hell I'm just happy to have a place to race....but I just could not keep quiet on this one

No probs dude, no hard feelings, Keep hammerin down

Welcome to a motorsport promotion trying to get started. Most all are like this for financial reasons.
Even many established promotions screw whoever they can. The gift certificate prizes and "credits" are similar as the one you mentioned, it's pretty much worthless.

I feel like Wilson Will stand up to his gift certificates

Sorry to hear Brad,we figured this would happen,because of last years crap,that's why we didn't show up.....but to screw people multiple times,that is uncalled for.........

Maybe I don't wanna go there, but who got screwed last year? I thought everyone went home happy (payouts/and prizes wise) last year? Be specific thou on amounts and places, classes, etc, so I can refer back to the info from last year

That sucks to hear Brad. We ended up leaving on Saturday after the races were over. I was afraid the payouts were gonna be a bunch of crap when i saw how few people were actually racing.
I was a little suprised when we got there Friday night. The "grudge pull" was going on, and 90% of the people pulling had a beer in their hand, and 95% of the crowd watching did. In my opinion things were starting to get a little too rowdy for an actual "event". If this was just a party in some dudes back yard, then thats fine, but to put your name on an event and then let competitors drink while competing is asking for trouble.

Well the Grudge Pull wasn't a comp at all, because it was raining we just did a free for all fun pull type deal, ended up being pretty crazy, but I will say that crowd was rough, I've been trying to talk Johnny into hiring security, I think he's finally convinced after Fri and Sat night.

That way someone does something stupid you laugh at them as the police haul them off like we do at Mooresville Dragstrip (have at least 4 on duty every thurs night) then keep on going with the event

 

[snappy]

Ricky, thanks for being a stand up guy on all this. That being said there is a reason that I did not sponsor/race in this event again. You do an awesome job, but the changing of minds and not listening to what racers/sponsors want out of the High Speed stuff is killing the event, not the no press idea.

I said I was done last year after the land owner asked me what was being said in the racers camp, then when I told him what was being said and what I would have liked to see, I was told I was wrong and he turned and walked away. The real kicker was that I gave 10 items for the event, and opnly saw 5-6 given out and t he comment was made..."Do you have one that will fit me?" not cool those were for the racers.

I have great respect for anyone that puts the money up to do something like this, and yes I DO understand what it takes to do something like this. I'm a small bussiness ownwer also and it takes me many 2-3 days a month to cover the cost of what I do.

 

[Tacoma747]

Saw this coming... I gotta say it's not a suprise, I thought about entering C class but figured this would happen. I wouldn't enter even if the said they would "guarantee" payouts, because I doubt it would happen if they didn't have the showing they wanted.

ECORS says they will guarantee payouts, and far as I can tell, they have held up their end of the deal.

 

[chromerunner]

Im only 15mins from the place and didnt go because i knew it would be weak this year...Sucks..really would like to see this place come together..Has tons of growth possible if the right people would listen.

Sorry to hear what happened for all the racers.

 

[cumminsdzl]

Well the Grudge Pull wasn't a comp at all, because it was raining we just did a free for all fun pull type deal, ended up being pretty crazy, but I will say that crowd was rough, I've been trying to talk Johnny into hiring security, I think he's finally convinced after Fri and Sat night.

That way someone does something stupid you laugh at them as the police haul them off like we do at Mooresville Dragstrip (have at least 4 on duty every thurs night) then keep on going with the event

Good enough for me man. Don't think I'm being a complainer or don't like to have a good time, there is just a fine line between having fun and someone getting hurt.

 

[Tacoma747]

Ricky, in my opinion you should NOT make up a gift certificate 'from' wilsons offroad to hand out, that MIGHT get you in some sort of legal deal, and I would rather see Wilson's name trashed for not holding up their promise (IF they don't) of a gift certificate than see you have to pay to make their promise right. I didn't race, but I am sure the racers who are actually supposed to get a gift certificate would agree.

 

[Ricky B]

Saw this coming... I gotta say it's not a suprise, I thought about entering C class but figured this would happen. I wouldn't enter even if the said they would "guarantee" payouts, because I doubt it would happen if they didn't have the showing they wanted.
ECORS says they will guarantee payouts, and far as I can tell, they have held up their end of the deal.

Once again, this was not my event, i am merely a promoter/announcer am not taking side but I will state facts.

Fact - Since I have been there from day one I have never seen Johnny ever back out on any Guaranteed payouts. There has actually been multiple times that he has payed extra money to the mud racers, even thou the rules stated clearly that to get full payouts you have to have "x" number of racers and that number wasn't reached.

