Uwharrie 4x4Cross Questions & Answers - Old Thread

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Please dont get me wrong here, these are all legitament questions. Folks have every right to ask them. All I ask, is that when this event takes place and is a success, I would love to see this kind of energy focused on promoting this event Next Year!

Any doubters this year, hopefully will focus all that energy into next years promotion of the same event.................Yeah, that sounds fair.
 
"Sorry man I thought I had answered that already I guess I wasn't clear enough, the is no driving on rky mtn loop. You can drive up to rky mtn loop from other trails or acess it from where it overlaps the actual roads but no driving on rky mtn loop during the race. Once you're at the loop depending on where you want to watch you'll have to walk along the trail."

Might want to run this by the park people. I was told that she said in no uncertain terms, there will be no closing of any trails for this event or any other.
 
Dylan W. said:
Please dont get me wrong here, these are all legitament questions. Folks have every right to ask them. All I ask, is that when this event takes place and is a success, I would love to see this kind of energy focused on promoting this event Next Year!
Any doubters this year, hopefully will focus all that energy into next years promotion of the same event.................Yeah, that sounds fair.
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x2, the questions are strait its just the constant "I don't think this is gonna work" vibe is getting annoying, lol, but yea this thread is for questions/concerns so keep em coming

Plus it seems like the fact that I'm only 22 is making people take what I'm saying as if it doesn't matter which is also kinda annoying. :lol:

upnover said:
"Sorry man I thought I had answered that already I guess I wasn't clear enough, the is no driving on rky mtn loop. You can drive up to rky mtn loop from other trails or acess it from where it overlaps the actual roads but no driving on rky mtn loop during the race. Once you're at the loop depending on where you want to watch you'll have to walk along the trail."
Might want to run this by the park people. I was told that she said in no uncertain terms, there will be no closing of any trails for this event or any other.
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They told us that they will actually be helping us with this, technically no the trail is not closed, but the rangers and our volunteers will be standing guard at the entrances telling people that there is a race going on and that if they go on the trail they will probably get run over and if they do its there fault. Hopefully that will deter most people that have any common sense, if not then they'll get run over and probably sued for whatever damage they cause to the racers vehicle :shaking:
 
Actually Chip, you are right. Noone can tell any other tax payer they ''Can't use Rocky Mt. Loop.'' However, The words '' we can recomend avoiding this trail during race hours'' did come up in my conversation with Debera. In hopes that the word ''recomend'' will be strong enough.
It is also hoped that anyone ,knowing a race vehicle is coming through, would not willingly want to ride the trail. I mean..think about it this way...Who wants to be ''that guy?''
 
OK guys its like this IT all sounds good and the " he said" "she Said" Just like closing trails and the LLC and NPO.
There are some of us on here that are a little older and we do stuff by the books and need to see stuff on paper. So we start making calls or checking about stuff like the trails closing and the LLC and NPO and find that what we are and were being told were not so..... Maybe if one person will make a handout like I told Sean when I was going to put money into this thing to start, and get all your ducks in a row and have all the info in a package with all your permits, and info needed, Insurance, prices and fees. then you can hand it out to all those that sign up to race or work, and those that just want the info, can pay a small fee to get a copy of it. BUt the info and a hard copy is out there. AS it is it would sound like he is going to all you guys to do his work on here and telling you what he wants and thats it, never giving you the full story, so you can never tell us the full story. What are you getting paid for the time you have been working on it so far and how much will you be getting paid when the race happens? You sure are putting a lot of time into it for someone else making money off of it. Every post he has ever made was that it was being set up to make money, and for profit, if I remember.... Thats the reason for the LLC. But he wants everyone to come down and work for free?
Why not put this stuff out in the open, what you got to hide??
 
I will go out on a limb and voice my opinion. From the start of all the talk, I have to say I am against it. Not against the race, or against anyone who wants to race. I am against this being held in a national park. If it is to be, I think a place like the Mid Devils Playground is perfect. They had one Rock Race, and tried for another with not enough interest.
Knowing the trails at URE as I do, rode several times, but I don't know them as well as others. But to handle the crowds that will want to watch something like this will be next to impossible IMO.
Even the local, and national race events have barriers to keep people out of harms way. Most times these work, and sometimes they don't. A barrier IMO has to be able to basically be constructed to keep people from being able to cross easily, not just a piece of unrolled "do not cross" tape.
This is a race, and knowing some of the folks entered, I know they will be going all out. Which opens the door to parts flying, and or over shoots and with the trail lined with people, I for see the people being the barrier.Not a pretty sight.
Anyway you look at it this is Commercialized and this is NOT what the National Parks were designed for.
Another thought I have had is the trails and the repercussions of using them like this. If people are held back to what the promoter thinks is a safe distance, and by people I am talking about people on foot, in four wheel drives, motorcycles and four wheelers, I see them doing the very thing that we have so often tried to discourage on here, and that is driving off trail. Not to mention that at any event related or not that I have been to, there will be a lot of "stuff" trash and the like, littering the trails.
 
