90's throw back.....Manche build

:popcorn:
 
ghost said:
Thanks for the info. I'm looking at options for some things on my next rig. So why coilovers up front with air bumps instead of ORI's? With the tight space in an MJ/XJ ORI's seem to be the best answer. Am I wrong on that or are there other reasons for the coilovers? Also are the leaned in and back? Why?
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I'll write up some stuff for ya when I'm not driving...it's not a short reply
ol'Jeeps said:
:popcorn:
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Trouble maker...[emoji90]

Matt
 
ghost said:
Thanks for the info. I'm looking at options for some things on my next rig. So why coilovers up front with air bumps instead of ORI's? With the tight space in an MJ/XJ ORI's seem to be the best answer. Am I wrong on that or are there other reasons for the coilovers? Also are the leaned in and back? Why?
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Easy.
Properly tuned coilovers = badass
Everything else is just a compromise.
 
BUCKEYE PERFORMANCE INC. said:
Easy.
Properly tuned coilovers = badass
Everything else is just a compromise.
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That is the short and sweet version! [emoji481]


I think @ghost is looking for a more meat and potatoes version, that I'd be happy to share; in the pre-text that this will simply be my OPINION, based on my personal experience, and a few years of intense study on suspensions and shocks, in pursuit of the best package that I can build for myself. Your results may vary.

In no way do I wish to start a ORI vs coilover debate; there are dozens of those threads all over the interwebs if anyone wants to peacock and troll.


(It's my thread, I can peacock all I want, damn it....[emoji481] [emoji33] )


Be back shortly, just walked in the door and I have a 4 yr old mini-me that has some serious daddy withdrawal...

Matt


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Let me start by saying, in no way is this a slam on ORI's. I ran them for 4 years, with mostly great success; and in their defense, I had the original ST version without doing the X upgrade- but I did add the external reservoirs.


I was blown away when I finished my buggy. Amazed at the difference a well designed 4 link; ( a fortunate accident at the time-pure luck), and the ori's made, versus my leaf sprung yj. I had no reference base to compare to versus coilovers personally at the time.

As time passed, and I feel I mastered the manipulation of the buggy, and thorough research, I began to understand the shortcomings of my spring choice. I started really paying attention to well designed buggies with coilovers. Biggest observation to me was push-off. Trust me when I say- I tuned the bejesus out of the shocks, trying to bring it to a minimum. Yes I could have sent them off, had the tubes modified, Yada Yada. Coilovers have a nearly unlimited tunability-that I can do at home or at camp; when properly sized and sprung for the weight of the application. After researching I firmly believe that there needs to be two elements in the job of a shock- to support the weight by the use of a spring of some sort-( a steel spring, not air) ; and to dampen the movement of the suspension-( again using steel- valving discs, not tubes that are hard to modify properly without an engineering degree. )


Other things I was uncomfortable with...

- the price; I had over $3500 invested in the end; shocks, dual fill kit, bottle, resi's. Again your results may vary. Had about $3300 invested in my first set of fox coilovers- including bumps, springs, straps, and sway bar, oil, and full shim kit. I feel like I got more for my money with c/o.
- every day I walked in the shop; I dreaded opening the door to see a corner down...I'm ocd ya know. This lead me to never traveling without my bottle and fill kit.
-if you blow an o-ring, your done! without parts. With a coil over, you will always have a spring to hold up the rig, regardless whether the dampening of the shock is compromised. Your weekend can continue....I work too hard, and get to travel so little- I hate a ruined weekend...just ask my ARB- I orphaned that SOB for a spool.

I'm not going to go on about all the attributes of coilovers. That information has been available for years, I'm just giving my experience. But, if I could emphasize any one thing about coilovers; if you're not prepared to go the distance with learning to tune, or having them tuned- you will not fully benefit from your investment....and the same goes with ori's.


Side note -Neither a coilover or ori can replace a poorly designed link suspension. But they can be a band-aid for it.

