"Gonna do it right...maybe!!??" Fuller's new XJ build!!!

marty79 said:
shows the axle side heim on drag link and it moves a lot so I guess I need to take that slop out??
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What do you mean "slop"? Aren't those brands new heims?
 
Is that rod end crooked/cocked in the tube? Shouldn't be any slop in brand new joints, could be play in the threads if you don't have the jamb nuts tight, and there shouldn't be any slop in the bolt hole for the rod end. Slop could be the tie rod bending due to all the leverage that tower puts on it.
 
Leaf springs will bind with a track bar yes.

However if you want good steering, a track bar will help with leafs.

Otherwise when you get the front bound up and try to steer, instead of pushing the tire to turn, it just pushes the chassis over and flexes the leafs.

I currently have no track bar, and experience this. It only happens in the worst possible spots, as they are the hardest, and are the least opportune moments.

This is my real world experience wheeling with front leafs, and trying to follow buggies around on hardcore trails. I also have plates and can drive on the street. The chassis can move 2-3 inches laterally when the tire is bound and go to steer. Not only does it push the chassis and flex the leaves laterally but also tries to jack the suspension. The hydro assist ram wins the battle and uses the drag link as a lever.

I've got custom XJ leaf packs up front with a double main leaf, using GM leafs. I also installed the leaf packs with 3/4 inch taper to make them bind to keep from needing a track bar.

Yes I get by without it. It cycles 10-12 inches of travel in the front.

No it's not the best, and I'm sharing what I have found.

Much easier to fix it now.

Build a track bar that is the same length as the drag link, and make it parallel.

You want the chassis mount on same side as steering box, and axle mount on same side that drag link attaches to steering arm.
 
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The bo
shawn said:
What do you mean "slop"? Aren't those brands new heims?
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I mean the play/motion that the heim joints allow..it seems that the drag link axle side shouldn't have all that flex in it so was thinking take out the misalignment spacers so it can only move drag link up and down with flex but not allow it side to side movement..hope I made sense now sorry
 
Jody Treadway said:
Or just install a high steer arm like we've told you for weeks now.
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Ok so I know u won't believe me BUT high steer arm will not clear the leafs so drag link would still be some weird contraption. I've looked into it..measured and studied it..it would sit way below leafs unless I used like a 2"+riser/spacer..even thought to drill it and bolt/weld factory one on pass side but same thing, too low. A high steer arm would have to turn up a good bit.
 
You sure did complicate the shit out of that front suspension. Seems that a stock radius arm setup would have been easier than that
 
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marty79 said:
The bo

I mean the play/motion that the heim joints allow..it seems that the drag link axle side shouldn't have all that flex in it so was thinking take out the misalignment spacers so it can only move drag link up and down with flex but not allow it side to side movement..hope I made sense now sorry
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That does not make sense. If the heim can move side to side, the holes in the arm are too big, and/or the bolt isn't tight enough, or you damaged the heim (maybe cooked or knocked the nylons out of them).
 
shawn said:
That does not make sense. If the heim can move side to side, the holes in the arm are too big, and/or the bolt isn't tight enough, or you damaged the heim (maybe cooked or knocked the nylons out of them).
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Or melted out during welding.
 
shawn said:
That does not make sense. If the heim can move side to side, the holes in the arm are too big, and/or the bolt isn't tight enough, or you damaged the heim (maybe cooked or knocked the nylons out of them).
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No no..I'm sorry, I mean the side to side movement that the heim joint allows for flex like its supposed to. Heim is fine, bolt is tight no play in the steering anywhere. But because the heim can flex up and down and flex side to side it seems the side to side flex should be taken away?..I hope that makes sense
 
1stgenxxx said:
You sure did complicate the shit out of that front suspension. Seems that a stick radius arm setup would have been easier than that
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As soon as I find 8" coil springs (get $ to buy em) I'm going 4link and be done with this nonsense lol..I tried but oh well.
Once we move and settle in, ill hope to get some coil springs and redo the whole front, which the D60 down the rd will be 4link anyways..getting a coil bucket on pass side will be little tricky
 
marty79 said:
No no..I'm sorry, I mean the side to side movement that the heim joint allows for flex like its supposed to. Heim is fine, bolt is tight no play in the steering anywhere. But because the heim can flex up and down and flex side to side it seems the side to side flex should be taken away?..I hope that makes sense
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That just means the steering is designed poorly. All links and joints should be laid out so that the forces only act in the manner for which they are designed.
 
marty79 said:
no play in the steering anywhere. But because the heim can flex up and down and flex side to side it seems the side to side flex should be taken away?..I hope that makes sense
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There's no "play", but the joint is "flexing" up and down and side to side. There's also a big dead spot in the steering.

And you're going to fix it by building a 4-link, because leaf springs were too complicated.

Makes all the sense in the world. :flipoff2:
 
marty79 said:
As soon as I find 8" coil springs (get $ to buy em) I'm going 4link and be done with this nonsense lol..I tried but oh well.
Once we move and settle in, ill hope to get some coil springs and redo the whole front, which the D60 down the rd will be 4link anyways..getting a coil bucket on pass side will be little tricky
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Or maybe just fucking save for a Dana 60 and only fuck with the suspension once and be done. It's cheaper that way, just ask all the guys who are now on tons that used to have a Dana 44.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
 
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I actually found my problem..I think. No test drive yet but I found one of the bolt clamps on the adjusting collar of drag link loose..the one closer to Pittman is tight but other side isn't so I turned drag link by hand and sure enough it continues to turn each way more after heim maxes out..stupid!! Will test tomorrow but I'm pretty sure that would have to be it
 
Chris_Keziah said:
Or maybe just fucking save for a Dana 60 and only fuck with the suspension once and be done. It's cheaper that way, just ask all the guys who ate now on tons that used to have a Dana 44.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
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BUT...BUT..lol I've come this far,, this d44 will get used at least once and before its all over it will get fully abused to its limit before it gets removed..I mean its pretty close. Jeep is ready once I "tweak" the steering and track bar properly or little bit better lol..
 
Chris_Keziah said:
Or maybe just fucking save for a Dana 60 and only fuck with the suspension once and be done. It's cheaper that way, just ask all the guys who ate now on tons that used to have a Dana 44.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
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What about the guys that used to have Dana 60s, but now have Dana 44s?
 
shawn said:
And you're going to fix it by building a 4-link, because leaf springs were too complicated.

Makes all the sense in the world
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Haha but with no leafs in the way I can at least have proper steering geometry even without high steer arms
 
marty79 said:
Haha but with no leafs in the way I can at least have proper steering geometry even without high steer arms
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The extreme flexibility of a good 4 link will cause a whole new set of steering geometry problems. I'll bet most of the guys running 4 link use hydro steering to eliminate this problem.
 
GotWood said:
The extreme flexibility of a good 4 link will cause a whole new set of steering geometry problems. I'll bet most of the guys running 4 link use hydro steering to eliminate this problem.
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Yeah but I'm used to that ...my yellow one steered flawlessly
 
marty79 said:
Haha but with no leafs in the way I can at least have proper steering geometry even without high steer arms
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Still going to have a severely angled drag link, with all that tremendous lift.

Still going to need a proper panhard with links and drag link.

Or triangulated 4 link that will have tons of bump steer with a drag link. Back to your current situation.

We cannot reiterate the importance of quality steering even on a trail only rig.

Well built rigs have broken on trail heads and people have died and been injured due to steering problems.

Steering is no place to half ass. It is that critical and shouldn't be taken lightly.
 
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