They told us that they will actually be helping us with this, technically no the trail is not closed, but the rangers and our volunteers will be standing guard at the entrances telling people that there is a race going on and that if they go on the trail they will probably get run over and if they do its there fault. Hopefully that will deter most people that have any common sense, if not then they'll get run over and probably sued for whatever damage they cause to the racers vehicle :shaking:
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Sorry, I don't see where another vehicle(trail rider) could possibly be held accountable for "getting run over" or being sued for damage. I am by no means a lawyer, but I see it in the oppisite.
 
95% of the "issues" being brought up are dealing with the logistics of the event, shouldn't be a problem or concern for anyone except the promoter. Its his responsibility to worry about how everything will take place, no one elses. If you don't feel comfortable with entering, volunteering, spectating because of what potentially could or couldn't happen, then don't go. Simple really.

I'm sure all of these "issues" have been dealt with by the promoter. Do you also question every aspect of how the event will be run if you go to a motocross event, Nascar race, monster truck rally? No, cause its not your problem.
 
You are right about one thing, I won't go. But to say it's no one elses concern except the promoter is absurd. Tell that to someone who gets hurt from a run away racer.
I am not "sure" that these issues have been "dealt" with, that's why I bring up the point, and ask the questions.
And to also answer, no, I don't question things like motocross, nascar, and Monster truck rally's, because they are held in a place to handle the event, specifically designed for the event, and for safety. Often they are upgraded when the design is flawed.
And if I am there, then yes, it could very well be my problem.
 
upnover said:
Sorry, I don't see where another vehicle(trail rider) could possibly be held accountable for "getting run over" or being sued for damage. I am by no means a lawyer, but I see it in the oppisite.
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I was kidding about the sued part, I should have put the little "lol" thing, buuut, if your informed there's a race going on and that you shouldn't go on the trail any further action you take that results in personal injury would be considered negligence.
 
Chip does have a point, where are you going to fit all those people? plus how many are really going to want to walk from one part of the trail to another. Also.... you can keep four wheelers off the trail by stopping them before they get to the trail, but what about people already there? They see 6-8 rigs, they think they want to go see what is happening at camp.... the last thing you need is one of those bystanders walking ON the trail to get around a corner and a Rig hit's them.

Also the bathrooms will be a problem. First off peeing in the woods is not my cup of tea, and doing it with about 50 people through the bushes is not going to be all that fun (even for kids!!!) What if one of the guys has a call of nature? I personally don't want to be down wind from it
 
MR. GADGET said:
OK guys its like this IT all sounds good and the " he said" "she Said" Just like closing trails and the LLC and NPO. . . . .

Maybe if one person will make a handout like I told Sean when I was going to put money into this thing to start, and get all your ducks in a row and have all the info in a package with all your permits, and info needed, Insurance, prices and fees. . . ..

What are you getting paid for the time you have been working on it so far and how much will you be getting paid when the race happens? You sure are putting a lot of time into it for someone else making money off of it. Every post he has ever made was that it was being set up to make money, and for profit, if I remember.... Thats the reason for the LLC. But he wants everyone to come down and work for free?
Why not put this stuff out in the open, what you got to hide??
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Well the insurance stuff were finding out for you so hang on and we'll get that,

Permits? I don't see how that should be any concern to an unrelated third party?

Prices and Fees are on the website

I can understand your concern about insurance, but the permits???

As far as getting paid we're all doing it for our own reasons, but mainly because we want to see our sport succeed and are willing to help out to get it there.
 
purpleTJchick said:
Chip does have a point, where are you going to fit all those people? plus how many are really going to want to walk from one part of the trail to another. Also.... you can keep four wheelers off the trail by stopping them before they get to the trail, but what about people already there? They see 6-8 rigs, they think they want to go see what is happening at camp.... the last thing you need is one of those bystanders walking ON the trail to get around a corner and a Rig hit's them.
Also the bathrooms will be a problem. First off peeing in the woods is not my cup of tea, and doing it with about 50 people through the bushes is not going to be all that fun (even for kids!!!) What if one of the guys has a call of nature? I personally don't want to be down wind from it
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There will be porta poties, there will be designated and monitored "crosswalks" for people to cross the trail, as far as the number of people they can just stand along the trails.