In retrospect....ori's will be great for 95% of us weekend warrior trail riders. They're simple to install....only need 16 shock tabs. The take up the least amount of real estate, and weight. It doesn't take long to find a pressure that you'll be happy with for 80% of your travel through the rough. They are a marvel of engineering.


But for those of us who are a tinker...always trying to get the most performance possible, whether in budget or not, lol- coilovers are the be all, end all....(then come bypasses...)

I take much pride in building something from scratch, that cranks, drives, crawls, defies gravity, bounces, jumps, does four wheel burnouts, with unique design and grace, and hopefully looks good doing all the above! Coilovers help me do all that... better!

I've missed a lot of points that I thought of while driving, I'm sure they'll come to me. I'm ready to sack out on the couch with mini-me...

I'm grateful for the NC4X4 community, and the entire off road scene; and thrilled that so many are interested in this little 27 year old piece of steel that I'm mutilating....thanks guys.

Matt
 
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Oh, and I despised the stick-tion of the ori's when parked....anyone that has them knows what I'm talking about! Can't stand a crooked rock donkey when parked on level ground.

Always make your fat ass co-driver get out first, so you can shake it back to level at camp....

Matt
 
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O shit now I am a fats ass here I was thinking I was just a hair ape to add to that which church hill in golden mnt is the exact moment he decided to go to coil overs the buggy in front of us hit that hill 2 or 3 times pretty hard and settled down with fine tuned oris the front end still wanted to push off after each try and until your in that position with nothing to catch you for 100 feet or more your balls srinks up and your brain takes over and says no that's what I saw frist hand
 
loose cannon said:
O shit now I am a fats ass here I was thinking I was just a hair ape to add to that which church hill in golden mnt is the exact moment he decided to go to coil overs the buggy in front of us hit that hill 2 or 3 times pretty hard and settled down with fine tuned oris the front end still wanted to push off after each try and until your in that position with nothing to catch you for 100 feet or more your balls srinks up and your brain takes over and says no that's what I saw frist hand
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That was the final straw moment for sure...

....sometimes I'm the fat ass driver......compared to co-driver Carter



......and your still a hairy ape

Matt
 
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mcutler said:
[emoji12] not at all. It's a damn good jeep. Followed my buggy everywhere your old crotchety ass was willing to point it....

Matt
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And still will, Just not as graceful as you most of the time though. It is what it is, but what I can afford. Has brought a lot of fun into wheeling.
 
Thanks for the info. I've seen first hand the ORI's loose pressure. I have not thought about that..... My next xj will have something up front other then coils and shocks I think. Not 100% decided where it's going yet. I've enjoyed this build and the education it's been giving me. I don't get away often either so killing my trip would really piss me off. My current xj is and was a beater and does decent but I'd like this next one to be better.
 
ghost said:
Thanks for the info. I've seen first hand the ORI's loose pressure. I have not thought about that..... My next xj will have something up front other then coils and shocks I think. Not 100% decided where it's going yet. I've enjoyed this build and the education it's been giving me. I don't get away often either so killing my trip would really piss me off. My current xj is and was a beater and does decent but I'd like this next one to be better.
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You would be surprised how much better your coils would be with a good set of tunable shocks!

Matt
 
mcutler said:
You would be surprised how much better your coils would be with a good set of tunable shocks!

Matt
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That might happen. Andy @IronManAndy keeps telling me that........ I'm just a cheap bastard. Rancho 5000's are cheap and when I break one I don't cry....... But my twins graduate this year. So hopefully soon I'll have 2 less dependents...... I divorced the parasite a few years ago and that was the best thing I ever did! I'm rambling now. Thanks again for the info. I really want to see this thing on the trail!
 
New addition to the miller army in the shop...belonged to my late FIL who did body work for 40 years.

Millermatic sidekick 110 welder.

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Some playing around, 1/4 flat, 1/8 corner, 14 gauge butt joint. Will definetly be a valuable tool with sheet metal.

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Good compliment to my millermatic 185, and diversion 165. Same consumables as the 185. Be nice to have this unit near the table, and big welder near the project; save moving agrravations.

Matt
 
Still waiting on that cordless version aren't you.
 
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