Fact - from day one two years ago rules state the payouts for the high speed race are prorated based on number of entrants - it just hasn't been an issue with the number of entrants until this time

Is that the right way to do it - no comment

Should racers get paid more or less and have guaranteed payouts regardless of entrant numbers - no comment

Does the landowner pinch money where he can - no comment

not my place to say what johnny should do with his place

but i will state facts:
fact - he has always paid what he said he would
fact - has paid more than he said he would numerous occasions

fact - all the racers in the high speed race left the race with more than they were promised according to the rules this past weekend

sponsorship prizes and any topic concerning sponsors - no comment

I had no hand in that part of the event and it is not up to me how johnny handles his sponsors

fact - all prizes that i was told were given by sponsors got given away to racers

Will Wilson hold up to his prizes - I don't know, but I believe he will, he has been a standup guy from Day one two years ago




FACT - 4X4CROSS/RICKY B IS NOT THE VENUE PUTTING ON THE EVENT, MERELY A CONTRACTED ANNOUNCER/PROMOTER

please don't confuse the two, and don't expect me to take sides, but I will state facts that probably make me look like I'm taking the venue's side simply because i am in the know much more than the rest of the crowd here

Kinda similar to my relationship with Galloway's and everyone's blatant ignorance of how things actually go on over there.

Sorry I get worked up easy - do I agree with the decisions and choices of the various venues/Co's that I work with go by or decide to do - Absofreakinlutely not



Am I saying anyone in this thread is ignorant - no

am I agreeing with anyone or any venue in this thread - no

do i think High Speed off-Road racing Is Bad Ass and want to keep it growing where ever the venue may be - Ya Dang Straight - Hold it Wide Open and Sky her out over the finish Line or Blow her to Pieces trying

 

[Ricky B]

Ricky, in my opinion you should NOT make up a gift certificate 'from' wilsons offroad to hand out, that MIGHT get you in some sort of legal deal, and I would rather see Wilson's name trashed for not holding up their promise (IF they don't) of a gift certificate than see you have to pay to make their promise right. I didn't race, but I am sure the racers who are actually supposed to get a gift certificate would agree.

Ehhh, i'd actually rather just do it, make sure the racers get paid and my name is clear, and If I gotta show up on Wilson's Doorstep with a 24" Adjustable in my hand and the rest of the 4x4cross 2.5 Ton Mud Racing Team then so be it.

But i really don't see Wilson not holding up on his side of things he's been a stand up guy from point A, seriously, I'd trust him to work on my junk

 

[yield2me]

Here is my take on the deal....

1. Trophy's- for 1st thru 3rd. They dont have to be 8' tall or anything, just like what Keith made are perfect. Using his idea (the ring gear) big for 1st then smaller down to third. Dudes like that shit. And in this sport there is never a shortage of broken parts!!

2. Having Sponsors print out thier own certificates and bring them. Of course, with Wilsons, they had there hands full before the race prepping a number of race cars and setting up the vendor/sponsor booth, plus running a business, so I am sure printing them out were probably pretty low on the priority list!!

3. Tech/Contingency- I still believe this would benefit everyone. All race vehicles line up from west to east along the vendor/sponsor row. As the vehicles pass by, the different sponsors (Direct TV guys, consessions, Dirty left elbow, etc) all have a contingency program..... i.e. run our stickers, and if you win (or 1st-3rd if over 3 in class) they pay a cash amount (100,50, 25 as an example).

Out of industry guys like Direct TV, really capitalize on this.

Desert racers do this, and what this does is put their business name in front of everyone's camera during the entire weekend, plus the videos and everything else.

About where Wilsons was set-up, there would be Lorenzo teching all the cars. If it passes, small 4x4cross sticker, if it fails, go make it right and come back. He could also ensure that Mandatory event stickers are on...(URE Adventures for example).

Make this at a time when alot of Spectators will be there. this is usually the only time that they will really get to see everyones junk up close and clean, and BS with the drivers/crew. Kids can get in and Mom/Dad take thier pictures, and everyone eats it up.

Plus, as they are doing this what do they see??? All the Contingency stickers and this forces people to go to where the Sponosors booths are. Everyone benefits.

4. Be on time!! I understand things come up, but everyone will take it more serious if it is ran serious. 7 a.m. drivers meeting probably isnt a great idea....8 with a race start time of 10 or so.

5. Just curious....If I had a pro-mud truck, what is entry for the cut tire class?? Something like the Wicked Witch of the South. How much to run that truck through the mud?

We had a blast either way. It kinda sucked not coming home with the trophy from the rockcrawl, but luckily I know the guys at Wilsons and they are here in Fayetteville, so no big deal.

Lastly, I am not a promoter, and I know it takes alot of work to put these events on, just giving some input on what I have seen racing out west.

We had a great time and the weather was pretty damn good.

Rob

 

[Ron]

Ricky,
Props for working your tail off, like I know you do. You are a true stand up guy and if you say you will make something right I would hang my hat on that.

For the benefit of everyone who doesn't know you, it needs to be put out here in public you do a great job, have a very good mic game and give tons of yourself to help others often for little or no reward.