Like I said before cleanup is going to be part of what we're doing after the race, we're not going to leave it, and also ANY environmental concerns should be directed to the Rangers, but trust me we are not going to just trash the palce and leave
 
upnover said:
You are right about one thing, I won't go. But to say it's no one elses concern except the promoter is absurd. Tell that to someone who gets hurt from a run away racer.
I am not "sure" that these issues have been "dealt" with, that's why I bring up the point, and ask the questions.
And to also answer, no, I don't question things like motocross, nascar, and Monster truck rally's, because they are held in a place to handle the event, specifically designed for the event, and for safety. Often they are upgraded when the design is flawed.
And if I am there, then yes, it could very well be my problem.
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I hate to hear that Chip, it should be a very fun event, we're not out to "use and abuse" the trails and leave.

But, I have to take the view of tw89yj, this is all the problems the race coordinator has to deal with, and safety is a big issue that will be accounted for but at the same time, all the small details are really up to him to work out. If someone gets hurt, its on him to have to deal with. But we are going to do everything we can to keep it safe.
 
jrraw23 said:
I hate to hear that Chip, it should be a very fun event, we're not out to "use and abuse" the trails and leave.
But, I have to take the view of tw89yj, this is all the problems the race coordinator has to deal with, and safety is a big issue that will be accounted for but at the same time, all the small details are really up to him to work out. If someone gets hurt, its on him to have to deal with. But we are going to do everything we can to keep it safe.
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Question How are you and all the other helper bees and the promoter and other coordinatorers going to run the race and do all this stuff, keep up with it all keep it all safe.......
If you all are going to run in the races all three days....????
 
My biggest fear with this, is BECAUSE it is at Uwharrie.
Someone does something stupid, they take their 4 wheeler out and get run over.
Suddenly everyone is getting sued, including the forest service for allowing this.
Next thing I know, UNF is closed for all motorized vehicles.
Not cool, and that would make me NOT happy.
 
jrraw23 said:
Well the insurance stuff were finding out for you so hang on and we'll get that,

Permits? I don't see how that should be any concern to an unrelated third party?

Prices and Fees are on the website

I can understand your concern about insurance, but the permits???

As far as getting paid we're all doing it for our own reasons, but mainly because we want to see our sport succeed and are willing to help out to get it there.
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OK I see you have never done anything big like this before.
You will have a permit from the Park Like he said he has plus
http://www.wakegov.com/businesses/startingabusiness/stateinformation.htm
http://www.wakegov.com/businesses/startingabusiness/municipal.htm
and maybe permits from the county for a group of people over 50 people. If food is going to be sold he will need to have permits from the health department and gradeing for all the places doing the food and they should have a food service license and permits to do so for a large group of people.
That is just a few.
And if he did not see a need to get the LLC I would bet he did not see a need to get his business licenses or business permit or hell I bet a Federal Tax ID or the State Tax ID number :rolleyes: ....... and you need a sales tax number.....
http://www.gov-tax.com/
 
MR. GADGET said:
Question How are you and all the other helper bees and the promoter and other coordinatorers going to run the race and do all this stuff, keep up wiiht it all keep it all safe.......
If you all are going to run in the races all three days....????
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We realize this is gonna be hard to pull off, but we are going to do it. All the helper bees will do just fine.

Unless we scrap the entire idea because we could'nt get the entire business model ,in writing, to each and every web-wheeler, guest, and possible participant.
Maybe we scrap the event cause a tree might get hit, or someone might decide to run out in front of a racer, or trash could get left behind.These are all very good reasons Not to run the event.Maybe we should forget the whole idea, cause someone bust a oil pan and leak a bit.Oh yeah, lets not forget, someone might sue a trained volunteer fireman cause he pulled someone from a fire. He volunteers at home, so lets break his/her spirit of helping, by telling them we might sue, simply because we can. As far as folks riding bikes and trucks beside the trail during the race, That is never smiled upon, so it should be no different at race time. As far as folks walking beside the trails and doing damage...Come on Chip..walking damage? Really?Walking Damage? What do you folks do on an ordinary trailride when ''you gotta go''? If you think there may be a problem then dont get to far from one of the porta johns that will be rented(from local business).
 
MR. GADGET said:
OK I see you have never done anything big like this before.
You will have a permit from the Park Like he said he has plus
http://www.wakegov.com/businesses/startingabusiness/stateinformation.htm
http://www.wakegov.com/businesses/startingabusiness/municipal.htm
and maybe permits from the county for a group of people over 50 people. If food is going to be sold he will need to have permits from the health department and gradeing for all the places doing the food and they should have a food service license and permits to do so for a large group of people.
That is just a few.
And if he did not see a need to get the LLC I would bet he did not see a need to get his business licenses or business permit or hell I bet a Federal Tax ID or the State Tax ID number :rolleyes: ....... and you need a sales tax number.....
http://www.gov-tax.com/
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I realize there are multiple permits he needs, but if you'll look back to what I posted I said I don't see how a unrelated third party such as yourself needs to see his permits . . .

hscrugby said:
My biggest fear with this, is BECAUSE it is at Uwharrie.
Someone does something stupid, they take their 4 wheeler out and get run over.
Suddenly everyone is getting sued, including the forest service for allowing this.
Next thing I know, UNF is closed for all motorized vehicles.
Not cool, and that would make me NOT happy.
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That is a very big concern, and we're gonna be doing everything we can to avoid that situation, but the rangers are on board with all this, we're getting insurance, going to have people stationed to keep things safe, and have ambulance team on staff.

MR. GADGET said:
Question How are you and all the other helper bees and the promoter and other coordinatorers going to run the race and do all this stuff, keep up with it all keep it all safe.......
If you all are going to run in the races all three days....????
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I'm sure that were not smart enough to be able to have someone else do there job while there busy for a few minutes :shaking:
 
Dylan W. said:
We realize this is gonna be hard to pull off, but we are going to do it. All the helper bees will do just fine.
Unless we scrap the entire idea because we could'nt get the entire business model ,in writing, to each and every web-wheeler, guest, and possible participant.
Maybe we scrap the event cause a tree might get hit, or someone might decide to run out in front of a racer, or trash could get left behind.These are all very good reasons Not to run the event.Maybe we should forget the whole idea, cause someone bust a oil pan and leak a bit.Oh yeah, lets not forget, someone might sue a trained volunteer fireman cause he pulled someone from a fire. He volunteers at home, so lets break his/her spirit of helping, by telling them we might sue, simply because we can. As far as folks riding bikes and trucks beside the trail during the race, That is never smiled upon, so it should be no different at race time. As far as folks walking beside the trails and doing damage...Come on Chip..walking damage? Really?Walking Damage? What do you folks do on an ordinary trailride when ''you gotta go''? If you think there may be a problem then dont get to far from one of the porta johns that will be rented(from local business).
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Thank you, well put
 
jrraw23 said:
Permits? I don't see how that should be any concern to an unrelated third party?[/B]
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You know what, Don't take this the wrong way, I have a smile on my face....
We should not, We should not give a rats ass and keep quite, then in the last few days you find out you don't have what it takes to put it on and all of us that have done stuff and know a little about what we are talking about could sit back and say :fuck-you: . But we are letting you know some stuff up front so that you can fix it and maybe make some changes to pull it off. if you don't want help and don't want to pull it off say so.....

I will tell you one thing up front. If the group keeps saying one thing then another...... Like Closing a trail and not, then you will get run over if you go on it. Thats BS... I starting not to like it at URE.
You could find 25-30 like upnover and me and others playing all day and camping on the trail, and you could not get me to move.... So it would be nice if you change you words a little please....
 
MR. GADGET said:
You know what, Don't take this the wrong way, I have a smile on my face....
We should not, We should not give a rats ass and keep quite, then in the last few days you find out you don't have what it takes to put it on and all of us that have done stuff and know a little about what we are talking about could sit back and say :fuck-you: . But we are letting you know some stuff up front so that you can fix it and maybe make some changes to pull it off. if you don't want help and don't want to pull it off say so.....
I will tell you one thing up front. If the group keeps saying one thing then another...... Like Closing a trail and not, then you will get run over if you go on it. Thats BS... I starting not to like it at URE.
You could find 25-30 like upnover and me and others playing all day and camping on the trail, and you could not get me to move.... So it would be nice if you change you words a little please....
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Maybe I took it wrong but from what you were saying it hasn't sounded like you were trying to offer help but rather act as some type of policing agency. From what I've seen you post not just on this thread but on the board in general from the past it always seems like your trying to find and persecute people for things they have done wrong, maybe those aren't your intentions, but it sure looks like that and I for one don't think many people like it.

You say I goof around, act like an idiot on the board, etc

We'll I say you act like an overbearing jerk who has nothing else to do but try and call people out for mistakes they've made.

Like I said maybe neither of us intend to come across that way, maybe were really trying to convey different things, but its how it has happened.

You can see why I am hesitant to think you're trying to "help"


So I said the trail was gonna be closed, whoops Im sorry shouldnt have, notice how I quickly came back with the fix'd post right after.

Sorry I make mistakes sometimes, apparently thats not allowed . . . .
 
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