Without airing a bunch of laundry, I will simply say when you lie with dogs you pick up fleas. Do not let the actions (or inactions) of others destroy a reputation you have worked to build. It's easy to say "I dont handle that part" (and I *know* that to be true in your case) but if you put your name/brand on it often enough, you suffer the PR hit. In other words you may not have committed the execution, but did you lead lambs to the slaughter?

I saw/experienced a few things that didn't sit real well with me but those will be addressed privately. But to be blunt saying "he takes gate fees out of contestant entry fees" just is total crap.

Without the competitors there is nothing to watch. You dont charge a clown for coming to a circus, without him there is no circus. I have a philosophy in life, pick what you want to be, find someone who is, analyze their actions and follow/tweak accordingly. To that end, do you think Bruton Smith charged Jeff Gordon and his family $65 a head to get in Sunday night? No it is included in the race entry fee.

Certain people would do well to learn that a field no matter how big wont draw a crowd of people to look at the grass.

Again man, props to you. you do a great job and you are a stand up guy...I think this venue hurts you more than helps though. I know the tie, and understand and even admire the gratitude but dont let it get taken too far.

As far as gift certificates, I would not make too big a deal out of who prints them etc. ECORS has printed out certs for Oliver's Driveshaft and Mudpro Metal Works in the past. Ultimately the promoter is responsible for delivering the prize anyway. That's part of knowing your sponsors and selecting them carefully. I do not think anyone will have any issues with Wilson's Offroad though.

 

[Ricky B]

Here is my take on the deal....
1. Trophy's- for 1st thru 3rd. They dont have to be 8' tall or anything, just like what Keith made are perfect. Using his idea (the ring gear) big for 1st then smaller down to third. Dudes like that shit. And in this sport there is never a shortage of broken parts!!
2. Having Sponsors print out thier own certificates and bring them. Of course, with Wilsons, they had there hands full before the race prepping a number of race cars and setting up the vendor/sponsor booth, plus running a business, so I am sure printing them out were probably pretty low on the priority list!!
3. Tech/Contingency- I still believe this would benefit everyone. All race vehicles line up from west to east along the vendor/sponsor row. As the vehicles pass by, the different sponsors (Direct TV guys, consessions, Dirty left elbow, etc) all have a contingency program..... i.e. run our stickers, and if you win (or 1st-3rd if over 3 in class) they pay a cash amount (100,50, 25 as an example).
Out of industry guys like Direct TV, really capitalize on this.
Desert racers do this, and what this does is put their business name in front of everyone's camera during the entire weekend, plus the videos and everything else.
About where Wilsons was set-up, there would be Lorenzo teching all the cars. If it passes, small 4x4cross sticker, if it fails, go make it right and come back. He could also ensure that Mandatory event stickers are on...(URE Adventures for example).
Make this at a time when alot of Spectators will be there. this is usually the only time that they will really get to see everyones junk up close and clean, and BS with the drivers/crew. Kids can get in and Mom/Dad take thier pictures, and everyone eats it up.
Plus, as they are doing this what do they see??? All the Contingency stickers and this forces people to go to where the Sponosors booths are. Everyone benefits.
4. Be on time!! I understand things come up, but everyone will take it more serious if it is ran serious. 7 a.m. drivers meeting probably isnt a great idea....8 with a race start time of 10 or so.
5. Just curious....If I had a pro-mud truck, what is entry for the cut tire class?? Something like the Wicked Witch of the South. How much to run that truck through the mud?
We had a blast either way. It kinda sucked not coming home with the trophy from the rockcrawl, but luckily I know the guys at Wilsons and they are here in Fayetteville, so no big deal.
Lastly, I am not a promoter, and I know it takes alot of work to put these events on, just giving some input on what I have seen racing out west.
We had a great time and the weather was pretty damn good.
Rob

Cool, that was actually a lot of good advice Rob, preciate it man



Pro Cut Tire Class I believe is $75 to enter - $600/200/100 Payout with 5 Truck Minimum

44 Pro is like $60 I think - $400,140,60 Payout with 5 Truck Minimum

He's been having issues with them too, can't get enough to show up this year to get a full purse, we had a full pro class last year but half the trucks are broke this season and cause of the way the economy is can't afford to put em back together

 

[yield2me]

I know there is ALOT more to pulling these things off than most of us know (myself included), just wanted to throw those ideas out there.

You do an awesome job and believe me, your hard work is appreciated!!

Rob

 

[BRUISER]

So the gist is they are focused on mud racers not anyone else correct?

 

[Turtle Mechanic]

Ricky your right,I won't bring it up,it didn't involve you (as we discussed last year on sunday when you were cleaning up)
Ron well put
and as for trophies
They don't cost very much you can get a local shop to make them for $25 for three of them....are they pretty and cool? hell yeah just ask Brad.........he has two of the ones i presented at my events.
Until you have a seperate trophy room on your house....trophys are cool
And charging racers to "enter" the facility after paying entree fee,hauling there junk up to the event and pouring countless $$$ into a weekend,the "enter" fee is just a slap in the face
This is not towards you-->you had nothing to do with that